WW vs Kryptonians

[BiteTheBullet]

I think we saw the answer to this question in the Justice League movie.

She has no chance whatsoever. Besides the fact that she can't fly, her lasso had no real effect on Superman. Her vaunted speed was no match for Superman as she couldn't even bang her bracers together before Supes grabbed her arms and they did the head butting routine.

Lets turn this around...do people think she could have done the same to the League as Superman did to them if the roles were reversed? Not in a million years would be my opinion.

So...we know the DCEU doesn't think much about Wonder Woman, at least with respect to Superman. If they did, they would have her fly and show off her 'best melee fighter' status. Where in the 3 movies that she has been in has she shown this skill? It isn't Doomsday since he wasn't shown to be a skillful fighter. It is all lip service as usual.

[Lex Luthor]

Thanks, Gemini.

So WW is probably equal to the strongest female Kryptonians, stronger than average and untrained Kryptonians, equal to average male Kryptonians and slightly weaker than strong/trained male Kryptonians like Superman?

I doubt we'll get a clear understanding from the comics but this seems to be the best answer.

[LadyP]

I think we saw the answer to this question in the Justice League movie.

She has no chance whatsoever. Besides the fact that she can't fly, her lasso had no real effect on Superman. Her vaunted speed was no match for Superman as she couldn't even bang her bracers together before Supes grabbed her arms and they did the head butting routine.

Lets turn this around...do people think she could have done the same to the League as Superman did to them if the roles were reversed? Not in a million years would be my opinion.

So...we know the DCEU doesn't think much about Wonder Woman, at least with respect to Superman. If they did, they would have her fly and show off her 'best melee fighter' status. Where in the 3 movies that she has been in has she shown this skill? It isn't Doomsday since he wasn't shown to be a skillful fighter. It is all lip service as usual.

Ugh! The level of frustration and anger that scene brings me. Hopefully the flop of the JL movie and the wild success of WWs movie will finally give them a clue that her character is one that is not only iconic through lip service as you termed it, but that she has a large audience base, even greater now in number, that love and care for this character and won't tolerate the disservice she usually receives.


In regards to the actual thread post, I've always been of the mindset that if Wonder Woman must be weaker than Kryptonians for whatever reason, then the difference in strength should only be marginal, especially between her and Superman. What makes her a powerhouse and a real opponent is the combination of her strength/skills/magic based weapons.

[marhawkman]

In terms of fighting skill.... I'd say WW or Deva would be capable of matching the skills of most street level characters.

A good example of what'd happen for an un-skilled super vs a skilled human fighter was seen in YJ: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I3ztzd8vSOw

I'm not even sure I'd go so far as to say Lobo lacks skill. He's a brawler not a martial artist, but he's got years of experience. He tossed a demigoddess like a rag doll. He barely even noticed Batgirl was there. She had to set HE on his clothes and detonate it just to stagger him. Even that did little more than slowing him down.

That is what street-level vs Kryptonian level looks like in DC when it's NOT a Bat-god fight.

I would say WW would be a better fighter than Lobo. But strength matters a lot. In that clip it's obvious that even a demigoddess like Cassie isn't strong enough to over power Lobo. WW would be a lot closer, but also WW is a more skilled fighter too. But yeah, another good example was in the BvS: Apocalypse movie: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jFhImA0TRck

WW showed Supergirl just how feeble her fighting skills were. So yeah, a Kryptonian who's a sucky fighter vs WW... OWNED. Someone like Faora or Car-vex? Hmm...

[AmiMizuno]

But should a good fighter be able to beat Wondie ?

[BiteTheBullet]

But should a good fighter be able to beat Wondie ?

Depends on how they treat the 'lip service' that has been promoted yet never/rarely shown in the actual comics.

[Gaelforce]

But should a good fighter be able to beat Wondie ?

You mean non-powered? Absolutely not.

[richalex]

But should a good fighter be able to beat Wondie ?

You mean non-powered? Absolutely not.

Not even Karate Kid from the Legion?

[Shadowedeyes]

Karate Kid. Non-powered. Riiight.

Yah, I know, the comics don't consider him metahuman or powered, but he's got such ridiculous Charles Atlas superpowers it's silly.

[AmiMizuno]

If Wonder Woman were to be non-powered where would she be at? A friend of mind said she would be beaten by lady shrivel sinxe she is a beater fighter . Also if a kyrotpian was a great fighter should they beat Wonder Woman ?

[Agniwolf]

If Wonder Woman were to be non-powered where would she be at? A friend of mind said she would be beaten by lady shrivel sinxe she is a beater fighter . Also if a kyrotpian was a great fighter should they beat Wonder Woman ?

if non powered the better fighter should win most of the time (after all luck is a game changer, like it or not) if powered then the winner most of the time should be the one with the best array of resources, and the kryptonians do have the best array than most other powered beings, so a skilled fighter on top of best array of resources/powers is a gamebreaker, like it or not

[Shadowedeyes]

Hard to say. They've never really done a story where a depowered Wonder Woman had to fight anyone of note that I can think of, so it's hard to say exactly how skill wise she measures up to people like Shiva or even Batman. As for a skilled kryptonian? Realistically it's up to the writer and their needs for the story. Beyond that, you'd assume that if training is what "equalizes" her chances in a fight against Superman, that reducing the skill gap would indeed put her at a disadvantage. Not taking into account various factors anyway.

[richalex]

I think there are three levels to Diana's Martial Abilities.

1. Superhuman - She should be the top dog in Martial Abilities concerning Super-Humans, imo.

2. Amazon - I'm not sure this should be considered Super-Human, depending on the Continuity, but more Peak Human since they refuse to have the Amazons as anything Super-Human, or Super-Intelligent anymore. (Or should that be Wonder-Human and Wonder-Intelligent.) Anyway She wouldn't necessarily be top dog here. I like her being second best, as there are Amazons stronger, faster, smarter, but she's the best at using all of those abilities together.

3. Human - She might be a bit further down the food chain, but that doesn't mean she can't move up. One constant we've seen, I believe, is that Diana loves to learn new things. She also believe in practicing the things she has learned, and keeping her skills honed.

[AmiMizuno]

Is it cheating that I feel that Diana should be in the top 5 best fighters? I mean Athena is the God of war. Wouldn't Diana have known a lot of skills? I mean even if Athena is Greek goddess I do think she should have to know what is to come. I mean Athena should know many different fighting skills. I think she should be even depowered be a great fighter

[theoneandonly]

Well if you take logic out of the window as most writers do most fighters even superhuman fighters have a degree of fighting ability which they show on the rare occasions they lose powers or are at a disadvantage. for example superman has been shown to display knowledge of pressure points to disable a kryptonite batman plus he without superpowers was able to beat kobra who was occupying Batman's body while he himself was occupying kobras body. considering kobra has beaten batman this was the most ridiculous pis. so whether Diana would or wouldn't defeat Shiva or black canary or batwoman will be ultimately decide by the stories demands.