The Minority Displacement Thread

[Silver Fang]

Being Jewish is an ethnicity and a religion, not a race. though i guess some people can disagree

They've definitely endured a history of oppression and I can appreciate characters representing them in the comics, but I don't think they've been mishandled by the X-Office as POC.



Definitely. I think editors need to crack down on this more. There's different artistic interpretations and then there's just ridiculous cases like that.

Agreed. Different artists have their own style, and that's reasonable. But you should always be able to tell who the character is. They shouldn't be that drastically different.

Ken Lashley & Greg Land didn't draw Monet exactly the same, but she was in the vicinity of looking like the same character.
Banter-8.jpg
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Unlike some artists who just get random and go out of their way to change the character it seems. Or the original GenX series. Monet's design varied there too, but it was rarely anything drastic. I think the worst instances is when she & her sisters were literally yellow on occasion.

[wano]

No its not. Kitty and Magneto may be considered a part of a religious minority but they are NOT POC and it isnt antisemitic to say so

Actually the term POC is used to send conversations towards oppression of blacks and dismiss an ever growing antisemitism in America, it excludes Jewish people and their history in dealing with oppression

Yeah, it's more like being Islamic (religion) or Hispanic/Latino (ethnicity). You can be Jewish and various races (including white).

The only one who doesn't think that are white supremacists and besides not taking them seriously, they can't even agree on what being white is anyway.

Actually Jews don't see themselves as whites, they see themselves as Jews. And white is pretty much an incorrect term, the appropriate term is Caucasian and Jews don't include themselves in that

[ChronoRogue]

Agreed. Different artists have their own style, and that's reasonable. But you should always be able to tell who the character is. They shouldn't be that drastically different.

Ken Lashley & Greg Land didn't draw Monet exactly the same, but she was in the vicinity of looking like the same character.
Banter-8.jpg
14.jpg

Unlike some artists who just get random and go out of their way to change the character it seems. Or the original GenX series. Monet's design varied there too, but it was rarely anything drastic. I think the worst instances is when she & her sisters were literally yellow on occasion.

sigh...

At least the old Generation X tv show wasn't that bad?



It's hard to find a good image of her.

Jubilee in the series though lmao.




Apparently this actress was Jubilee. :thinking:

Actually the term POC is used to send conversations towards oppression of blacks and dismiss an ever growing antisemitism in America, it excludes Jewish people and their history in dealing with oppression

If being Jewish is being excluded, I don't think it has anything to do with antisemitism. Being a POC is about being clearly visible as a minority, without having to say anything, unlike ethnicities or religions which you can somewhat more effectively hide or avoid disclosing if you chose to.

Actually Jews don't see themselves as whites, they see themselves as Jews. And white is pretty much an incorrect term, the appropriate term is Caucasian and Jews don't include themselves in that

There's also people who make the argument you can't be middle-eastern and caucasian, which is not correct.

Both white and caucasian can be used, since both are used in many forms or survey's that ask about race.

Again you can be Jewish and various/multiple races, including white (even pre-dominately). So unless you are saying you can't be mostly caucasian and identify as jewish then...

[Sundowhn]

I think the only POC that has gotten used consistently in the last decade or so and thus 'caught on' is Monet (PAD -> Bunn -> Strain). Outside of her, maybe Warpath? Everyone else pops up and then leaves for random swashes of time.

I think the X-Office definitely needs to do better and devote more time to develop minority characters more. I get not wanting to force writers to use characters they don't care about, which is partly why I suspect Storm hasn't been written great. they don't care but feel obligated to include her somewhere and thus no stories or development But seriously out of the dozens of background or limbo'd POC mutant characters, there's not a couple that interest them? Come on X-Office. :/

That a parody character like Fantomex has gotten more consistent development is sad.

I don't think it's lack of interest, I think it's the guaranteed criticism they'll face, and they know it. I think that's what has happened to Storm. They don't want to risk it.

[wano]

Sorry for the derailment, my point was that in minority conversations Jewish people should be included and properly represented and don't dismiss them as not POC because that term tends to be used to dismiss the oppression they face from certain reactionary sectors of society (alt right, radical Muslims). And more proper representation from them should be included, not just kitty pride or magneto

[ChronoRogue]

I don't think it's lack of interest, I think it's the guaranteed criticism they'll face, and they know it. I think that's what has happened to Storm. They don't want to risk it.

