The Martian Manhunter Pro/Con Workshop

[CRaymond]

Wherein DCU/CBR folks can post creative, constructive solutions and thoughtful analysis of the seemingly problematic character of J'onn J'onzz, the Martian Manhunter.

First appearing in a 1955 issue of Detective Comics, "John Jones" is a strange blend of Batman's super-sleuth and Superman's laundry list of powers. Over time, he's served as the moral compass and backbone of a variety of Justice League incarnations, being one of the longest serving members to not hold a consistent solo book.

There are several anachronistic issues with J'onn's presentation in contemporary comics, as science education and fiction expectations have grown in nuance, depth and breadth.

1. Powers
Superman + Professor X + Kitty Pryde + Invisible Man + Plastic Man + Mystique + ?

The Martian Manhunter's powers include:

Body
Superhuman strength, speed, and durability
Mass manipulation, including shapeshifting, invisibility, and intangibility
Regenerative healing factor

Mind
Genius-level intellect
Photographic memory
Flight
Telekinesis
Telepathy

Both
Martian nine senses
Plasma beam projection

While several have suggested reducing his powerset to merely telepathy and telekinesis, or other combinations --I wonder if there's a solution that allows for these multiple powers in a way that makes him special among Martians. IE: Do we want all Red, Green, and White Martians to have J'onn's overwhelming powerset as well?

Maybe J'onn's role as a manhunter(police) on Ma'aleca'andra(Mars), awarded him a variety of abilities that aren't standard among Martians. Maybe there are distinct powers/proclivities between the various colors of ancestral Martian peoples.

So, what powers do you expect from M'gann M'orzz? What do you expect from Jemm? What about Yellow Martians or Klaramarians? Koolars? Hyperclan? Are each of these examples of their people, or enhanced specimens; superhuman to our human?

[Trey Strain]

Make him what Superman isn't. He should have powers that Superman doesn't. And not a zillion of them.

[CRaymond]

Make him what Superman isn't. He should have powers that Superman doesn't. And not a zillion of them.

Like shapeshifting and psychic talents.

Does Miss Martian also have those abilities? Do the White Martians?
Is there something J'onn is better at? Is there something M'gann is better at?
How is green different than white?

[Phoenixx9]

And isn't there a Yellow Martian as well? What can they do?

[stephens2177]

Miss martain should have her EXACT powerset from the YJ show period.

Jonn should have all the same powers as miss martian,BUT instead of TK have him use self TK,which he can mentally amp his strength,speed,and durability

Malefic should have no telepathy at all,but have all the other powers,and better at them than Megan and jonn

White Martians should have limited telepathy and limited shapeshifting.they should be more brick beasts,more brutal fighters than other Martians who use their powers like a scapel.

Don't know any other Martians,but I gave 4 different unique,but at the same time connected powersets.

[scary harpy]

Don't forget the weakness to fire.

[Lee Stone]

First, I'd drop 'Martian' from his name, making him simply, 'The Manhunter'. This would plant him into the Manhunter name legacy, making him the prime character in it and giving him a DC 'family'.

Second, I'd keep the origin and most of the powers but I'd base his Martian abilities on the Predator. He'd have invisibility, shape-changing, some super-strength (stronger than all humans but not as strong as Superman, Wonder Woman or Captain Marvel. More about Aquaman's strength. Or maybe just shy of Donna Troy in strength.
No x-ray vision, no heat vision, no super-breath and stretching would be limited to fingers only, allowing him to ensnare his prey or make claws.
He'd have flight, infra-vision and ultra-light vision, some tracking abilities, super hearing, telescopic vision.
His telepathy would be limited to hearing brainwaves and sensing emotion. Everyone would sound kinda like the characters in Sims with the tone of the Sims-speak dependent on their enotion. This would allow him to find or track someone simply by hearing their thoughts.

All of these abilities would also be beneficial as a private investigator, and I'd make Cindy Reynolds (Gypsy) a permanent supporting character for him, assisting him as his secretary and helping him adapt to Earth customs while he serves as a father figure for her.

As for costume, I'd keep the New52 look but give him back his classic cape.

[CaptCleghorn]

Is the power set really that much of a problem? there are two ways to handle an over powered character. One is to give them a equally or more powerful foe. Sometimes this is good, but doing this leads to power inflation and moving the bar to cosmic universal threats too soon. the second is to give the hero a challenge they can't just punch their way through. We know J'onn could flatten this scumbag, but what if that doesn't solve the problem?

J'onn's an outsider here. Unlike Clark, he looks it. Unlike Clark, he hasn't grown up on this planet and experienced what Earthlings do in their lives. Where we can more easily pick a side because of our experiences, for someone like J'onn, it's more like me and an English soccer match where I really don't care who wins.

J'onn's been used in so many different ways and there really isn't a set plan for him. Multiple attempts have been made to set him up but few have really caught on. IMO, he's got a Superman power set but would rather operate with a Batman style. His observations are important. He's important in removing any preconceptions we have about a situation.

I don't think he works well in a simple set-up. I think he's best used in a more adult setting where ideas are the reason behind the rating. More Mister Miracle and Young Animal, but that is usually MY personal preference. If he's going to be successful, he needs to provide something not beiung gotten elsewhere.

