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  1. #181
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    Recently read issue #2. Another enjoyable read. I did like the idea of Mal and Karen both narrating and giving different perspectives of events.

  2. #182
    Incredible Member Avi's Avatar
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    It was really cool to view DC's history through the eyes of Karen and Mal. It's a great way to define their characters while also playing with the long-standing canon. It felt a little like, yeah, these characters really got screwed over by some creative decisions, and it's nice to have these decisions addressed as in-universe choices.

    Edit: Btw, does the interior title page of the physical copy also falsely title the Issue as Book One: Jefferson Pierce? Or is that supposed to be an advertisement?
    Last edited by Avi; 01-26-2021 at 09:49 AM.

  3. #183

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    I thought it was a good showcase for Mal and Karen.

  4. #184
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    Quote Originally Posted by Avi View Post
    It was really cool to view DC's history through the eyes of Karen and Mal. It's a great way to define their characters while also playing with the long-standing canon. It felt a little like, yeah, these characters really got screwed over by some creative decisions, and it's nice to have these decisions addressed as in-universe choices.

    Edit: Btw, does the interior title page of the physical copy also falsely title the Issue as Book One: Jefferson Pierce? Or is that supposed to be an advertisement?
    It did a good job of addressing why they were not around when the 80s arrived and why they were MIA for Crisis.

  5. #185
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    Read issue 2. I think I liked issue 1 more, but Karen and Mal are great and are interesting counterpoints to Jefferson. If nothing else, they're a couple who were drawn closer by super heroics, while Jefferson and Lynn were separated by them.

    Also, reading up on the history of the "Battle of Jericho" episode Mal talked about, and wow, Ridley is laying out some pretty stark commentary on editorial practices of the time.

    Quote Originally Posted by Avi View Post
    It was really cool to view DC's history through the eyes of Karen and Mal. It's a great way to define their characters while also playing with the long-standing canon. It felt a little like, yeah, these characters really got screwed over by some creative decisions, and it's nice to have these decisions addressed as in-universe choices.

    Edit: Btw, does the interior title page of the physical copy also falsely title the Issue as Book One: Jefferson Pierce? Or is that supposed to be an advertisement?
    I read it digitally, and it also had the thing about issue 1. My guess is that it's a goof.

  6. #186
    Uncanny King-Kamalu lemonpeace's Avatar
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    This series is the best thing coming out of DC right now. I don't know what else to say about it besides that to be honest. I've never care much about Bumblebee, even less so for Mal, but this issue just sat me down and really made me feel for and care about these characters. the shit's beautiful man...
    SIGNAL (Duke Thomas) is DC's secret shonen protagonist! his fandom wikia
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    • Manga: One Piece, My Hero, Mashle, Tokyo Revengers, Jujutsu Kaisen, GoH, Black Clover
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    • Anticipated titles: MrM Source of Freedom, Static*, Hardware*, Urban Legends, Naomi s2, more Ridley/Batman, FS Gotham
    "power does not corrupt, power always reveals."

  7. #187

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    Quote Originally Posted by lemonpeace View Post
    This series is the best thing coming out of DC right now. I don't know what else to say about it besides that to be honest. I've never care much about Bumblebee, even less so for Mal, but this issue just sat me down and really made me feel for and care about these characters. the shit's beautiful man...
    as a kid of the 80s (not yet a guy with fanboy knowledge of 'deep-cut characters') I knew absolutely nothing about either of them, and it's truly sad. They got erased, essentially.

