If you could make one small change to the continuity of the MCU

[Da Boat]

That heavy punching sandbag at the start of Avengers is 100 lbs.

Sure. But it's something that at least look human. He is punching normally but the thing happens to be very heavy. But in fight he doesn't look super-human. The way Blonsky was in Hulk is what I thought we would get with Cap. I thought he was some cinematic test-subject.

[AJBopp]

Sure. But it's something that at least look human. He is punching normally but the thing happens to be very heavy. But in fight he doesn't look super-human. The way Blonsky was in Hulk is what I thought we would get with Cap. I thought he was some cinematic test-subject.

He lifted 100 lbs of dead weight with one hand and lightly threw it over his shoulder to carry it away. I can't begin to imagine the weight he would have to be able to bench press in order pull that off.

[DrNewGod]

I don't think he has been that powerful in the movies. Case in point look at the movie Incredible Hulk with Ed Norton. Emil Blonsky takes the super-soldier serum and he becomes an incredible fighter that manages to shoot the Hulk with a gun from multiple angles. That was supposed to be the model for the future Captain America. But he's been far less incredible than that. Case in the point in the Avengers movie he didn't do much. In the comics Cap is closer to Emil Blonsky where he would fight 100 of Hydra agents at the same time.

He curled a friggin' helicopter out of its take-off. That's a notch or two above what Blonsky was showing prior to his transformation.

[Da Boat]

He lifted 100 lbs of dead weight with one hand and lightly threw it over his shoulder to carry it away. I can't begin to imagine the weight he would have to be able to bench press in order pull that off.

What I mean is that it doesn't look impressive. It was super-human cause they said it weighted a lot. But he never showed super-human traits as far as speed and agility.

He curled a friggin' helicopter out of its take-off. That's a notch or two above what Blonsky was showing prior to his transformation.

It's like they pulled one moment, created one scene to make us think that "see Cap is super-human" but he never was for the rest of the movie.

[Anarchist]

Remove the '8 years ago' thing at the start of Spider-Man Homecoming whichs crewed up years of continuity.

[DrNewGod]

What I mean is that it doesn't look impressive. It was super-human cause they said it weighted a lot. But he never showed super-human traits as far as speed and agility.

It's like they pulled one moment, created one scene to make us think that "see Cap is super-human" but he never was for the rest of the movie.

He out-muscles Spider-Man twice, and does so with a Wirework spin. In Bucky's apartment, he handles a jump of 3 or 4 stories like it's stepping off a curb, then tosses a fully laden commando around like a pillow. At the beginning of the film, he kicks a military truck around like it's made of balsa wood, then takes a multistory fall, bouncing off a truck, and treats it like he merely tripped on the carpet. He, BP and WS all outrun cars on foot. That's before we talk about the feats in his other movies (like chasing down the Hyrda assassin's car on foot, and outswimming a submarine right after his transformation).

I don't know what your standard of consistent superhuman strength, speed and agility are, but they must be impressive!

[Carabas]

I don't know what your standard of consistent superhuman strength, speed and agility are, but they must be impressive!

Anything lower than Superman is super, I guess?

[80sbaby]

He out-muscles Spider-Man twice, and does so with a Wirework spin. In Bucky's apartment, he handles a jump of 3 or 4 stories like it's stepping off a curb, then tosses a fully laden commando around like a pillow. At the beginning of the film, he kicks a military truck around like it's made of balsa wood, then takes a multistory fall, bouncing off a truck, and treats it like he merely tripped on the carpet. He, BP and WS all outrun cars on foot. That's before we talk about the feats in his other movies (like chasing down the Hyrda assassin's car on foot, and outswimming a submarine right after his transformation).

I don't know what your standard of consistent superhuman strength, speed and agility are, but they must be impressive!

Right! That's not even getting into his feats in both Avengers movies, either. Cap is CLEARLY superhuman and impressively so. I really don't see how anyone can claim otherwise?

[Comic Book Addict]

Remove the '8 years ago' thing at the start of Spider-Man Homecoming whichs crewed up years of continuity.

Agreed. Don't see why they did that in the first place.

[Midvillian1322]

What I mean is that it doesn't look impressive. It was super-human cause they said it weighted a lot. But he never showed super-human traits as far as speed and agility.



It's like they pulled one moment, created one scene to make us think that "see Cap is super-human" but he never was for the rest of the movie.

