A Better explanation for the creation and use of the Clone Army

[tib2d2]

The introduction and explanation of the Clone Army creation was sloppy at best in the prequel trilogy (IMO). Not to mention no follow up at all in ROTS on Syfo Dyas and his role in creating the Army.

If you're like me, you've probably thought up a better way that the Clone Army creation could have been explained or shown. I'd like to hear some thoughts, but my only rule is that it would not change Episode III at all.

Basically keep it to the confines of Ep I & II to explain how the Clone Army was created and why.

[Carabas]

Welp, it seems obvious that Palpatine had it created so he could order the Jedi to command it, leading to order 66. His entire big plan he and his predecessor worked on for decades doesn't work even a little bit without the Clones.

When watching the movie I assumed that Syfo Dyas was Sidious; the names are even somewhat similar. silly names games is pure Star Wars.

[thwhtGuardian]

Welp, it seems obvious that Palpatine had it created so he could order the Jedi to command it, leading to order 66. His entire big plan he and his predecessor worked on for decades doesn't work even a little bit without the Clones.

When watching the movie I assumed that Syfo Dyas was Sidious; the names are even somewhat similar. silly names games is pure Star Wars.

Yeah, I'm not really sure what more needed to be shown.

[ChrisIII]

In earlier versions of the screenplay, Sifo-Dyas was actually called Sido-Dyus and was never affiliated with any Jedi.

I guess Lucas wanted the audience to connect the dots that the Jedi who erased the Kamino files and also the man who hired Jango ("Tyrannus") was Dooku; as he's called that name at the end of AOTC as well by Sidious.

As we see from the opening crawl and a few other scenes the Republic was kind of considering building an army of some sorts anyway in case war broke out, one that Padme was kind of opposed to (Although the deleted scenes kind of went into more detail about it). The Clones just kind of showed up conveinently at the right moment....and with Padme being off-planet and having Jar-Jar of all people to represent her....

[Cel]

Long before the prequels, I imagined that the Clone Wars involved the Jedi fighting an army of clone soldiers that was at war with the Old Republic. I didn't have a problem with how it ultimately turned out, though--the Clone Wars being named such because the Republic used an army of clone soldiers in a war with Separatists. The politics of the time were definitely murky and didn't follow a very easy-to-follow path for everyone, but I think Lucas said at one point that's how real politics are and some people don't even know what the fighting is really all about.

[DrNewGod]

To me, the unanswered question was less about the clones than where that apparently massive officer corps we see in ANH came from, because we're not even given hints about it in either AOTC or ROTS. IMO, a few throw-away lines in ROTS could have explained that the clones conditioning made some of them adequate to small unit leadership, but not larger unit command. Commander Cody, for example, should not have been Obi-Wan's deputy (Sergeant-Major Cody, maybe, but then we lose Lucas' winking shout-out to King of the Rocket Men).

The idea is that as the war expanded, The Republic was forced to recruit and train a body of officers to lead the clones because there just weren't enough Jedi to go around. This could have worked with the existing plot by providing another point of contention between The Jedi Council and The Supreme Chancellor, with the Jedi uneasy at the degree of loyalty to the Chancellor that seemed baked-into the officers' training.

[ChrisIII]

We see some sort of Republic officers in the very beginning of TPM piloting the diplomatic ship. Apart from the hat, rank badge and the green/black color, they're pretty much identical in uniform to the later Imperial officers. It's possible this group-described in the EU (both of them) as Judicial forces-eventually were sort of integrated into the Imperial officers.

http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Judicial_Forces


We also see an officer corp of sorts in Clone Wars, with some filled by the clones, but also other commanders, especially Yularen (Who "later" appeared in Star Wars as part of Tarkin's council) and later, Tarkin.

[tib2d2]

Yeah I suppose I just really get irritated that a dead Jedi was mentioned as the one who ordered the creation of the army, and then no follow up to it.

Did Syfo Dyas really order it? Where'd he get the funding? We know now that Dyas was a bit of a rogue Jedi, could he have been working with Sidious?

Also, after 10 years of waiting, why didn't a representative from Kamino approach the Republic at some point like "hey guys, your clones are coming in nicely, wanna come see them? Its been a while?"