  8. #188
    Uncanny King-Kamalu lemonpeace's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hypestyle View Post
    as a kid of the 80s (not yet a guy with fanboy knowledge of 'deep-cut characters') I knew absolutely nothing about either of them, and it's truly sad. They got erased, essentially.
    I feel you, I'm a 90s baby and only recently into legit comic book fandom. so besides Bumblebee's guest appearances on Teen Titans, Bumblebee and Mal were well before my time. this issue really made me feel kinda bad for being so quick to dismiss them, and it highlights how poorly DC has used their characters over the years. definitely an iconic comic couple for me now and a pair I'm gonna be rooting for going forward.
    Last edited by lemonpeace; 01-26-2021 at 08:58 PM.
    SIGNAL (Duke Thomas) is DC's secret shonen protagonist! his fandom wikia
    I support militant Professor X
    • Manga: One Piece, My Hero, Mashle, Tokyo Revengers, Jujutsu Kaisen, GoH, Black Clover
    • [DC: Other History of DC
    • [Marvel: Immortal Hulk, Miles Morales: Spiderman, Black Panther, X-books
    • Anticipated titles: MrM Source of Freedom, Static*, Hardware*, Urban Legends, Naomi s2, more Ridley/Batman, FS Gotham
    "power does not corrupt, power always reveals."

  9. #189
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    Quote Originally Posted by Alkaeus View Post
    Read issue 2. I think I liked issue 1 more, but Karen and Mal are great and are interesting counterpoints to Jefferson. If nothing else, they're a couple who were drawn closer by super heroics, while Jefferson and Lynn were separated by them.

    Also, reading up on the history of the "Battle of Jericho" episode Mal talked about, and wow, Ridley is laying out some pretty stark commentary on editorial practices of the time.
    And that will be a point some will miss.

    They were among DC's FIRST black heroes. And got tossed aside. Remember John Stewart did not fare well during that time-it was 14 years after his first appearance that we saw him again in Green Lantern.

    Lets not forget Tyroc's history. The writers and artists were fighting with editors over him.

    This series is the best thing coming out of DC right now. I don't know what else to say about it besides that to be honest. I've never care much about Bumblebee, even less so for Mal, but this issue just sat me down and really made me feel for and care about these characters. the shit's beautiful man...
    This is the series DC should invest in.

    It should be expanded. John Stewart and Vixen should have one. I would say do one with Guy Gardner. What about Vibe? Amazing Man, Nubia or Cyborg.

  10. #190
    Extraordinary Member Vordan's Avatar
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    Another fantastic issue. I freely admit that my Titans knowledge pre-Johns is wonky at best, so this was very interesting to read. I had a vague knowledge of Mal Guardian and Bumblebee from the Young Justice cartoon, but that was all.

    Man Roy was a dick and everyone was really dumping on Garth huh?

    Oh God Terry Long, I still can’t believe that **** happened lmao

    I had zero clue about the murders of children occurring in Atlanta, that’s horrifying.

    Really enjoyed Mal and Karen arguing over what happened, that was amusing to read. Also laughed my ass off at that Hornblower costume, “problematic” indeed.

    Ridley really is low-key becoming one of the best Superman writers, insanely excited to see him write the big guy himself in Blue & Red.

    Overall I’m loving how Ridley is attempting to create an emotional arc that makes sense out of the soap opera superheroics of 70s and 80s DC. Really engaging with the story so far. Man that last panel with Mal and Karen... bittersweet as all hell. And was Cyborg really the first black man to lead a superhero team at DC? It’s sad that it took so long, but it’s cool that Vic got to be the leader of the Titans. I’m very curious to see how Ridley approaches Post Crisis DC next.
    Quote Originally Posted by skyvolt2000 View Post
    And that will be a point some will miss.

    They were among DC's FIRST black heroes. And got tossed aside. Remember John Stewart did not fare well during that time-it was 14 years after his first appearance that we saw him again in Green Lantern.

    Lets not forget Tyroc's history. The writers and artists were fighting with editors over him.



    This is the series DC should invest in.

    It should be expanded. John Stewart and Vixen should have one. I would say do one with Guy Gardner. What about Vibe? Amazing Man, Nubia or Cyborg.
    That character would be perfect for this series, but I’m going to go one step further: Ridley should be the one who gets the JSA. I’d want a series set during WWII times about the team first forming and Amazing Man as the POV protagonist. This series right now does a great job of balancing the super heroics with the real life successes and oppression happening in America. To do a JSA book now, I wouldn’t want it to just be nostalgic “man remember when we were the good guys and kicked evil’s ass? Everything was so much simpler back then.” storytelling, but an actual honest look at the “Golden Age” of heroes via examining the America that actually existed at the time. The accomplishments yes, but also tackling the racism and oppression and social ills. With Amazing Man and Alan being gay now, Ridley has got some prime material to explore there.

