Wonder Woman 37 - SPOILERS

[Sacred Knight]

If they didn't want to force the story on Rucka, it was actually a good decision. Its not about fitting his ideal vision. They brought him back and gave him a lot of freedom, and tying his hands with a story he didn't want wouldn't yield good results. They also didn't sit on it too long. Serialized comics let plots simmer in the background all the time, especially in between events. Jason wasn't as important as reaffirming the positive attributes of the Amazons and firming up the events in her history.

Some would argue they didn't wait long enough. Looking at the final result, the idea should never have been floated in the first place.

The plot wasn't simmering though, it was completely ignored. Simmering plots points are referenced in some way or another be it subtely or overtly even if a front burner story currently is not about said plot point. That did not happen in Rucka's run, it was as if the revelations never happened, and to me that can't happen. To me this was akin to if DW revealed Superman was dying and then sitting on it for almost a year with no reference at all. It was a bad move. They didn't have to force the entire story on Rucka, but they should have at least demanded it be acknowledged in some form or another. There was every opportunity for him to tell the story he pitched and was hired to tell while at the same time not letting key developments heading into Rebirth be forgotten.

Again though I'm not blaming that on the problems with this run. That was a separate mistake, but a mistake all the same imo.

[Nyssane]

They did reference Jason in the first Rebirth issue, though.

[Midnighter]

I really wish Rucka had written in a teenage Donna on Themyscira during Year One.

How somebody at some point didn't seize upon that as a perfect opportunity to fix Donna once and for all is beyond me. Either Rucka wanted to and he was prevented for whatever reason, he didn't want to and DC didn't force him, or it didn't occur to anybody involved. Despite the fact that New 52 Donna was one of the biggest messes the Lies should have cleaned up after the Amazons.

Co-signed and QFT.

[WonderScott]

Co-signed and QFT.

Seconded - it would have been easy and elegant to retcon Donna as SiegePerilous02 describes.

What were they thinking with that mess of an origin? (Rhetorical question.)

[Sacred Knight]

They did reference Jason in the first Rebirth issue, though.

Well then, I would have to be stood corrected then, I forgot this.

[SiegePerilous02]

The plot wasn't simmering though, it was completely ignored. Simmering plots points are referenced in some way or another be it subtely or overtly even if a front burner story currently is not about said plot point. That did not happen in Rucka's run, it was as if the revelations never happened, and to me that can't happen. To me this was akin to if DW revealed Superman was dying and then sitting on it for almost a year with no reference at all. It was a bad move. They didn't have to force the entire story on Rucka, but they should have at least demanded it be acknowledged in some form or another. There was every opportunity for him to tell the story he pitched and was hired to tell while at the same time not letting key developments heading into Rebirth be forgotten.

Again though I'm not blaming that on the problems with this run. That was a separate mistake, but a mistake all the same imo.

But for all we know, DC themselves may have asked him not to address it beyond the first Rebirth issue. Or were completely fine with him not wanting to. A major criticism of the New 52 Wonder Woman was the male driven narrative surrounding her father and how her mother and Amazon sisters got seriously shafted. Rucka clearly felt that putting them back at the forefront was a priority, along with other women in her life like Etta and Barbara, and maybe Johns and DC were sensible enough to realize that he was probably right before they started shoving Jason down our throats.

Maybe it should have been alluded to more frequently throughout the run, but seeing as how it was a development that a good deal of Wonder Woman fans were either skeptical about or outright disinterested in, I'm not seeing it as any big loss. Now that the story has been presented to us, it was hardly worth the wait. I don't see how a couple hints throughout Rucka's run would have made these issues better. Diana and Steve would still be wallpaper and Jason and Grail would still be flat, and Giganta would still be utterly wasted yet again.

[CRaymond]

One of ya’ll should tweet Rucka and ask his opinions on the character of Donna Troy.

I get the sense that he’s not a fan.

[Stanlos]

You mean that the writers didn't know what to do with her rich, deep, female-centric mythos and origin that was based on her relationship with her mother, her sister Amazons, and the goddesses of Greek myth? So they made something new that they could write about: a Very Powerful Father who is a male god, and a twin brother.

I wonder what it was about those changes that made it more understandable to them.

I think a better solution would have been to hire a better writer (better for the character and her mythos, that is), who understood the themes and symbolism of the character and her origin, and was comfortable working with them.

But that's just me. Or maybe not just me.

Nope, not just you. It seems Crystal clear to me as well.

[Mel Dyer]

You mean that the writers didn't know what to do with her rich, deep, female-centric mythos and origin that was based on her relationship with her mother, her sister Amazons, and the goddesses of Greek myth? So they made something new that they could write about: a Very Powerful Father who is a male god, and a twin brother.

I wonder what it was about those changes that made it more understandable to them.

