Official : Bendis gets both books

[Jackalope89]

I still refuse to acknowledge that character as Jon. That is Earth 3 Ultraboy, inserting himself deep within Earth 1/Prime/whatever and relaying information to the Crime Syndicate. Real Jon is stuck in the Daycare from Hell on Earth 3, with his powers neutralized, and dealing with annoyingly evil things. Like pencils that stay dull, frustratingly inaccurate educational materials, awful tasting healthy food, etc.

[Frontier]

And I'm sure Bendis respects and is aware of that given the fact that he's said multiple times that he knows he's gonna take some lumps from Legion fans for this.

And remember that this is just speculation. For all we know Saturn Girl has been dating Lighting Lad this whole time.

Here's hoping .

[MeGrimlock420]

I still refuse to acknowledge that character as Jon. That is Earth 3 Ultraboy, inserting himself deep within Earth 1/Prime/whatever and relaying information to the Crime Syndicate. Real Jon is stuck in the Daycare from Hell on Earth 3, with his powers neutralized, and dealing with annoyingly evil things. Like pencils that stay dull, frustratingly inaccurate educational materials, awful tasting healthy food, etc.

I'm just hoping that's the case.

[DragonPiece]

I'm just hoping that's the case.

It's not, Bendis has said on the word baloon podcast that he wanted to make it clear this wans't a fakeout and that he wasn't trying to trick readers with a fake Jon, but just the actual character aged up. I don't think bendis is trying to pull a superiro spider-man on us. :P

[Eto]

I personally don't give a damn if Jon is gay or not, though I find the idea of him and Damian pretty gross. Let them be bros without any weird sexual undercurrent.

Well, I do give a damn, but that's just me I guess. Agreed, regarding the latter. Exactly, not everthing has to be sexual.

But Tomasi established something? Yeah, he established that Jon, at age ten, assumed he'd marry a girl someday and had a ten year old's crush on a couple girls. I don't believe that counts for very much, since at that age people are just kinda following the social scripts. If Jon had been older and the hormones had been functioning, then sure that'd establish a little something. But a ten year old? No, that doesn't amount to a damn thing as far as establishing what Jon likes as a mostly-grown young man.

Yes and no. Yeah, there may be not that much of establishing, but we should bear in mind that he's half kryptonian. For all we know he matures faster than the average kid regarding hormones you brought up.

[Superlad93]

Yes and no. Yeah, there may be not that much of establishing, but we should bear in mind that he's half kryptonian. For all we know he matures faster than the average kid regarding hormones you brought up.

Wouldn't that be up to the writer and editor given the fact that that's just conjecture on your part and not something established previously?

[Eto]

Wouldn't that be up to the writer and editor given the fact that that's just conjecture on your part and not something established previously?

Ooh definitely, but I don't think the current writer will delve deep and answer these kind of questions (or other questions for that matter) which leaves me no choice but to spitball here. It's there because it's there, we just have to accept it and move on, that's how I feel regarding Bendis' Superman/AC/LSH.

[manwhohaseverything]

Okay, jon's sexuality is being given more importance than it should be, here. If jon does turn out to be gay or bisexual. Then all i want is some good romance as a side to the main ingredient. That's it. How does it change anything if his love interest is guy or girl?
Anyways, jon lifting the trident, lack of the oceans in legion earth and now supersons reunion. Something tells me, jon's trip back to present will be very important. Also, i haven't read much aquaman. Isn't the trident, king arthur/hammer of thor type of deal? Jon being aquaman for seconds has to be significant.

[Robanker]

Okay, jon's sexuality is being given more importance than it should be, here. If jon does turn out to be gay or bisexual. Then all i want is some good romance as a side to the main ingredient. That's it. How does it change anything if his love interest is guy or girl?
Anyways, jon lifting the trident, lack of the oceans in legion earth and now supersons reunion. Something tells me, jon's trip back to present will be very important. Also, i haven't read much aquaman. Isn't the trident, king arthur/hammer of thor type of deal? Jon being aquaman for seconds has to be significant.

Eh, anyone can use the Trident but I think Arthur gets more out of it via some True King deal. The Trident has always had some inconsistency to it.

[Knightsilver]

It's not, Bendis has said on the word baloon podcast that he wanted to make it clear this wans't a fakeout and that he wasn't trying to trick readers with a fake Jon, but just the actual character aged up. I don't think bendis is trying to pull a superiro spider-man on us. :P

Then a Jon from the Dark Multiverse it is!

[Jackalope89]

It's not, Bendis has said on the word baloon podcast that he wanted to make it clear this wans't a fakeout and that he wasn't trying to trick readers with a fake Jon, but just the actual character aged up. I don't think bendis is trying to pull a superiro spider-man on us. :P

Earth 3 Jon is an actual Jon. So, no fake out and the headcanon lives on!

[walk]

Reading some of this thread, I wouldn't expect the most nuanced discussion when it comes to sexuality on a comic book forum but still... yikes.

I'm not even a fan of the Jon/Damian pairing (and if your personally not as well that's fine) but this notion that it's somehow "sick" or "disgusting" is boderline homophobic.

While I definately thinks its inappropriate of the fans who sexualise them (or any minors) there are tons of examples within media that depict adolescents as young as them having crushes on their friends and the like with shippers abound, if that suddenly becomes morally wrong to you because it now involves two boys well that's telling.