Criticism if they use POC? Why would they get that from just using them? Also writers get criticized all the time anyway (see Gold).

[Sundowhn]

Sorry for the derailment, my point was that in minority conversations Jewish people should be included and properly represented and don't dismiss them as not POC because that term tends to be used to dismiss the oppression they face from certain reactionary sectors of society (alt right, radical Muslims). And more proper representation from them should be included, not just kitty pride or magneto

Yeah, they fall into the "not my minority" pile these discussions usually end up in.

[Silver Fang]

sigh...

At least the old Generation X tv show wasn't that bad?



It's hard to find a good image of her.

Jubilee in the series though lmao.




Apparently this actress was Jubilee. :thinking:

Yeah, Jubilee could've been better cast. Eck

That Monet isn't too bad. I didn't watch the show, but saw the cast and liked thought Monet was cast pretty well.

[Sundowhn]

Criticism if they use POC? Why would they get that from just using them? Also writers get criticized all the time anyway (see Gold).

Since Claremont, how many writers haven't been burned to bits by outspoken fans for misrepresenting Storm? There comes a point when it's easier not to bother, I think.

[ChronoRogue]

Sorry for the derailment, my point was that in minority conversations Jewish people should be included and properly represented and don't dismiss them as not POC because that term tends to be used to dismiss the oppression they face from certain reactionary sectors of society (alt right, radical Muslims). And more proper representation from them should be included, not just kitty pride or magneto

I think they should be included in conversations about minority representation along with religions, sexuality and ethnicity. My disagreement was more about the terms than thinking it's not important to also be diverse with those representations as well.

Since Claremont, how many writers haven't been burned to bits by outspoken fans for misrepresenting Storm? There comes a point when it's easier not to bother, I think.

It's probably my bad memory but who got flayed for not using Storm right? The only complaints I can remember is being Wolverine's arm-candy and the BP marriage.

I don't feel like they've really tried though. Post-Claremont the only writers I felt like they had a clear vision for Storm were Wood and Pak. Maybe Amsus in that really short Gambit & Storm one-shot. So basically stories that had her as a titular character or protagonist.

It'd be different if they actually put effort into it that showed, but I haven't seen many attempts at development in the first place.

[Havok83]

Sorry for the derailment, my point was that in minority conversations Jewish people should be included and properly represented and don't dismiss them as not POC because that term tends to be used to dismiss the oppression they face from certain reactionary sectors of society (alt right, radical Muslims). And more proper representation from them should be included, not just kitty pride or magneto

Iceman is Jewish and just had a push with a solo series this past year. Its ending but its false to say just Kitty and Magneto have been used

[Sundowhn]

Iceman is Jewish and just had a push with a solo series this past year. Its ending but its false to say just Kitty and Magneto have been used

Uh...I thought Iceman was Methodist?

[Sundowhn]

I think they should be included in conversations about minority representation along with religions, sexuality and ethnicity. My disagreement was more about the terms than thinking it's not important to also be diverse with those representations as well.



It's probably my bad memory but who got flayed for not using Storm right? The only complaints I can remember is being Wolverine's arm-candy and the BP marriage.

I don't feel like they've really tried though. Post-Claremont the only writers I felt like they had a clear vision for Storm were Wood and Pak. Maybe Amsus in that really short Gambit & Storm one-shot. So basically stories that had her as a titular character or protagonist.

It'd be different if they actually put effort into it that showed, but I haven't seen many attempts at development in the first place.

Morrison, Aaron, when she led, when she didn't lead, the crossover events, when she was married, when she wasn't married. Sorry, it just seems like every time a writer picks her up, he gets blasted for it.

[ChronoRogue]

Morrison, Aaron, when she led, when she didn't lead, the crossover events, when she was married, when she wasn't married. Sorry, it just seems like every time a writer picks her up, he gets blasted for it.

Morrison used her? O.o Did Aaron give her anything to do? That's why I mentioned the arm-candy thing.

IvX is the only legitimate one where a writer used her and was criticized for it. But it was more for her lack of action than anything. What you're listing is writer's having her on a team, not developing her.

Look at Rogue or Cyclops for comparison of characters that have story-lines that develop over time coherently. Even Emma's had more development despite her face-heel turn than Storm.

[Havok83]

Uh...I thought Iceman was Methodist?

From his first mini way back in the early 80s