  11. #191
    Moderator Frontier's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Vordan View Post
    That character would be perfect for this series, but I’m going to go one step further: Ridley should be the one who gets the JSA. I’d want a series set during WWII times about the team first forming and Amazing Man as the POV protagonist. This series right now does a great job of balancing the super heroics with the real life successes and oppression happening in America. To do a JSA book now, I wouldn’t want it to just be nostalgic “man remember when we were the good guys and kicked evil’s ass? Everything was so much simpler back then.” storytelling, but an actual honest look at the “Golden Age” of heroes via examining the America that actually existed at the time. The accomplishments yes, but also tackling the racism and oppression and social ills. With Amazing Man and Alan being gay now, Ridley has got some prime material to explore there.
    That sounds less like a JSA book and more like another installment of The Other History of the DC Universe in my opinion. Or like a spiritual successor to James Robinson's Golden Age series.

    I mean, it's not like the Johns run reveled in nostalgia or the JSA talking about how good things were back in the day even if their history was still a significant factor in the book. It's just I think fans want their heroes back in the spotlight and fighting crime and bad guys together again. Not that we can't have that kind of introspection to some degree but with how long the JSA have been on a hiatus I don't see it being a core focus.

  12. #192
    Extraordinary Member Vordan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Frontier View Post
    That sounds less like a JSA book and more like another installment of The Other History of the DC Universe in my opinion. Or like a spiritual successor to James Robinson's Golden Age series.

    I mean, it's not like the Johns run reveled in nostalgia or the JSA talking about how good things were back in the day even if their history was still a significant factor in the book. It's just I think fans want their heroes back in the spotlight and fighting crime and bad guys together again. Not that we can't have that kind of introspection to some degree but with how long the JSA have been on a hiatus I don't see it being a core focus.
    I’m just throwing out what I’d like to see. I’m sure they’ve already got someone else lined up to take over the book, probably Venditti, and I think they’ll do a good job. But you know what? A spin-off of this series focusing specifically on the JSA in WWII actually sounds great to me. Something where Ridley can just do as he pleases while a mainline JSA book does a more traditional take sounds like an “everyone wins” situation to me.

  13. #193
    Moderator Frontier's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Vordan View Post
    I’m just throwing out what I’d like to see. I’m sure they’ve already got someone else lined up to take over the book, probably Venditti, and I think they’ll do a good job. But you know what? A spin-off of this series focusing specifically on the JSA in WWII actually sounds great to me. Something where Ridley can just do as he pleases while a mainline JSA book does a more traditional take sounds like an “everyone wins” situation to me.
    Ridley seems pretty focused on the Silver Age and Bronze Age to some extent as far as character focus goes. I'm curious if he has any opinions on the Golden Age.

    I remember there was a rumor that Wonder Woman's book was going to turn into a WW and JSA series set during WWII.

  14. #194
    Astonishing Member HsssH's Avatar
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    Still not really a big fan of the format and "why superheroes ain't solving the real problems" talking points, but I liked this way more than the first issue.

    These characters have such messed up histories that only way to explain them in a coherent manner is to turn Teen Titans into bunch of assholes. I did complain about Superman being thrown under the bus in the first issue, but I'm less upset about Titans being showed in such light here. After all these two were Teen Titans characters so who else can you really blame asides of breaking 4th wall and shouting at former writers and editors.

  15. #195
    Mighty Member chamber-music's Avatar
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    Ridley is mashing DC's fictional history with real world history which would obviously bring up some real moral and ethical conundrums for any hero. The heroes are mostly portrayed more in line with written how they were at the time the stories were published which is going to be different from how they are portrayed now due to the social changes. Under this context I don't have much issue with the criticisms.

    The whole one in and out black character thing reminded me of Peter Milligan's X-Statix at Marvel in which the black superhero Spike was terrified he would be killed off as there was already another black male superhero on the team.

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