I think a better solution would have been to hire a better writer (better for the character and her mythos, that is), who understood the themes and symbolism of the character and her origin, and was comfortable working with them...

Maybe, we'll have a better Wonder Woman comic, when writers stop looking for her in the wrong places.

Wonder Woman is first and foremost a sci-fi fantasy adventure magazine heroine. Her rich mythos and origin, based on sci-fi fantasy magazines about exotic people in utopian civilizations, and Wonder Woman's relationship with her mother, her sister Amazons and the goddesses of Greek myth ..are entirely incidental. 'Incidental', here, means that her Greek myth-inspired origin, superhero fantasy elements, and gynocentric mythos (relationships, history, etc) are secondary to what is first and foremost.

Wonder Woman is a closer cousin to Tarzan, Princess Leia, Indiana Jones and Lara Croft, than Perseus or Aragorn...or Superman. Writers seem to be the last to understand this, and the comic's inability to find its real, sustainable audience reflects that.

[Doctor Bifrost]

...Wonder Woman's relationship with her mother, her sister Amazons and the goddesses of Greek myth ..are entirely incidental. 'Incidental', here, means that her Greek myth-inspired origin, superhero fantasy elements, and gynocentric mythos (relationships, history, etc) are secondary to what is first and foremost.

To you, maybe. I do not and can not agree.

Of course, it's by no means impossible to have both: the "sci-fi fantasy adventure magazine" tropes you find so central, and the female-centric origin and mythos. They're kind of orthogonal to each other, and discussions about whether it was a good idea to shift Wonder Woman from a Maternal Narrative to a Paternal Narrative are, I would say, independent of whether she should be fighting Cheetah or Queen Atomia.

[My Two Cents]

In any case Wonder Woman should at the very least be the star in her own book.
and not the in keeper for other characters to visit and take over the whole house.

[jtd]

Wonder Woman has been a terrific book since James Robinson started writing it, in my opinion. Really, really enjoy his writing on this title.

[PyroTwilight]

Wonder Woman has been a terrific book since James Robinson started writing it, in my opinion. Really, really enjoy his writing on this title.

I hope it doesn't come off as snarky but...why? What of this run interested you? I've liked some things he's wrote (like Squadron Supreme) and Earth 2 (brilliant stuff) but this arc felt like an utter dud to me.

[Agent Z]

Maybe, we'll have a better Wonder Woman comic, when writers stop looking for her in the wrong places.

Wonder Woman is first and foremost a sci-fi fantasy adventure magazine heroine. Her rich mythos and origin, based on sci-fi fantasy magazines about exotic people in utopian civilizations, and Wonder Woman's relationship with her mother, her sister Amazons and the goddesses of Greek myth ..are entirely incidental. 'Incidental', here, means that her Greek myth-inspired origin, superhero fantasy elements, and gynocentric mythos (relationships, history, etc) are secondary to what is first and foremost.

Wonder Woman is a closer cousin to Tarzan, Princess Leia, Indiana Jones and Lara Croft, than Perseus or Aragorn...or Superman. Writers seem to be the last to understand this, and the comic's inability to find its real, sustainable audience reflects that.

You know you saying all this about Diana doesn't make it true especially after the WW movie which was nothing like what you described.

[Doctor Bifrost]

You know you saying all this about Diana doesn't make it true especially after the WW movie which was nothing like what you described.

Not just the movie, but the comic for most of its runs. If you look at a list of her villains, going all the way back to the Golden Age, you see Ares/Mars; minions of Ares/Mars; Nazis of various kinds; Earth supervillains; mythological figures like Circe, myth-related figures like Nikos Aegeus; and so on. There are a few leaders, kings, and queens of hidden or non-Earth civilizations, like Atomia and Clea, but they don't predominate at all.

One thing I like about Wonder Woman is that she can play a role in a large number of different kinds of stories: mythological, supernatural, technological threats, more conventional superhero/supervillain stories, war, military/spy intrigue, and so on. Yes, even "pulp standards." (I'll admit that "Wonder Woman in Space" is not my favorite sub-sub-genre.)

I do think she's become overpowered, which limits credible threats against her (and therefore certain kinds of stories), but I think that about a lot of characters. I am not a reader who values characters based on their power level. I completely understand the impulse to say "she should be as powerful as Superman!", but frankly I enjoy her more when she's less powerful than that. (I think Superman is overpowered too, but I'm not going to go down that rabbit hole.)

Here's a question: is Jason, her twin and now some kind of "male counterpart," supposed to be as powerful as Diana? (Jason simply developed his powers as he grew up, based entirely on being the son of Zeus. Diana, if I understand correctly, only gained superpowers when they were granted to her by multiple divine patrons. Which is an interesting discrepancy right there.) Because if he is, then we have another Superman-level hero on DC Earth.