View Poll Results: Sunspot is the best X-man turned Avenger. Do you agree?

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  • I agree

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  1. #16
    Astonishing Member DurararaFTW's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Wiccan View Post
    Storm was only an avenger for like a second, and Xavier not even on an actual Avengers team, just Illuminati.
    If Sunspot counts as an X-Men, while only appearing in books related to the X-Men and on events and specific mission, then Storm and Professor X counts as Avengers for the same reason. And Sunspot sure counted the Illuminati as Avengers when he was whining at Cap and Hill about their Incursuion troubles.

  2. #17
    Ultimate Member Wiccan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DurararaFTW View Post
    If Sunspot counts as an X-Men, while only appearing in books related to the X-Men and on events and specific mission, then Storm and Professor X counts as Avengers for the same reason. And Sunspot sure counted the Illuminati as Avengers when he was whining at Cap and Hill about their Incursuion troubles.
    My reason for Storm not counting is because she really wasn't an Avenger for long enough to really analyze that. She has absolutely no reason to be considered "best X-Man turned Avenger", because she wasn't really used well on Avengers books, which is what the article is talking about Sunspot, who I'm pretty sure was an actual X-Men once.

  3. #18
    Astonishing Member DurararaFTW's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Wiccan View Post
    My reason for Storm not counting is because she really wasn't an Avenger for long enough to really analyze that. She has absolutely no reason to be considered "best X-Man turned Avenger", because she wasn't really used well on Avengers books, which is what the article is talking about Sunspot, who I'm pretty sure was an actual X-Men once.
    Yeah, again. When Toad, Callisto, Box, Cloak, Dagger and literally anyone and everyone else that wanted to come to San Francisco to be pronounced X-Men, so was Sunspot. He has never had a stint on an X-Men TEAM however, I don't see why New Mutants would count but New Avengers: Iluminati doesn't. So when the article says that where Rogue and Wolverine can't handle choosing but Sunspot is simply both X-Men and Avenger in equal parts I call major BS. Sunspot never has to walk that line. He might be the best Avenger, I personally doubt that as well. But Beast, Rogue, Wolverine or someone else is certainly the best X-Men/Avenger cause it was actually a choice for those characters.

  4. #19
    Astonishing Member DragonsChi's Avatar
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    I do agree that Sunspot becoming an Avenger was the best move for him as a character. The X- Men has just been to over crowed and focued on certain chracters that a lot of members would do better not being stuck at the school.
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  5. #20
    Ultimate Member Wiccan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DurararaFTW View Post
    Yeah, again. When Toad, Callisto, Box, Cloak, Dagger and literally anyone and everyone else that wanted to come to San Francisco to be pronounced X-Men, so was Sunspot. He has never had a stint on an X-Men TEAM however, I don't see why New Mutants would count but New Avengers: Iluminati doesn't. So when the article says that where Rogue and Wolverine can't handle choosing but Sunspot is simply both X-Men and Avenger in equal parts I call major BS. Sunspot never has to walk that line. He might be the best Avenger, I personally doubt that as well. But Beast, Rogue, Wolverine or someone else is certainly the best X-Men/Avenger cause it was actually a choice for those characters.
    You could have just said you disagree because you think Beast, Rogue and Logan were better lol. In that case I disagree about Logan and Beast, but Rogue is either a tie or above Sunspot.

    Honestly at the end of the day all mutants that have been on X-Teams are X-Men characters. With Avengers it's different because any and every character can eventually join, and they were actually created as a crossover/team up team anyway.

  6. #21
    Extraordinary Member Tycon's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DurararaFTW View Post
    Rich sure, Buying an island, buying a world wide organisation and upping the salary of each evil scientist in it to the piint where they have no reason left to stoop to corruption not making a dent in his wallet is a bit much. Despite what the article says, he's portrayed as richer then Tony generally is.

    Again X-Men book. Sunspot has never been featured on any of them. First time Cannonball joined one, that was portrayed as the point he became real X-Men. When Jubilee left the main X-Men books for Gen X, her catchphrase was "When I was an X-Men...". Past tense. Being on Gen X definitely didn't make anyone an X-Men by itself.

