Official : Bendis gets both books

[DragonPiece]

Jon is barely there since his return. He barely shows any panel presence. His backstory is not fleshed out and is heavily rushed. So, how is he better? He is far less energetic, less emotive and less cute. I know this all subjective. But, you were using your subjective opinion as facts.standing on his own.don't make me laugh. Since, when is joining legion standing on his own.
If you are a Damian fan don't talk about propping up and ridiculing characters. that is what his character's shtick has been since inception.
Having said that, the hate bendis is getting on this particular occasion is unfair. He seems enthusiastic and was sharing something he believes in. Come on guys. I get it. I really do,we feel robbed and this doesn't feel the same. But, give the guy a break.sooner or later we will get our jon back,if he sticks around long enough. I believe he will. I am optimistic.

barely there? Jon has been in every issue of superman since his return.

[Sacred Knight]

If anything I'm getting a bad feeling things are starting to take a turn back to too much focus on him. Hopeful that I'm just being paranoid and Bendis keeps a good balance and doesn't fall into a Tomasi-like trap.

[manwhohaseverything]

This all subjective ofcourse. And i was being subjective. Not talking about panel space strictly. I mean, he is just there. Clark and kara has a presence and feels like them/their pov actually matters. I felt more emotional connection to jon in that justice league page. And He is not really there. It was just his spirit. But, both generations of jons mattered in that book.
And i am not talking about focus. I want jon's appearance to be meaningful, even if it's short.all these issues and like you said sacred "too much focus" . I still don't know what this jon is about. Why the hell is he doing all this? Why did he want return to space again to fight a war after just coming back? For adventure or fun and mischief or just his sense of responsibility ? Has this jon gotten angry or sad after his return? No. Do we know what can make this jon angry? No.
In this space war arc, i know why clark, kara,zod heck even jor el and rogol zarr are there. But for jon, i don't know.
For the kid version , it was fun and mischief combined with a sense of curiosity and wonder, a bit of responsibility(yeah! Right. As if) . I don't get the old jon. Nor is he relatable.so, his presence feels hollow. Even with a backstory(which was rushed) of an abusive weird caretaker in Ultraman.
On top of that, how can i put it? He is like a wet blanket compared to the old self. He doesn't pop.

[Steven Caldwell]

No the title of this thread should be Official: People constantly shitting on Bendis b/c he doesn't do what they personally want

Some people call that an opinion. Some even post their opinions on a message board. Imagine that.

[Superlad93]

Why did he want return to space again to fight a war after just coming back?

For his grandfather. He's stated that clearly. He feels a level of responsibility over his grandpa, and worried about what's happened to him after all these years.

In this space war arc, i know why clark, kara,zod heck even jor el and rogol zarr are there.

And we know why Jon is there. He's worried about what his grandfather has gotten into. It's ironic that you list Jor-El, because he's the one character here we don't actually have a lock-ed in motivation for.

Clark's there for answers from his father and for Zaar, Zod is there to kill Zaar and anyone else involved in the assassination, Kara is there to blow the whistle on the whole thing, Zaar is there finished what he started 30 some odd years ago, and Jon's there because he cares about his grandpa and he'll always back-up his dad. We know these things.

What I think you might be in the market for is an issue or two of current day Jon driving the plot. That's a fair thing to want given he's just gotten back, but, to put things into perspective, it's only been literally 2 issues of present day Jon in an ongoing story. I think there are very strong thematic links coming up soon, and we basically know he's about to drive some plot forward in the next 3 issues.

[Kon93]

Bendis posted it on Instagram

[kurenai24]

Bendis posted it on Instagram

I never read anything about the Zoo Crew, I'm excited to see them.

[manwhohaseverything]

For his grandfather. He's stated that clearly. He feels a level of responsibility over his grandpa, and worried about what's happened to him after all these years.



And we know why Jon is there. He's worried about what his grandfather has gotten into. It's ironic that you list Jor-El, because he's the one character here we don't actually have a lock-ed in motivation for.

That is the thing though, jon - jor el relationship is not nearly fleshed out for me to get that jon is worried about grandad. I mean, his grandad is basically a stranger. He is also distant to jon and had some hand in some of the incidents back on earth. Why would jon feel responsible for a complete stranger?
You can say that jon is responsible, will help anyone and is the "son of a hero". But, that has never been his primary motivation as a kid. It was always the call of adventure and mischief . He will certainly help people don't get me wrong, but to a limit and as a side effect. Its like goku saving the world, because he likes to fight. To go back to space where he just came from , adult jon needs better motive.
Since, i don't know if the old motivation of jon as a kid still matters. If it does then bendis needed to show that jon is still the mischief seeking kid, who likes to have the reputation of a boyscout good boy(sort of like hermione in harry potter).Old jon would have gone, but his grandpa wouldn't have been the main reason. but to have a weird adventure.
Else if grandad was the reason for this current adult jon then bendis needed to flesh their relationship out. Which he didn't. Also, if it was just civic duty that propelled adult jon to space. Then bendis should have made it clear that adult jon has grown into the role of a hero from someone who as kid was goofing off.
I added jor el hesitantly, because his motivation and background are currently being fleshed out. But, we do know what he wants. His motive is to unite the universe. His desire of unity and his "whatever it takes" attitude lands him trouble as he lost jon while trying to find him.

