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  1. #121
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    Interesting.

    Text and static pages is what History of the DCU was, so I don't mind reusing that format. At the end of the day, I think this will just be a frame of reference for characters -- and hopefully, a means of getting people excited about the characters. I don't think it will be redefining anything.

  2. #122

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    I thought it was good read. I liked how Ridley was able to incorporate Jeff's publication history and make it feel like someone's life.
    Last edited by the illustrious mr. kenway; 11-24-2020 at 12:08 PM.

  3. #123
    Mighty Member Iconic's Avatar
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    I thoroughly dug this. It was great to see this kind of light shed on Jefferson Pierce. This was an amazing story.

    That scene where they were called to the gym. Man...got me right in the feels.
    Last edited by Iconic; 11-24-2020 at 08:04 PM.

  4. #124
    The Celestial Dragon Tien Long's Avatar
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    Enjoyed it as well. Actually, it was one of my favorite reads in a long time. There were tough moments to read, but even in the toughness, Ridley showed the depth and complexity of character. Indeed, regarding the moments with Superman, those moments hurt. Reading fragility and privilege used against Superman always hurts. There is truth to these claims, but being cast on one of the most empathetic characters in comics, that stings. Yet, even then, Pierce shows an understanding of Superman. He acknowledges that Superman is affected by the loss of his whole people. He recognizes how having his cousin is a joy for him. Also, liked his characterization of Batman. A dialogue-based format may have made you feel that fear, but the prose also made you realize that Batman will break you and doesn't care if you're afraid of that fact.

    There were many other moments that got to me though. Ridley's characterization of Pierce as having this work hard, be tough against an unfair world mentality was interesting. Ridley expands on it in an interview he did over on Gamesradar where he talks about a certain generation of Black men who grew up that way. It resonated a lot me with since one of my colleagues at my school is cut from that same cloth. Now, the students honestly love and appreciate the man. He's a father figure to all of them. He's good natured and funny. He got into the profession to teach all kids, and especially make sure that young Black boys wouldn't go down or get caught up in the wrong crowds. The man, however, came out of a rough upbringing and used setback's and harshness against him as fuel to persevere. He had to be tough, just like Franklin Pierce.

    Honestly, just heard about the series today but totally set on reading the rest. Really looking forward to the next issue!
    "I am a man of peace."

    "A man of peace...who fights like ten tigers."

  5. #125
    Extraordinary Member Vordan's Avatar
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    I loved this. I thought it was a great exploration of DC History akin to Marvels as seen through Black Lightning’s eyes. Ridley doesn’t pull any punches in examining the limitations of superheroes, but he also makes it clear that Pierce himself is not an unbiased source and is a flawed man and hero that still wants to do good. As a Superman fan I actually didn’t mind the critiques mainly because they aligned pretty close to my own viewpoints of what Clark’s flaws are, and one of the big ones is Clark’s need to be liked. Ridley focusing on that to me felt like an honest and true assessment of Clark’s failings.

    God damn does Pierce rag on John Stewart though. I swear Pierce is taking shots at him every other page, , it made for a nice moment in the end when Pierce finally actually sits down and talks with John man to man, and realizes that he’s built up a strawman of Stewart in his head to beat up on, ignoring that Stewart is just a man trying his best.

    Geez was that really Batman’s motive for initially recruiting Jeff to the Outsiders? If so *facepalm* my God is that embarrassing.

  6. #126
    Moderator Frontier's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Vordan View Post
    I loved this. I thought it was a great exploration of DC History akin to Marvels as seen through Black Lightning’s eyes. Ridley doesn’t pull any punches in examining the limitations of superheroes, but he also makes it clear that Pierce himself is not an unbiased source and is a flawed man and hero that still wants to do good. As a Superman fan I actually didn’t mind the critiques mainly because they aligned pretty close to my own viewpoints of what Clark’s flaws are, and one of the big ones is Clark’s need to be liked. Ridley focusing on that to me felt like an honest and true assessment of Clark’s failings.
    This reminds me that I like how Superman and Jeff played off each other in Black Lightning: Year One.
    God damn does Pierce rag on John Stewart though. I swear Pierce is taking shots at him every other page, , it made for a nice moment in the end when Pierce finally actually sits down and talks with John man to man, and realizes that he’s built up a strawman of Stewart in his head to beat up on, ignoring that Stewart is just a man trying his best.
    Do they mention Jefferson unknowingly marrying his sister :P?
    Geez was that really Batman’s motive for initially recruiting Jeff to the Outsiders? If so *facepalm* my God is that embarrassing.
    ...What was it?

  7. #127
    Astonishing Member Robanker's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Frontier View Post
    This reminds me that I like how Superman and Jeff played off each other in Black Lightning: Year One.

    Do they mention Jefferson unknowingly marrying his sister :P?

    ...What was it?
    "I need a black guy to pretend to be this other guy's brother," essentially. Whoof, Bruce.

    This was scathing at times, but it felt very honest to Jeff and I thoroughly enjoyed it. I have it on order at my LCS but I couldn't wait so I went digital. I did get a little defensive for a brief moment when it came for Superman, but it's Jeff's perspective and you get to see his initial thoughts and reflections on people as well as his particular takes on them. It's a really solid read and I'm in for the whole run. Ridley was excellent at providing a very grounded look at what it could have been like living in the DCU, better than most I've seen. In one book John Ridley's joined the short list of my favorite writers for Black Lightning and I'm eager to see what he has in store for others.

    I can't stress enough how complete a character he made Jefferson, and how both his virtues and flaws shine in this.

    This is shaping up to be something very special and I'm very excited to see what comes next. I've been on the fence about the Next Batman stuff (just because I'm a bit fatigued with all the Bat stuff) but I'll get an issue just off the strength of this book alone.