    So saying Sunpot is the best X-Men (other then those that haven't had Avenger stints) is very suspect to me.
    Wait. You're jmplying sine he hasn't been a member of a team explicitly called "X-Men" then he isn't a member??? The adult New Mutants team weren't X-Men? When Bobby and Dani were teaching the students in "Young X-Men", they weren't considered X-Men? Like Rictor, Wolfsbane, Dani, and Boom-Boom. They never were on a "main" team but they sure as hell are X-Men.

    As far as riches, I mean he not only inherited his father's multi-billion dollar empire, but has earnings from the Hellfire Club and stocks elsewhere. And there were definitely dents in his wallet, I don't think there was anything to imply otherwise.

  7. #22
    Astonishing Member DurararaFTW's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ţh€ €жţяą-๏яďɨɲąя Tycon View Post
    Wait. You're jmplying sine he hasn't been a member of a team explicitly called "X-Men" then he isn't a member??? The adult New Mutants team weren't X-Men? When Bobby and Dani were teaching the students in "Young X-Men", they weren't considered X-Men? Like Rictor, Wolfsbane, Dani, and Boom-Boom. They never were on a "main" team but they sure as hell are X-Men.
    I'm saying there was a time where it was explicitly treated as such. X-Force wasn't automatically X-Men, not for adult Cannonball. When exactly would you say Sunspot became an X-Men. Roberto has never lived at the Westchester mansion as an adult, not in a teaching position or anything. He's not as connected to the X-Men as others. And after San Fransisco, people like Bling!, Pixie and Armor needed to regraduate to X-Men status. Why does Sunspot get an automatic membership in absentia for life?

    As far as riches, I mean he not only inherited his father's multi-billion dollar empire, but has earnings from the Hellfire Club and stocks elsewhere. And there were definitely dents in his wallet, I don't think there was anything to imply otherwise.
    All I've seen from his Avengers stint is him throwing money around other billionaires can't. Show me these some things being a dangerous financial decision for him, please.

  8. #23
    Extraordinary Member AcesX1X's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ţh€ €жţяą-๏яďɨɲąя Tycon View Post
    Wait. You're jmplying sine he hasn't been a member of a team explicitly called "X-Men" then he isn't a member??? The adult New Mutants team weren't X-Men? When Bobby and Dani were teaching the students in "Young X-Men", they weren't considered X-Men? Like Rictor, Wolfsbane, Dani, and Boom-Boom. They never were on a "main" team but they sure as hell are X-Men.
    officially, cannonball joined the x-men in the 90s, and dani joined part-time in 2000.

    you could definitely argue that sunspot and the rest have all been extensions of the x-men since the mutant massacre, as they have been fighting alongside the x-men for most major milestones since then.

    officially, sunspot and the original new mutants were deputized as an official x-men team when the x-men first migrated to marin base, sf.

    and well before cyclops proclaimed 'all mutants' to be x-men.

    regardless of where you personally put sunspot and co. on the timeline, he is an x-men and has been one for quite some time.

  9. #24
    Extraordinary Member Tycon's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by AcesX1X View Post
    officially, cannonball joined the x-men in the 90s, and dani joined part-time in 2000.

    you could definitely argue that sunspot and the rest have all been extensions of the x-men since the mutant massacre, as they have been fighting alongside the x-men for most major milestones since then.

    officially, sunspot and the original new mutants were deputized as an official x-men team when the x-men first migrated to marin base, sf.

    and well before cyclops proclaimed 'all mutants' to be x-men.

    regardless of where you personally put sunspot and co. on the timeline, he is an x-men and has been one for quite some time.
    Yeah, that's my exact argument.