Be honest with yourselves if Jon was Joanna you'd be perfectly fine with their being some sort of romantic tension between her and Damian, in fact you'd expect it.

Ultimately I guess it doesn't matter now as any notion of any kind of romance between the two certainly would be inappropriate due to the age gap.

I actually think Jon discovering he was gay when he was still a kid would've meant more as it's not something often depicted in media and could help destigmatize a bias that going by this thread clearly still exists.

We gay people are no different from you straights as kids, we get crushes and start feeling things to, only in our case it can be incredibly lonely, sad, confusing and frightening time as we've little to no sources in media tellling us that what were feeling isn't wrong and I think seeing a young Jon going through the same thing could've helped a few kids.

[Frontier]

Eh, anyone can use the Trident but I think Arthur gets more out of it via some True King deal. The Trident has always had some inconsistency to it.

I think the movie is the only time they've ever established that the Trident represents the "one true king."

Reading some of this thread, I wouldn't expect the most nuanced discussion when it comes to sexualuty on a comic book forum but still... yikes.

I'm not even a fan of the Jon/Damian pairing and if your personally not as well that's fine but this notion that it's somehow "sick" or "disgusting" is boderline homophobic.

While I definately thinks its inappropriate of the fans who sexualise them or any minors there are tons of examples within media that depict adolescents as young as them having crushes on their friends and the like with shippers abound, if that suddenly becomes morally wrong to you because it now involves two boys well that's telling.

Be honest with yourselves if Jon was Joanna you'd be perfectly fine with their being some sort of romantic tension between her and Damian, in fact you'd expect it.

Ultimately I guess it doesn't matter now as any notion of any kind of romance between the two certainly would be inappropriate due to the age gap.

I actually think Jon discovering he was gay when he was still a kid would've meant more as it's not something often depicted in media and could help destigmatize a bias that going by this thread clearly still exists.

We gay people are no different from you straights as kids, we get crushes and start feeling things to, only in our case it can be incredibly lonely, sad, confusing and frightening time as we've little to no sources in media tellling us that what were feeling isn't wrong and I think seeing a young Jon going through the same thing could've helped a few kids.

I don't think it would be sick or wrong, but I don't think it should be a factor in the relationship between the Super Sons because I just don't think that's the kind of relationship they have.

[Superlad93]

For the record, all I said was that *maaaaybe* Jon, as a 10 year old, had a crush on Damian *IF* the idea is to not make him straight. Then in the present he'd have grown (the metaphor being obvious) out of it, and then they'd just remain friends.

Again, not a hill I'm gonna die on, and it's not even something that's happened.

[Ascended]

Yes and no. Yeah, there may be not that much of establishing, but we should bear in mind that he's half kryptonian. For all we know he matures faster than the average kid regarding hormones you brought up.

The most we have to go on in current continuity is Jor-El saying (in the MoS mini, I think) that Kryptonians mature a bit faster than humans. Bendis appears to be using a pre-Crisis model where a Kryptonian was considered an adult by age 15 instead of 18. Using that math, at age 10 Jon was just barely entering an age where romance is a consideration, and then he left for space. This fits, to a point, with Jon's characterization as well as Clark's knowledge of Kryptonian biology.

Jon was allowed to put on a cape and operate with a remarkable degree of autonomy at a very young age, displaying the faster rate of maturation that Kryptonians have over humans. But looking at other elements of Jon's characterization, specifically his emotional maturity, it's clear that in many ways he was a rather ordinary ten year old kid. So I'm pretty confident that ten year old Jon wasn't any more sexually mature than the average ten year old boy. Which is to say, just barely past the point where he'd think girls are gross and have cooties.

He could very well be gay or pan or anything. His little crushes don't mean anything; plenty of gay people had crushes on the opposite sex at that age. At that developmental level it's often more about social roles and figuring out how/where you fit than it is about what you actually find attractive. So yeah, Jon could be anything. And he's only existed for a few years anyway, it's not like anything about his character is really all that set in stone.

Be honest with yourselves if Jon was Joanna you'd be perfectly fine with their being some sort of romantic tension between her and Damian, in fact you'd expect it.

Thanks for telling me what I think.

No, I actually wouldn't expect sexual tension between "Joanna" and Damian. We're talking about a couple pre-teens; I wouldn't expect anything romantic or sexual at all. They were kids for f*cks sake. And regardless of the genders/orientations involved I'd find any push for a romantic entanglement of any kind to be in exceedingly poor taste. I didn't want anything happening between Damian and Nobody (who was a girl, for anyone who doesn't remember her) either.

Now, some of us have said the idea of Jon and Damian puts us off. And I won't speak for why others feel this way but I'm willing to bet that most of them probably feel as I do. These two kids were portrayed and written with a very brotherly bond from very early on. Their entire dynamic has felt like a pair of siblings getting into trouble more than anything else. Adding romance into that makes it feel incestuous. If Jon ends up being gay, cool. He's a young man now and he can find a nice guy who will treat him right and I'll happily read the stories. But Damian is essentially his brother. That's just gross.

For the record, all I said was that *maaaaybe* Jon, as a 10 year old, had a crush on Damian *IF* the idea is to not make him straight. Then in the present he'd have grown (the metaphor being obvious) out of it, and then they'd just remain friends.

Again, not a hill I'm gonna die on, and it's not even something that's happened.

Was there ever any kind of foreshadowing or hints about this that I might've missed somewhere? I'll happily adjust my opinion if there's stuff in the books I didn't catch.