    Quote Originally Posted by HsssH View Post
    So this is out and I thought it was kinda bad?
    spoilers:

    First of all it had lots of text and, I think, zero sequences. Mostly static pictures and bunch of text around them. Sure, comic book with static pages can work, sometimes, but this wasn't it for me. Next, I understand that this is coming from Black Lightning's perspective, but I really "loved" how he threw Superman under the bus. BL's relationship with Johns had an arc so I'm kinda ok of with how it played out. And Black Lighting obviously ends up being fine with Batman. You know, because he is Batman. But Superman? Fuck that guy.
    end of spoilers
    spoilers:


    Well he historically worked a lot more with Batman and clearly vibes with him a bit more, but he respects Superman enough in this. Keep in mind he was angry and resentful when he met him but his narration is one of reflection and he clearly has respect for Superman in hindsight. Each passage has some degree of "but I get it, even if he's kind of misguided or a square." He paints Superman as someone, like John and Mari, he misunderstood at the time. A lot of Jeff's arc in this issue was overcoming his own beliefs on others and learning to engage with others. With Superman, he's constantly referring to "you literally are the last of your kind. Holy shit that sucks" and he's genuinely a bit happy that Clark was able to actually find a family member to connect with. Hell, the arrival of Supergirl and what it meant for Superman personally was part of what gave Jefferson a little hope for America in the '80s. It's painted as a moment of genuine optimism.

    Jeff dogs on John Stewart most the issue before he really engages with the guy and befriends him, offering him empathy. Don't take everything at first blush because this is as much a story of Jeff growing as anything else.

    It's not as scathing as it appears with respect to the Man of Steel. If anything, of the trinity, Diana is the only one Jefferson takes to task and never seems to think the better of later on. But from someone watching his community struggle while not being privy to what goes on for the average JLA member? Yeah, they come across as aloof and speaking in platitudes. Why wouldn't someone like Black Lightning get frustrated with them?
    end of spoilers
    Last edited by Robanker; 11-24-2020 at 09:29 PM.

  8. #128
    Obsessed & Compelled Bored at 3:00AM's Avatar
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    I was very impressed by this. Looking forward to seeing the rest of this story.

  9. #129
    It sucks to be right BohemiaDrinker's Avatar
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    Damn, this was good.
    ConnEr Kent flies. ConnOr Hawke has a bow. Batman's kid is named DamiAn.

    To do spoiler tags, use [ spoil ] at the start of the sentence and [ /spoil ] at the end, without the spaces. You're welcome!

  10. #130
    Moderator Frontier's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Robanker View Post
    "I need a black guy to pretend to be this other guy's brother," essentially. Whoof, Bruce.
    Is that referencing something that happened in an Outsider comic? Because it sounds really random otherwise.

  11. #131
    Extraordinary Member sifighter's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Frontier View Post
    Is that referencing something that happened in an Outsider comic? Because it sounds really random otherwise.
    I think that was the first ever issue of Batman and the Outsiders, I remember because Batman quit the Justice League because they wouldn’t let him rescue Lucius Fox from Markovia.
    "It's fun and it's cool, so that's all that matters. It's what comics are for, Duh."
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  12. #132
    Moderator Frontier's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by sifighter View Post
    I think that was the first ever issue of Batman and the Outsiders, I remember because Batman quit the Justice League because they wouldn’t let him rescue Lucius Fox from Markovia.
    Well, I'm sure he thought Black Lightning brought more to the table than pretending to be Lucius brother, although in light of Ridley's focus on the Fox Family, it's kind of all comes together .

  13. #133
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    Quote Originally Posted by Frontier View Post
    Is that referencing something that happened in an Outsider comic? Because it sounds really random otherwise.
    Yes that was the case.

    I am sure that is going to get the woke community and usual suspects throwing fits yet that was the actual story.

    It's not like we have NOT seen that story line before. Heck an Alvin and the Chipmunks, Sailor Moon and Ducktales did it before.

    All Ridley did was cover Jefferson's first series, those horrible backups, Outsiders and stopped at the ill fated 1995 series.


    Interesting John's wife was not referenced.
    Nor mention Crisis-since he was there.
    Wouldn't he have met Amazing Man?
    And what about that other Black Lightning that was running around briefly.

  14. #134
    Astonishing Member Robanker's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by skyvolt2000 View Post
    Yes that was the case.

    I am sure that is going to get the woke community and usual suspects throwing fits yet that was the actual story.

    It's not like we have NOT seen that story line before. Heck an Alvin and the Chipmunks, Sailor Moon and Ducktales did it before.

    All Ridley did was cover Jefferson's first series, those horrible backups, Outsiders and stopped at the ill fated 1995 series.


    Interesting John's wife was not referenced.
    Nor mention Crisis-since he was there.
    Wouldn't he have met Amazing Man?
    And what about that other Black Lightning that was running around briefly.
    Amazing Man is a bit of a deep cut so he may not really know him. I thought Katma's omission was odd too, but perhaps Ridley didn't want to split focus from them bonding over being the first African American superheroes of their age and the difficulties they encountered as a result. Being GL didn't ruin his relationship the same way Jeff being BL did, so that may come down the line as a way they differ. After riding John so hard, it seemed like he wanted them to only get closer from that moment on.

  15. #135
    Extraordinary Member Robotman's Avatar
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    Overall I really enjoyed it. It was a great in depth retelling of Black Lightning’s origin. My only issue is that I dislike it when real world tragedies/conflicts are used in comics and a writer questions why the superheroes didn’t prevent it. Trying to show the ineptitude of superheroes because they haven’t solved world hunger or prevented a war really isn’t a fair criticism. The characters themselves are confined by the fact that they appear in ongoing stories.

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