Why wouldn't Yoda say "Uh, yeah its cool that there's an entire army that fell into our lap, but something seems suspect that a supposed dead Jedi ordered the creation of this, even though we're pretty sure he didn't."

I know a few of these questions were answered in the Clone Wars cartoon, but it doesn't help the films sloppy job explaining it.

[BeastieRunner]

I thought that Darth Sideous masqueraded as Sifo-Dyas ordered the clones, and had Count Dooku erase Kamino from the Jedi archives while Dooku was still a Jedi and had access to the library?

[tib2d2]

I thought that Darth Sideous masqueraded as Sifo-Dyas ordered the clones, and had Count Dooku erase Kamino from the Jedi archives while Dooku was still a Jedi and had access to the library?

Thats most likely what happened, along with Dooku bringing in Jango Fett for the clone template.

BUT, I really feel they did a poor job at explaining it.

[Carabas]

Thats most likely what happened, along with Dooku bringing in Jango Fett for the clone template.

BUT, I really feel they did a poor job at explaining it.

Poor storytelling is what the prequels were all about.

[BeastieRunner]

Thats most likely what happened, along with Dooku bringing in Jango Fett for the clone template.

BUT, I really feel they did a poor job at explaining it.

That's the canon explanation.

Lucas even changed Sifo-Dyas name from Sido-Dyas.

I thought the name was a dead give away but I guess not.

[SuperiorIronman]

Sifo-Dyas is largely irrelevant as far as two and three go.

Edited for great justice-
The clone army as introduced in 2 is basically sometime around TPM a "Sifo-Diyas" commissioned the clone army on behalf of the Jedi Order, and so when Obi-Wan reported this it left them confused, as the Jedi did not order their creation, the council did not authorize this and someone did it on their behalf, Sifo-Dyas or not.
As of 2, we know that Dooku left the order and joined Sidious sometime around Qui-Gon's death, and that was 10 years prior. The clones also are 10 years old upon maturation so it fits with the development time. Jango even mentions he met with Dooku at least once, and Fett is the template for the clone army. Dooku himself plainly admits that the Sith are controlling the Republic and while Obi-Wan doesn't believe it, Ian McDiarmid is clearly playing both Palpatine and Sidious and the clones fall under Palpatine's control. So if Sifo-Dyas is dead, then everything points to the Sith (either Dooku or Sidious) having been responsible for that army.

The reason the Jedi don't just abandon the usage of clones is that their is a clear threat in the droid army causing planets to in some cases violently break from the Republic and the clones are trained and outfitted already. The Republic while possessing armed forces, do not have a standing army to fight a galactic war. As such when Obi-Wan reports the clones came from a Jedi it's somewhat reassuring though more evidence points to the Sith being responsible for them(though we know that, the Jedi don't), and the fact that they didn't kill them in Patranaki arena or later on Geonosis kind of puts them on the up and up because if they wanted them dead why not just kill them there and join the droids?

BTW the Kamanoians didn't come to anybody about the clones because while they could clone something in half the time, it still takes ten years to have a working order. If the Jedi don't have an order to receive then why bother? Someone will be along sooner or later but most clones aren't going to be ready until they become ten when they fully develop.

[Bruce Wayne]

The introduction and explanation of the Clone Army creation was sloppy at best in the prequel trilogy (IMO).

From a policy perspective: not really. The Republic were already using an army of recruits that were largely trained from childhood to defend the Republic aka the Jedi Order. With the GAR they just upscaled the process to churn out larger quantities of recruits and used one template as a model to ensure better quality standards and control.

Not to mention no follow up at all in ROTS on Syfo Dyas and his role in creating the Army.

It's explained in the Clone Wars series by George Lucas.

[Vegeta]

I thought that Darth Sideous masqueraded as Sifo-Dyas ordered the clones, and had Count Dooku erase Kamino from the Jedi archives while Dooku was still a Jedi and had access to the library?

Yeah, but doesn't Obi-Wan respond with a comment about how Master Syfo-Dyas died years ago? If the guy was a Jedi Master important enough for Obi-Wan to recognize by name shouldn't the Jedi notice how similar Chancellor Palpatine looks like him?