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  1. #61
    Really Feeling It! Kevinroc's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DragonPiece View Post
    Ya know, I just realized, if dan is indeed leaving the book, both Bendis and Slott will have left their respective Spider-Man books in the same year. Kinda crazy to think about.
    New creative teams on my Spider-books? It's more likely than you think.

  2. #62
    Loony Scott Taylor's Avatar
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    He'll be remembered fondly as one of the better writers of the character ever. Due to his knowledge of the character's history, his great attention to detail, his storytelling ability, and his obvious fondness for the Len Wein run.

    SSM will be remembered as his Master Stroke, and will eventually be numbered among the greatest Spidey tales of all time.
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  3. #63
    Mighty Member Lukmendes's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Scott Taylor View Post
    He'll be remembered fondly as one of the better writers of the character ever. Due to his knowledge of the character's history, his great attention to detail, his storytelling ability, and his obvious fondness for the Len Wein run.

    SSM will be remembered as his Master Stroke, and will eventually be numbered among the greatest Spidey tales of all time.
    Superior is that kind of story that'll be forever divisive to be fair, won't be as hated as it was initialy, but I doubt it'll be generaly considered a beloved classic.

  4. #64
    Loony Scott Taylor's Avatar
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    There are people who continue to hate Death of Superman and Knightfall, but those stories are considered to be classics.
    Every day is a gift, not a given right.

  5. #65
    Moderator Frontier's Avatar
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    I think Superior will definitely be the most remembered part of Slott's run, for various reasons.

  6. #66
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lukmendes View Post
    Superior is that kind of story that'll be forever divisive to be fair, won't be as hated as it was initialy, but I doubt it'll be generaly considered a beloved classic.
    I kind of disagree. It's got quite a few things going for it longer term.

    People coming to it later will be coming in with quite a bit less baggage than some (e.g. those that bought into the company line about it being a permanent change, those still upset about OMD, people who feel personally antagonized by literally anything Slott does, etc [this should not be read that those people's complaints were without merit; merely that the next generation of readers will not have those biases]) who read it for the first time as it was coming out. Later readers will also not have any of the "there's no Peter on the shelves for over a year" thing that happened in real time. Somewhat related, it's also a story that reads much better in big chunks than in smaller parcels. Read in TPB or HC, the story really progresses pretty rapidly (too rapidly in a couple instances).

    It is, in many ways, the defining story of post-OMD Spider-man storytelling (so far), and so it will have a certain amount of historical cache. It'll be interesting to see what happens post-Slott, but one would guess the most lasting changes of his long run will have happened in SSM (I count Dying Wish as part of SSM): between Peter's defeat, the death of Otto's old body, Peter finishing his PhD, Parker Industries, Anna Maria, and the re-villaining of Black Cat, it'd be hard for *all* of that to get ignored completely as new writers take over. Being consequential to future stories is inevitably a component we, as a group, use to determine which stories are great, and I think SSM has a lot going for it in that direction.

    It's also, as any good replacement story is, an examination of what makes the character that character. Knightfall was about whether Batman and his no-kill policy was outdated (or generally, his having lines when dealing with criminals). Reign of the Supermen was about the various facets of Superman - Steel represented the human-level understanding that came from being raised by the Kents, Eradicator the Kryptonian heritage, Kon-El the alienation of being one of a kind, and Cyborg the raw humanity of him (until it all went sideways, of course). SSM was about (among other things) whether Peter could have it all - could he have a personal life, a career, and be a superhero if he was just a bit more selfish (or less self-conscious) about everything.

    I could be wrong, but I imagine it'll be in the top 20 of the 2025 CBR poll for best Spider-man stories

  7. #67
    Astonishing Member WebLurker's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by bob/.schoonover View Post
    I kind of disagree. It's got quite a few things going for it longer term.

    People coming to it later will be coming in with quite a bit less baggage than some (e.g. those that bought into the company line about it being a permanent change, those still upset about OMD, people who feel personally antagonized by literally anything Slott does, etc [this should not be read that those people's complaints were without merit; merely that the next generation of readers will not have those biases]) who read it for the first time as it was coming out. Later readers will also not have any of the "there's no Peter on the shelves for over a year" thing that happened in real time. Somewhat related, it's also a story that reads much better in big chunks than in smaller parcels. Read in TPB or HC, the story really progresses pretty rapidly (too rapidly in a couple instances).
    That's a fair point. I tried it and found it to be very awful (even putting the baggage of OMD, no Peter, and all that), but I do agree that reading it knowing that it's just a brief side trip rather than the new status quo "forever" (in comic book terms) would does change the perspective. Case in point, I was able to enjoy Miles taking over as Spidey in Ultimate for what it was when they also established that Peter survived his death and went off into the sunset with Mary Jane.
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  8. #68
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    Quote Originally Posted by bob/.schoonover View Post
    It'll be interesting to see what happens post-Slott, but one would guess the most lasting changes of his long run will have happened in SSM (I count Dying Wish as part of SSM): between Peter's defeat, the death of Otto's old body, Peter finishing his PhD, Parker Industries, Anna Maria, and the re-villaining of Black Cat, it'd be hard for *all* of that to get ignored completely as new writers take over.
    Somehow I think Slott might put all the toys back fully mended before he leaves.

    Most of what Superior set up has been more or less discarded or flat out ignored and Slott's not even off the book yet. Anna Maria barely appears anymore, Parker Industries seems destined to be a "let's not speak of this again" footnote, Otto's old form came back for a brief spell in "Clone Conspiracy" before the Spider Ock makeover.