    Quote Originally Posted by DurararaFTW View Post
    I'm saying there was a time where it was explicitly treated as such. X-Force wasn't automatically X-Men, not for adult Cannonball. When exactly would you say Sunspot became an X-Men. Roberto has never lived at the Westchester mansion as an adult, not in a teaching position or anything. He's not as connected to the X-Men as others. And after San Fransisco, people like Bling!, Pixie and Armor needed to regraduate to X-Men status. Why does Sunspot get an automatic membership in absentia for life?
    The students are X-Men. The New Mutants are X-Men. Everyone on Utopia were X-Men. Just because he isn't on an Alpha squad or a 'main' member doesn't mean he isn't a part of the X-Men. That really isn't a debate. And you don't need to live in the Westchester School to be an X-Men eitehr. These all are made up requisites for a group he's already a part of.

    All I've seen from his Avengers stint is him throwing money around other billionaires can't. Show me these some things being a dangerous financial decision for him, please.
    Throwing money around? The only things he's done with that is buy AIM and send the rest of the money to help fund the organizations. I think you're making lots of assumptions. First, is there anything that contradicts Tony or Karma or Emma doing the same thing Bobby is currently doing? And Bobby didn't really but an island, he used a vacant island and retrofitted it. The base in the Savage Land wasn't bought either.

    And dangerous financial decision? He's broke now lol.

  10. #25
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    for me, in order from the best to the least best

    Wolverine
    Rogue
    Beast
    Storm

  11. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by Wiccan View Post
    Storm was only an avenger for like a second, and Xavier not even on an actual Avengers team, just Illuminati.
    But her membership was very thrilling, the moment we knew Storm was going to be an Avenger. It was like wow! Storm has joined the Avengers.

    Unlike the others, their membership wasn't exciting.
    Last edited by RLAAMJR.; 12-31-2017 at 09:35 AM.

  12. #27
    Extraordinary Member Fokken's Avatar
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    100% agreed.
    Don’t get me wrong, Rogue has been rad AF but Sunspot has made SERIOUSLY WICKED strides in character progression in all that he has accomplished while an avenger- - so much so that he has actively contending with Illyana as my favorite New Mutant graduate.

  13. #28
    Astonishing Member DurararaFTW's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ţh€ €жţяą-๏яďɨɲąя Tycon View Post
    The students are X-Men. The New Mutants are X-Men. Everyone on Utopia were X-Men. Just because he isn't on an Alpha squad or a 'main' member doesn't mean he isn't a part of the X-Men. That really isn't a debate. And you don't need to live in the Westchester School to be an X-Men eitehr. These all are made up requisites for a group he's already a part of.
    Jubilee became an X-Men when she joined the X-Men team, Gen X were not X-Men, those were bragging right she held over them. Cannonball became an X-Men when he joined the X-Men team, being a New Mutant and X-Force did not make him such. Then yeah, San Francisco happened and every single mutant (which circumstantially happened to include Sunspot) was called an X-men for a while, they did not stick to this status quo. After AvX Bling wasn't an X-Men anymore, Pixie wasn't an X-Men anymore. You probably wouldn't call Toad or Callisto an X-Men. Magneto doesn't call himself an X-Man anymore.

    So yeah, they are characters for whom the phrase "I was an X-Man" past tense, is possible. I don't see what makes Sunspot's immortal X-Men status is so singularly and uniquely ironclad to you.

    Throwing money around? The only things he's done with that is buy AIM and send the rest of the money to help fund the organizations. I think you're making lots of assumptions. First, is there anything that contradicts Tony or Karma or Emma doing the same thing Bobby is currently doing? And Bobby didn't really but an island, he used a vacant island and retrofitted it. The base in the Savage Land wasn't bought either.
    The part where they don't? AIM was a evil organisation for half a century that Tony, Emma or Karma couldn't much about until Bobby's money came along, didn't just buy the company but threw money at their scientists until they were not evil anymore. And big vacant lots also cost money to turn into a peronal country.

    And dangerous financial decision? He's broke now lol.
    Okay, which investment was so big that it even Sunspot could lose his fortune over it?

  14. #29
    Spectacular Member rdman's Avatar
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    This is what happens when writers are allowed to develop characters to make them more likeable and not be overshadowed by the fanbase or the editors catering to them.

  15. #30
    Extraordinary Member Zero Hunter's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jokerz79 View Post
    The best X-Man as an Avenger was, is, and shall always be Beast.
    There is the answer.

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