[Phoenixx9]

I agree with you, Captain. Powerful heroes need powerful foes. And the writers need to keep the villains winning at various times and not turning them into mushes and pushovers.

[Trey Strain]

One of the complaints about him is that he's a low-rent Superman. So I'd lose the cape and anything else that reminds anyone of Superman.

What I'd personally do with him is to try him out in a recurring mini with the Spectre. John Jones and Jim Corringan would be detectives on a big-city police department.

If it didn't work out, so what? You could just split them up again and try the Spectre without him.

[SJNeal]

First, I'd drop 'Martian' from his name, making him simply, 'The Manhunter'. This would plant him into the Manhunter name legacy, making him the prime character in it and giving him a DC 'family'.

The "Martian" part is essential to the character, I think. Most writers seem to think so too, as without that he *is* kind of just a green Superman.

While giving him a DC family to belong to might in some way increase sales (he "matters" now!), his feelings of isolation are also a key component. Taking that away would diminish him as well. IMHO

[CRaymond]

2. Mars
What does it mean to be Martian?

From an outside perspective, the word "Martian" is a bit silly, as it calls to mind Looney Tunes' Marvin, "little green men", and silly mid-century alien hysteria. In the DCUniverse, Mars was home to a highly advanced and highly adaptable population of lifeforms. In various texts, Martians are shown to have been interplanetary colonists, interstellar explorers, and to have inspired the Manhunter robots of Oa.

It's true that Martian Manhunter's Mars origin falls into a weird nook between being ancient, ancient history and interstellar science fiction space opera. You can't really address the Martian civilization because it was nearly entirely wiped out, but there are breadcrumbs scattered throughout the DCU that suggests its primacy in the development of the cosmos.

Superman represents distant aliens coming to Earth, Green Lantern represents humans going to far, far outer space. MM is somewhere between those --as he's basically a next door neighbor-- but he's so much MORE alien than either of those two.

What are your thoughts regarding the Martian people and their reach into the DCU?

[DragonsChi]

One big complaint I have with MM is to many overlapping powers. Personally, I feel the more powers a character has the harder it is to relate to the character and the more the audience is confuses and/or put off by that character.

If it were up to me I would make him a purely psychic character.

Like so:

Telepathy
Illusion Casting-Covers the Shapeshifting & Invisibility
Telekinesis- Covers Flight, Super Strength, & Super Speed

And that's it. I would make him very powerful in those abilities. Enough to still be a match for Superman, Wonder Woman, & Shazam but now he would actually bring something different to the table. He would operate more in Mastermind/Illusion caster way but who engages into physical combat.

This would also allow him to have a more legitimate weakness. With his powers all being based on concentration he would now have a venerability to keep an audience engaged and to actually be concerned for him. If he lost concentration or incurred some self-doubt his powers would wain allowing him to be exploited. But on the other end if he was extremely focused and self assured he would be a force to be reckoned with. (No Weakness to Fire. It's just dumb.)

From there I would create stories about will power, confidence, human weakness in terms of mental and emotional. Those would be his core themes there on out for other writers to explore add to and so on.




Note if someone has already said this I apologies haven't read the whole thread.

[CaptCleghorn]

2. Mars
What does it mean to be Martian?

From an outside perspective, the word "Martian" is a bit silly, as it calls to mind Looney Tunes' Marvin, "little green men", and silly mid-century alien hysteria. In the DCUniverse, Mars was home to a highly advanced and highly adaptable population of lifeforms. In various texts, Martians are shown to have been interplanetary colonists, interstellar explorers, and to have inspired the Manhunter robots of Oa.

It's true that Martian Manhunter's Mars origin falls into a weird nook between being ancient, ancient history and interstellar science fiction space opera. You can't really address the Martian civilization because it was nearly entirely wiped out, but there are breadcrumbs scattered throughout the DCU that suggests its primacy in the development of the cosmos.

Superman represents distant aliens coming to Earth, Green Lantern represents humans going to far, far outer space. MM is somewhere between those --as he's basically a next door neighbor-- but he's so much MORE alien than either of those two.

What are your thoughts regarding the Martian people and their reach into the DCU?

I don't like the idea of the Martian people having any role in the DCU. There are numerous other races out there and not right next door. We have a camera and go cart on Mars and we're seeing what's there. Explaining what happened to the Martian people is one thing, but coming up with a reason, they're not there anymore but are elsewhere is a bit too much for me.

J'onn is a martian. the term has been used regarding raising different children and sometimes for children in general. It refers to looking at situations differently and not with our perceptions coloring them. The term is perfect for what I proposed earlier. It's grown up enough to keep interest, but still a green martian is silly enough to go with the oreos fetish and serves to make stories more three-dimensional.

Reuniting a lost soul with his people ends the story. Often the attempt is made to continue the story by making the people evil and introducing conflict. Superman is never going back to Krypton. Odo went back to his people, but that was the end of the DS9 story. One Martian, J'onn, learning about Earth.

[DragonsChi]

Could make so that a virus or something gene specific is on Mars that makes it uninhabitable to Martians.