    Granted, fans are still counting the days 'till Felicia's baffling heel turn is undone but with stories like Slott and Costa's Venom Inc showing her as a flirtatious "frenemy" and ally, I imagine it won't be too long before that's undone too. Felicia might also appear in "Go Down Swinging" being targeted by the Red Goblin and will reconnect with Spidey as he rescues her.

  9. #69
    Moderator Frontier's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by bob/.schoonover View Post
    It is, in many ways, the defining story of post-OMD Spider-man storytelling (so far), and so it will have a certain amount of historical cache. It'll be interesting to see what happens post-Slott, but one would guess the most lasting changes of his long run will have happened in SSM (I count Dying Wish as part of SSM): between Peter's defeat, the death of Otto's old body, Peter finishing his PhD, Parker Industries, Anna Maria, and the re-villaining of Black Cat, it'd be hard for *all* of that to get ignored completely as new writers take over. Being consequential to future stories is inevitably a component we, as a group, use to determine which stories are great, and I think SSM has a lot going for it in that direction.
    Well, "Peter" finishing his PhD .

  10. #70
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    Quote Originally Posted by Miles To Go View Post
    Somehow I think Slott might put all the toys back fully mended before he leaves.

    Most of what Superior set up has been more or less discarded or flat out ignored and Slott's not even off the book yet. Anna Maria barely appears anymore, Parker Industries seems destined to be a "let's not speak of this again" footnote, Otto's old form came back for a brief spell in "Clone Conspiracy" before the Spider Ock makeover.

    Granted, fans are still counting the days 'till Felicia's baffling heel turn is undone but with stories like Slott and Costa's Venom Inc showing her as a flirtatious "frenemy" and ally, I imagine it won't be too long before that's undone too. Felicia might also appear in "Go Down Swinging" being targeted by the Red Goblin and will reconnect with Spidey as he rescues her.
    Slott might put most (if not all) of the toys back in the box (except Ock's body, probably), but the fact that he created them means they can always come back. Anna Maria can come back in another book (there's always a need for staff scientists working under Stark, Richards, etc), for example. But yeah, the recent issues lean towards a pretty massive reset of the Spider status back to . . . well, something like ASM 375 (minus the marriage and robot parents), which is a bit unfortunate. Just because Peter failed at running a big tech firm doesn't mean he couldn't have found another good (and interesting) tech job (going back to Horizon, professor at ESU, taking over Banner's science position at SHIELD from Waid's run).

    Quote Originally Posted by Frontier View Post
    Well, "Peter" finishing his PhD .
    Well, yeah. I'm not sure anyone will really dispute his credentials, though.

  11. #71
    World's Greatest Hero blackspidey2099's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by bob/.schoonover View Post
    Slott might put most (if not all) of the toys back in the box (except Ock's body, probably), but the fact that he created them means they can always come back. Anna Maria can come back in another book (there's always a need for staff scientists working under Stark, Richards, etc), for example. But yeah, the recent issues lean towards a pretty massive reset of the Spider status back to . . . well, something like ASM 375 (minus the marriage and robot parents), which is a bit unfortunate. Just because Peter failed at running a big tech firm doesn't mean he couldn't have found another good (and interesting) tech job (going back to Horizon, professor at ESU, taking over Banner's science position at SHIELD from Waid's run).
    Yeah, my favorite part of Slott's run was him remembering that when Stan Lee created the character, Peter was a total supergenius. It will be so sad if writers continue to forget that after Slott leaves. I think Peter taking over a position at SHIELD like Banner did in Indestructible Hulk could have been a great idea with a lot of interesting story potential - certainly moreso than back to the Bugle.

  12. #72
    Moderator Frontier's Avatar
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    Honestly, I think they wayyyyy overplayed the super-science and tech in this run.

    I like a Peter who's smart but I really don't need to see him consistently up there with Reed, Tony, and company or building new tech like he's Batman or Iron Man, but that's me.

  13. #73

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    Quote Originally Posted by blackspidey2099 View Post
    Yeah, my favorite part of Slott's run was him remembering that when Stan Lee created the character, Peter was a total supergenius. It will be so sad if writers continue to forget that after Slott leaves. I think Peter taking over a position at SHIELD like Banner did in Indestructible Hulk could have been a great idea with a lot of interesting story potential - certainly moreso than back to the Bugle.
    Iím going to half agree. I think Peter should stay a genius, but I donít think SHIELD is a good fit for him. Too many bosses and controls over what he could do. Iíd prefer him to be a self-made man, getting by on his genius.

  14. #74
    Moderator Frontier's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SilverWarriorWolf View Post
    I’m going to half agree. I think Peter should stay a genius, but I don’t think SHIELD is a good fit for him. Too many bosses and controls over what he could do. I’d prefer him to be a self-made man, getting by on his genius.
    After Ultimate Spider-Man and Parker Industries I don't think I ever need to see Spidey and SHIELD attached at the hip again .

  15. #75
    Astonishing Member boots's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Frontier View Post
    Honestly, I think they wayyyyy overplayed the super-science and tech in this run.

    I like a Peter who's smart but I really don't need to see him consistently up there with Reed, Tony, and company or building new tech like he's Batman or Iron Man, but that's me.
    that's the balancing act... if you take peter's attributes at face value: funny, super strong, super buff, super athletic, good looking polymath, it's harder to reconcile him as the "every man". throw in the current mainstream acceptance (even celebration) of geek culture and it gets harder still.

    so you need to come up with reasons to constantly put him back in that box. some would be personality based, others systemic. depending on how complex or deep the writing wants to get. orrrr...you just hand-wave it all.
    troo fan or death

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