[Superlad93]

That is the thing though, jon - jor el relationship is not nearly fleshed out for me to get that jon is worried about grandad. I mean, his grandad is basically a stranger. He is also distant to jon and had some hand in some of the incidents back on earth. Why would jon feel responsible for a complete stranger?

I largely disagree with your reading of what child Jon's motivations were, but that's it's own matter that doesn't need going in on. What I'll talk about here is what the 7 issues of Jon related content in this run have expressed so far.

In Jon's own words, he respects Jor-El for trying to be every bit the hero Jon's dad was, he also recognizes that Jor-El has spent years searching for him throughout the infinity of time and space, and also saved him from from Earth-3. Jon goes back into space because there might be something genuinely wrong with Jor-El, and since that's his father's father Jon wants to do whatever he can to help and support. That's why Jon says "sorry pa" after he breaks the news about Jor-El to Clark in issue 7. He knows how much his father holds Jor-El in high regard.

And, yeah, however corny or whatever you wanna make it out to sound, the kid just wants to do the right thing. Again, very clearly in the text, back on Earth-3 he talked about how he would help people even when his help wasn't well received.

After Earth-3 Jon's confidence in himself and his worthiness of the shield is also quite high in comparison to what he shared with Jor-El in issue 8. He's quite proud of himself for living up to the ideals set by his parents even while on a whole diametrically opposed to them, so it stands to reason that he goes back out there because he wants to deal with whatever his grandfather has gotten into, help his father, AND because that's what someone who has earned that S would do. That's why he doesn't rest or falter.

[manwhohaseverything]

I largely disagree with your reading of what child Jon's motivations were, but that's it's own matter that doesn't need going in on. What I'll talk about here is what the 7 issues of Jon related content in this run have expressed so far.

In Jon's own words, he respects Jor-El for trying to be every bit the hero Jon's dad was, he also recognizes that Jor-El has spent years searching for him throughout the infinity of time and space, and also saved him from from Earth-3. Jon goes back into space because there might be something genuinely wrong with Jor-El, and since that's his father's father Jon wants to do whatever he can to help and support. That's why Jon says "sorry pa" after he breaks the news about Jor-El to Clark in issue 7. He knows how much his father holds Jor-El in high regard.

And, yeah, however corny or whatever you wanna make it out to sound, the kid just wants to do the right thing. Again, very clearly in the text, back on Earth-3 he talked about how he would help people even when his help wasn't well received.

After Earth-3 Jon's confidence in himself and his worthiness of the shield is also quite high in comparison to what he shared with Jor-El in issue 8. He's quite proud of himself for living up to the ideals set by his parents even while on a whole diametrically opposed to them, so it stands to reason that he goes back out there because he wants to deal with whatever his grandfather has gotten into, help his father, AND because that's what someone who has earned that S would do. That's why he doesn't rest or falter.

You might disagree with my interpretation of kid jon's motivation, but for me he has been always that way. I am not saying jon doesn't like helping people or doesn't help people.he does. From time to time he stands up to bullies or helps old lady like his parents . But, its not his thing. But, what he loves to do is go on fun adventures and get into mischief especially with Damian.i mean, look at their dynamic jon is fun loving kid and damian is experienced kid who act like a grumpy old man. For damian heroics is serious work and way to inherit his father's mantle, but for jon it is adventure time. Ofcourse it started to change for jon when reality started to set in. But, still jon was pretty much in adventure mode.

I guess, that is why the lobo-jon confrontation was added To make jon go from fun loving boy to a responsible man.

I don't remember reading jon complimenting jor el. Nor, did i get that jon holds jor el in this high regard you are talking about. Clark holding Jor el in high regard after oz effect itself is something i can't digest. So, jon saying 'sorry pa' felt more like a sorry for their predicament and his own growth.sorry, i just don't by the clark-jor el relation currently. let alone jon-jor el relation.

you are right about , jon on earth 3.i guess i forgot about that since i didn't see jon actually saving or helping anyone. again the changes from above-mentioned fun loving kid to this responsible hero happened feels too rushed for me. So, i still feel left in the dust with regards to jon and who he is now.
I guess, i would have to take civic duty and 'doing the right thing' as motivation for now as you said.

[Superlad93]

You might disagree with my interpretation of kid jon's motivation, but for me he has been always that way.

As I said, I have a fundamental disagreement with your reading of the character, and it's not a conversation I'm not particularly interested in having.

don't remember reading jon complimenting jor el.

Issue 8. He explains that everytime he and Jor-El would come to a new world and new conflict, Jor-El would try and resolve it as peacefully as possible. And he compared it favorably to Clark.