Cap threw a motor cycle, in AoU and in Civil war tore apart Crossbones gauntlets with his bare hands and then Exchanged blows with IronMan. Yea the Sheild did alot of Damage but with his hands he was knowing ironman silly. Didnt he also cruss one of Ironmans repulsors?

I get that this cap doesnt have as many over the top feats. But in TWS when he takes out that Quin jet with his Shield while escaping Sheild was a classic Cap movie imo. Id take This version of cap over Emil any day.

Edit: maybe he hit the gauntlets with his sheild i cant recall.

[Carabas]

Doesn't even matter. A regular person, even a really strong one, isn't going to do that kind of damage with that shield.

[Midvillian1322]

Doesn't even matter. A regular person, even a really strong one, isn't going to do that kind of damage with that shield.

I find this whole convo weird since we had the oppsite debate when Luke Cage came out. Everyone said Caps stronger then MCU cage, becauae MCU cap more powerful then comic cap. And yadayada iono when he chucked a motorcycle through the air i was convinced.

[Cyke]

Right! That's not even getting into his feats in both Avengers movies, either. Cap is CLEARLY superhuman and impressively so. I really don't see how anyone can claim otherwise?

Only because the perspective of what defines human vs. superhuman is different between reality, comics, and the movies. If you were dropped from reality into the MCU with all your knowledge, you could tell Cap, Erskine, Fury, whomever that Cap does indeed have superhuman feats, and everyone in the MCU would tell you, "No, that's peak human." That's what the serum was meant for. And the theory within the MCU is that if one trains enough, works out enough, etc, they can match Captain America but just from taking the long way rather than a shortcut (hence why normal humans like Crossbones and Batroc kept itching to go one-on-one with Cap -- there's the competitive streak, but it's only competitive if it's between two humans, not one human and a superhuman).

So part of it too is then whether the audience adopts the real-world definition of superhuman or whether the narrative in the movies adopts that definition. We on this board can argue it's superhuman (and indeed, they really are compared to anything a real-world human can do), but everyone in the MCU treats those feats as slightly more pedestrian, though still impressive in their own right.

[DrNewGod]

Only because the perspective of what defines human vs. superhuman is different between reality, comics, and the movies. If you were dropped from reality into the MCU with all your knowledge, you could tell Cap, Erskine, Fury, whomever that Cap does indeed have superhuman feats, and everyone in the MCU would tell you, "No, that's peak human." That's what the serum was meant for. And the theory within the MCU is that if one trains enough, works out enough, etc, they can match Captain America but just from taking the long way rather than a shortcut (hence why normal humans like Crossbones and Batroc kept itching to go one-on-one with Cap -- there's the competitive streak, but it's only competitive if it's between two humans, not one human and a superhuman).

So part of it too is then whether the audience adopts the real-world definition of superhuman or whether the narrative in the movies adopts that definition. We on this board can argue it's superhuman (and indeed, they really are compared to anything a real-world human can do), but everyone in the MCU treats those feats as slightly more pedestrian, though still impressive in their own right.

I don't usually respond like this, but barring some supporting dialog from the films or statement by the creators confirming this, that is just plain wrong.

Absent something canonical to establish, it we have no reason to assume any separation between the standards of Real World and MCU superhuman. Black Widow does all kinds of butt-whoopin' amazingness, but she never displays superhuman feats of strength. Crossbones was using clearly visible performance enhancers, plus tells Widow "I don't work that way no more" when he ignores her sting, suggesting to me (and I'll admit to supposition here) that his injuries and treatment somehow enhanced him. Other than moments where he accomplished ambush, Batroc was completely out of his depth in the confrontation with Cap; that he was itching for it only meant he had no real idea what he was up against.

The real point that your contention ignores is that in CA:CW, Cap out-muscles Spider-Man in a pure tug'o'war. Unless you mean Spider-Man is also just "peak human" in the MCU, this argument flat does not work.

[DrNewGod]

I find this whole convo weird since we had the oppsite debate when Luke Cage came out. Everyone said Caps stronger then MCU cage, becauae MCU cap more powerful then comic cap. And yadayada iono when he chucked a motorcycle through the air i was convinced.

Y'Know, that would be a superfun One Shot: Cage and Cap badgered into an arm wrestling match by their respective teams.