Official : Bendis gets both books

[OpaqueGiraffe17]

King said several times in no uncertain terms that Bat/Cat is in continuity. He even re tweeted and replied to Tynion's comments when doing so. Then on Word Balloon recently he clarified that Bat/Cat will be defining continuity for Batman, and the Helena story is in continuity, but his further clarification was that it's not something the books have to react to just yet, so in that sense Tynion was right, but it remains very much in continuity.



Feels like the implications are that other teams will be taking over the Superman and Action Comics books and Bendis will continue his established threads in the 5G imprint/future with Jon as Superman.

Having just googled that, I’m seeing mixed messages, but the more recent results are saying that Bat/Cat not canon. The older results saying that it might be canon, makes me think I was likely onto something with plans changing, not unlike this.

[manwhohaseverything]

Unless whoever takes over is a fan of Bendis’ work or is a friend of Bendis like Fraction, I wouldn’t be surprised at all if we see another shake up when Bendis departs the books. Wouldn’t be the first time. Doesn’t mean they’ll sweep everything out, but hell thats happened before too.

I don't think they will wipe out everything. I am just so done with drama and jon. Its suffocating the character. The character isn't built like postcrisis superman in that sense. He is better of punching bullies/monsters/aliens, than "exploring relationships" and "teen angst volcano nonsense " .These things are better as background.They didn't even explore the character .What is with supercharacters being stuck in drama?Since, snyder is in charge in some fashion. I have a better hope for future. The guy is second only to tomasi and jurgen when it comes getting jon

[Superlad93]

Having just googled that, I’m seeing mixed messages, but the more recent results are saying that Bat/Cat not canon. The older results saying that it might be canon, makes me think I was likely onto something with plans changing, not unlike this.

Were they quotes by either King, Tynion, or someone working for DC? Or were they headlines going off or interpreting the initial Tynion interview where Bat/Cat's continuity was put into question (the same interview that King directly replied to and corrected)?

I'm tell you what Tom King himself said just 2 weeks ago. I have yet to hear any different from any official source.

[Korath]

That entire rumor sounds like a complete deal breaker in-continuity, but if it's only a "kind of maybe happens?" future then at worst it's just a forgettable alternate future like when Batman Beyond goes bad (Tim as Batman Beyond).

That's key.

But that Bottled Metropolis has to go. Don't ruin Jon by making him a dick as an adult. Moreover, "Superman" and "authoritarian" are pretty much oxymoronic in nature. I can't abide it. That alone nearly sours me on the entire premise. It's antithetical to the character.

Superman as seen in All-Star and co is an authoritarian at heart. He's just too aloof/lazy to implement his rule there.

Really, baring New 52's Supes, most of his takes are only a step away of being a authocrat, what with his conservatives values and take on the world and his holier than thou attitude.

[OpaqueGiraffe17]

Were they quotes by either King, Tynion, or someone working for DC? Or were they headlines going off or interpreting the initial Tynion interview where Bat/Cat's continuity was put into question (the same interview that King directly replied to and corrected)?

I'm tell you what Tom King himself said just 2 weeks ago. I have yet to hear any different from any official source.

Do you have a link? Because I'm just seeing mixed messages, mostly leaning towards no.

Superman as seen in All-Star and co is an authoritarian at heart. He's just too aloof/lazy to implement his rule there.

Really, baring New 52's Supes, most of his takes are only a step away of being a authocrat, what with his conservatives values and take on the world and his holier than thou attitude.

What part of All-Star gave you that impression? It had that whole story where he turned on the other kryptonians for being authocrats.

[Korath]

Do you have a link? Because I'm just seeing mixed messages, mostly leaning towards no.


What part of All-Star gave you that impression? It had that whole story where he turned on the other kryptonians for being authocrats.

He hoard knowledge and technologies because the monkeys on Earth aren't worth them and does nothing to try and uplift them. He is a general dick and arrogant asshat in All-Star and befriends only geniuses and powerful peoples. He gives lip service to a teen on the verge of suicide but does nothing to try and change the reasons which drives her and so many other tu a desperate end.

All-Star Superman is a torture to read and an horrible story about a Conservative knowing better than you what's good and that society as it is must be preserved because it's how it is. i hate this fucking book with a passion, if I could erase it from all reality I would. The whole Truth was leagues better than that piece of **** in my eyes.

[OpaqueGiraffe17]

He hoard knowledge and technologies because the monkeys on Earth aren't worth them and does nothing to try and uplift them. He is a general dick and arrogant asshat in All-Star and befriends only geniuses and powerful peoples. He gives lip service to a teen on the verge of suicide but does nothing to try and change the reasons which drives her and so many other tu a desperate end.

All-Star Superman is a torture to read and an horrible story about a Conservative knowing better than you what's good and that society as it is must be preserved because it's how it is. i hate this fucking book with a passion, if I could erase it from all reality I would. The whole Truth was leagues better than that piece of **** in my eyes.

Did new 52 Clark not keep cool **** in his fortress? If not then his loss.
All Star Superman seemed pretty close with Jimmy-who isn’t the brightest bulb. And even so I don’t really see the problem with Kal wanting to associate with smart people.
Anyway I never understood why fans like to finds ways to label versions of the character as liberal or conservative, when more than half the time the comic doesn’t even touch politics.

[Superlad93]

Do you have a link? Because I'm just seeing mixed messages, mostly leaning towards no.