Nor, did i get that jon holds jor el in this high regard you are talking about.

I don't think I said that. I said Clark holds Jor-El in high regard.

Clark holding Jor el in high regard after oz effect itself is something i can't digest.

Well, it's show in the text several times. I can name each if you like. He obviously doesn't blame his father for something he did while mind controlled.

So, jon saying 'sorry pa' felt more like a sorry for their predicament and his own growth

That's not the context the text puts it in. Jon says sorry specifically after he says that they need to do something about Jor-El, thus that's what he's apologizing for.

[Sam]

Even if Clark doesn't hold the mind control against Jor-El, Jor-El should still be a stranger to him. He doesn't really know him enough to trust his kid with him.

[manwhohaseverything]

As I said, I have a fundamental disagreement with your reading of the character, and it's not a conversation I'm not particularly interested in having.



Issue 8. He explains that everytime he and Jor-El would come to a new world and new conflict, Jor-El would try and resolve it as peacefully as possible. And he compared it favorably to Clark.



I don't think I said that. I said Clark holds Jor-El in high regard.



Well, it's show in the text several times. I can name each if you like. He obviously doesn't blame his father for something he did while mind controlled.



That's not the context the text puts it in. Jon says sorry specifically after he says that they need to do something about Jor-El, thus that's what he's apologizing for.

Come on man, when has jon ever tried to be superboy because it was the right thing to do. The first time he did, he basically snuck out. Granted damian pressured him, but jon caved in. pretty quickly, i might add. Then he got scared of seeing dead bodies. That was neither right thing to do or responsible thing to do. I understand, if you wish to not talk about it. I will not continue.
I wasn't saying that clark doesn't hold jor el in high regards after bendis took over. I was just saying he shouldn't. In last issue of oz effect, Clark's whole system of trust was shaken about jor el. I haven't seen jor el do anything to regain it. It wasn't just mind control,there was a level of ambiguity there. Otherwise, there would have been no need for the backstory on earth and how he was brainwashed.Dr manhattan hasn't shown me anything that says he mind controls people. Neither in watchmen or doomsday clock. He likes deconstructing people and breaking them. Not mind controlling them.
"grandpa is completely crazy and we have to do something about it" jon then pauses, looks at clark and says "sorry pa". I read it as sorry that this all happened and for this predicament as a whole.
Anyways, i just don't buy jor el angle. It's full of inconsistencies.jor el has yet to answer for the things he did in oz effect. If wally can be sent to jail,then jor el should be accountable as well. Until, he does i just don't see him as "good guy". Clark's trust in jor el is pretty much hard to digest. Seeing as he is a stranger. Just because someone is your biological father doesn't mean you would trust them. Especially, since Clark's first encounter with jor el is basically as a cult leader.

[Steven Caldwell]

I standy by what I said. I don't like Bendis.
But hey, his run will end eventually. The world keeps on spinning.

[rpmaluki]

Come on man, when has jon ever tried to be superboy because it was the right thing to do. The first time he did, he basically snuck out. Granted damian pressured him, but jon caved in. pretty quickly, i might add. Then he got scared of seeing dead bodies. That was neither right thing to do or responsible thing to do. I understand, if you wish to not talk about it. I will not continue.
I wasn't saying that clark doesn't hold jor el in high regards after bendis took over. I was just saying he shouldn't. In last issue of oz effect, Clark's whole system of trust was shaken about jor el. I haven't seen jor el do anything to regain it. It wasn't just mind control,there was a level of ambiguity there. Otherwise, there would have been no need for the backstory on earth and how he was brainwashed.Dr manhattan hasn't shown me anything that says he mind controls people. Neither in watchmen or doomsday clock. He likes deconstructing people and breaking them. Not mind controlling them.
"grandpa is completely crazy and we have to do something about it" jon then pauses, looks at clark and says "sorry pa". I read it as sorry that this all happened and for this predicament as a whole.
Anyways, i just don't buy jor el angle. It's full of inconsistencies.jor el has yet to answer for the things he did in oz effect. If wally can be sent to jail,then jor el should be accountable as well. Until, he does i just don't see him as "good guy". Clark's trust in jor el is pretty much hard to digest. Seeing as he is a stranger. Just because someone is your biological father doesn't mean you would trust them. Especially, since Clark's first encounter with jor el is basically as a cult leader.

Jon aspires to be like his dad and that also includes doing what he believes is right based on how his parents brought him up. In his first SS arc he was sneaking out with Damian but there was a point where he did something because it was the right thing to do, like going back for the sister when they were under heavy attack, if my memory serves me right. This aged up Jon isn't doing anything that his young version hasn't done before. The difference is that we are super analysing every single shot/word bubble since he showed up compared to his younger counterpart, whom we let live his (sometimes questionable) life without judgement.

As for Clark and Jor-El, we should be getting some answers soon, whether they satisfy you or not.