Superman In Therapy Storyline Question

[Agent Z]

I recall there was a story in previous continuity about Superman going into therapy. But I don't recall if he disclosed his identity to the therapist or kept that to himself. Can anyone who remember please remind me how it went?

[Dolores - The Worst Poster Ever]

It was after OWAW, and Superman kept his identity a secret.

If he did reveal his identity, it didn't happen until much later because I remember Superman being guarded about things like if he was married, and not disclosing who he was married to which wouldn't have been an issue if he told his therapist that he was Clark Kent.

[Adekis]

You'd think the League would have someone in-house for something like that instead of outsourcing. Consider the counseling sessions between Black Canary and the team in the Young Justice show. Something like that would probably better serve Superman than going to a therapist who doesn't even know that he works at a newspaper.

Isn't Guy Gardner a social worker or something? Maybe he'd be a good choice.

[Francisco]

He went to the same therapist Flash used to go. I think the therapist was a regular character in the Flash's book. Her specialty was attending metahumans.

[Dolores - The Worst Poster Ever]

You'd think the League would have someone in-house for something like that instead of outsourcing. Consider the counseling sessions between Black Canary and the team in the Young Justice show. Something like that would probably better serve Superman than going to a therapist who doesn't even know that he works at a newspaper.

Isn't Guy Gardner a social worker or something? Maybe he'd be a good choice.

It's not like they did anything with that plotline.

When you look at it the context of what the writers were doing at the time, it makes sense why they went with a new character that wouldn't how up regularly. Superman seeing the therapist was just a way for the writers to bring up him killing the PU Kryptonians since they were setting up the end of the Pokolistan storyline. Having Superman confide in someone he regularly sees, someone that is prominently active in the superhero community, that he killed three people when they were powerless; that wasn't going to be a major moment between Superman and another superhero not named Batman.

[Kuwagaton]

But Batman will have three or four relevant doctorates above most psychiatrists. Or should. Dang it, Crisis!

[Adekis]

But Batman will have three or four relevant doctorates above most psychiatrists. Or should. Dang it, Crisis!

Wait, did Bruce actually have doctorates? I know he's got that level of expertise, but I didn't know that. Huh.

It's not like they did anything with that plotline.

When you look at it the context of what the writers were doing at the time, it makes sense why they went with a new character that wouldn't how up regularly. Superman seeing the therapist was just a way for the writers to bring up him killing the PU Kryptonians since they were setting up the end of the Pokolistan storyline. Having Superman confide in someone he regularly sees, someone that is prominently active in the superhero community, that he killed three people when they were powerless; that wasn't going to be a major moment between Superman and another superhero not named Batman.

Why not? Batman's the worst person to talk to about it. Wonder Woman might be a good choice, she understands the necessity of killing in extreme situations. Or Nightwing, he's super compassionate and more likely than Bruce to be open minded. What about Green Arrow, he beat himself up over killing a criminal for years and years, right?

Seems to me like the only reason it had to be either a nobody who'd rarely if ever come back or else Batman is because of Batmanitis.

[Dolores - The Worst Poster Ever]

Wait, did Bruce actually have doctorates? I know he's got that level of expertise, but I didn't know that. Huh.



Why not? Batman's the worst person to talk to about it. Wonder Woman might be a good choice, she understands the necessity of killing in extreme situations. Or Nightwing, he's super compassionate and more likely than Bruce to be open minded. What about Green Arrow, he beat himself up over killing a criminal for years and years, right?

Seems to me like the only reason it had to be either a nobody who'd rarely if ever come back or else Batman is because of Batmanitis.

Because DC wasn't going to let Superman confide in any character that wasn't considered judgmental, like Batman, about exactly what he did. Having another superhero comfort Superman about killing three powerless individuals, no matter what they had done, wasn't going to happen. DC quickly realized what a mistake the PU killings was and have tried to tweak it ever since Byrne left the book, ranging from suggestions such as that the PU criminals might have somehow gotten their powers back seconds after Superman put the gold kryptonite away or that even if Superman had taken them to the main Universe, that their crimes would have been outside of US jurisdiction so they would have gone unpunished.

That's why they finally did away with it Post-Infinite Crisis.

[Kuwagaton]

They did away with it only after it really gave tremendous mileage. They managed to squeeze that story for a reference point from 1988 in the overarching plot up until the death of Superman in 1992, and even beyond with some 90s annuals. I never really think things getting reset is an admission of regret for what came before, they just have to do something different every ten years or so. It's a market in which its products constantly have to adapt to the times. Seems tough.

Wait, did Bruce actually have doctorates? I know he's got that level of expertise, but I didn't know that. Huh.

Nah I was joking

[Dolores - The Worst Poster Ever]

They did away with it only after it really gave tremendous mileage. They managed to squeeze that story for a reference point from 1988 in the overarching plot up until the death of Superman in 1992, and even beyond with some 90s annuals. I never really think things getting reset is an admission of regret for what came before, they just have to do something different every ten years or so. It's a market in which its products constantly have to adapt to the times. Seems tough.

They did, but it was trying to make the most out of a bad situation.

There's a quote from Jurgens, and I might be getting some of it wrong, but he essentially said that the writers didn't like what had happened and would have preferred it if the story hadn't happened but rather than take the easy way out of retconning the story they dealt with the fallout.

When you consider how much it impacted Superman's post-crisis history, with the introduction of Eradicator, Superman's return from the dead, Mongul, and all coming out of the fallout of Superman killing the PU criminals, doing it away with it wasn't much of an option until the next big Universe wide continuity altering story.

[PyroTwilight]

Why not? Batman's the worst person to talk to about it. Wonder Woman might be a good choice, she understands the necessity of killing in extreme situations. Or Nightwing, he's super compassionate and more likely than Bruce to be open minded. What about Green Arrow, he beat himself up over killing a criminal for years and years, right?

Oddly enough Bruce did somehow become aware of it not that much long after and seems fully aware of it in a JLA story, even defending Superman for having done it. Though the way Bruce defends him makes it seem like either Bruce doesn't know the FULL version of the story or the writer was being very lenient in phrasing.

[theoneandonly]

the JLA came to know about it in issue #35 when hal who had become the spectre encountered the JLA for the first time after his transformation. Batman who was on a hate hal band wagon excused his behaviour saying he made a difficult choice in a impossible situation. its a good read for anyone interested in seeing how the spectre viewed the JLA.

[TheNewFiftyForum]

You'd think the League would have someone in-house for something like that instead of outsourcing. Consider the counseling sessions between Black Canary and the team in the Young Justice show. Something like that would probably better serve Superman than going to a therapist who doesn't even know that he works at a newspaper.

Isn't Guy Gardner a social worker or something? Maybe he'd be a good choice.

I'm guessing he would want to go outside his immediate work community for something as potentially private as therapy?

[Dolores - The Worst Poster Ever]

Oddly enough Bruce did somehow become aware of it not that much long after and seems fully aware of it in a JLA story, even defending Superman for having done it. Though the way Bruce defends him makes it seem like either Bruce doesn't know the FULL version of the story or the writer was being very lenient in phrasing.

the JLA came to know about it in issue #35 when hal who had become the spectre encountered the JLA for the first time after his transformation. Batman who was on a hate hal band wagon excused his behaviour saying he made a difficult choice in a impossible situation. its a good read for anyone interested in seeing how the spectre viewed the JLA.

This is what I mean.

After Exile, writers began treating it as self defense or for the safety of others when it was premeditated murder.

[Kuwagaton]

Logically, it was self defense in the first place. The only conceivable way someone couldn't justify it as defense would be if they were against the death penalty to an absurd degree. He only believes it's his duty as he's been deputized on his own world and since all of the representatives of that world are dead. He kills them when they threaten to find a way to come back, and clearly he takes no joy in it as he does it.

I say absurd because look at this rough statement on WWII: "Over 60 million people were killed, which was about 3% of the 1940 world population (est. 2.3 billion)." See that 2.3 billion? Double that and you have the deaths in the pocket universe. If you were to hold a trial and hold Hirohito, Mussolini, and Hitler responsible for all those deaths and could prove beyond a reasonable doubt that they could do it again after they told you they would, what do you think would happen?

Again, looking at this from a real perspective if you want to literally claim it was a premeditated murder: what are the odds Superman himself would be convicted if proven serial killers were found dead in an area to which he was invited after a struggle, and while two of them died from minimal gunshots (you can see that on Zaora's last word, he's already installed the cap back onto the kryptonite) the third died from the hands of the second? Byrne's judgment was logical if regrettable, but what you don't see if the writers acting as if it was something to walk back.

Superman wouldn't bother to bring it to Batman since it's not really his business, but if the latter man said "hey, no that does suck but it made sense," then he's being written as a sensible person if not just a decent friend.