Here's Tynion's interview, and also Mann's response (both June 12th) https://twitter.com/Clay_Mann_/statu...14177359081472.

Here's King's tweet (Jun 13th) https://twitter.com/tomkingtk/status...63815299309571

King on Word Balloon (2 weeks ago) simple to find on youtube. But to quickly sum it up for you, King says Bat/Cat is comparable to Long Halloween or Killing Joke and how they are both in continuity. Both were prestige books published outside of the main books, but both certainly happened, and affected the main continuity.

I imagine the sources that you're finding are working off interpretations of these. But as far as we, King has had the final public word on this, and it's that it's in continuity.

[manwhohaseverything]

He hoard knowledge and technologies because the monkeys on Earth aren't worth them and does nothing to try and uplift them. He is a general dick and arrogant asshat in All-Star and befriends only geniuses and powerful peoples. He gives lip service to a teen on the verge of suicide but does nothing to try and change the reasons which drives her and so many other tu a desperate end.

Riiiight, he is supposed to have a yard sale where he gives people shrink rays. That's gonna end well. Also i didn't know, he isn't supposed to know geniuses.I guess, he needs to drop relationship with his father as well. The gal is going through something. Superman helps her. How many "heroes" would even bother to do that? What's he supposed to do change the world into utopia devoid of issues for her?he is superman,not god.You seem to also be forgetting that clark is dieing and going through the something himself.Also, it's her issue that she needs to solve. Superman is just saying he is gonna be there as long as he can, for the ride. And it helped her.It's from winnie the pooh. In case, you didn't know. All the characters in winnie the pooh go through some things.That' s the theory anyway.

[Korath]

Riiiight, he is supposed to have a yard sale where he gives people shrink rays. That's gonna end well. Also i didn't know, he isn't supposed to know geniuses.I guess, he needs to drop relationship with his father as well. The gal is going through something. Superman helps her. How many "heroes" would even bother to do that? What's he supposed to do change the world into utopia devoid of issues for her?he is superman,not god.You seem to also be forgetting that clark is dieing and going through the something himself.Also, it's her issue that she needs to solve. Superman is just saying he is gonna be there as long as he can, for the ride. And it helped her.It's from winnie the pooh. In case, you didn't know. All the characters in winnie the pooh go through some things.That' s the theory anyway.

If he doesn't try to change the world, he may as well do nothing. We live in a broken society, in a civilization which basically worship greed and the destruction of the world and its life. if he doesn't fight to change it radically, he's part of the problem. And in All-Star, he's very much part of the problem. He prefers to feed sun-eaters than poor peoples of the world. He prefers to extols the virtues of a near-mad scientist instead of helping the little peoples. And even his freaking death is a cop-out. Turns out he was fine all along and was just transitioning into a Sun God entity.

All-Star is absolute garbage and one of the reason mainstream Superman is mostly unlikable in my opinion.

[manwhohaseverything]

If he doesn't try to change the world, he may as well do nothing. We live in a broken society, in a civilization which basically worship greed and the destruction of the world and its life. if he doesn't fight to change it radically, he's part of the problem. And in All-Star, he's very much part of the problem. He prefers to feed sun-eaters than poor peoples of the world. He prefers to extols the virtues of a near-mad scientist instead of helping the little peoples. And even his freaking death is a cop-out. Turns out he was fine all along and was just transitioning into a Sun God entity.

All-Star is absolute garbage and one of the reason mainstream Superman is mostly unlikable in my opinion.

You have nothing to prove that superman lives in our world. Do you? Do you have any proof that the world all star occupied isn't better than our own? . The existence of a scientist as smart as lex and clark negates that view. The existence of Jimmy's transformation and time travelling old folk heroes also negates it. Superman dynasty creating a better tomorrow is what happened in-story.Your idea that sun eater,That seems to be very rare, has a form of sentience is less than a poor human being is quite frankly bad.You also have nothing to prove that superman hasn't fed the poor.

Yeah! He prefers finding better solutions to help the poor than implementing idiotic ideas that bite them in the ass in the long run. We have a planet of 7 billion plus humans that it might not be able to sustain with a limited level of resources. He might have tech to harvest the sun itself. But, that doesn’t mean that solution will be viable. Long-term and overall view at the structure is essential. Any action that doesn't is gonna cause damage . He is a scientist, archeologist and an explorer. He cannot be like the idiots who put in cfc in fridges, deo.. Etc or the jackasses that cut the mangrove forests for short term gains.Naturally, he spends time in the fortress.

Moreover, a dieing and diseased man spends time with doctors and loved ones, not politicians or leaders or even the unfortunate . He figures out his wishes and regrets. He goes through the depressive phase and comes back. Because That's what superman does. His fortress is essentially his lab and a sanctuary for dieing species, cultures.. Etc. His death not being permanent only happens because of his willingness to jump into the sun. he could have gone boom on earth,had he been not altruistic. But then Superman wouldn't come back in anyway that is meaningful. The idea of a superman would be dead. Everything he accumulated is not for himself. So don't talk about greed. Its for public consumption. But, means cannot simply be divided in careless manner.As if everyone can handle power.These are some of the humanist ethical dilemmas/elements of the story. These are the few things that doesn't make it just a stupid story about a guy from the sky fixing the world.

My reasoning against all star superman interpretation as defacto superman interpretation is different from yours.I abhore the savior nonsense.It takes the credit from humanity as a whole and gives it to some idiot. I also hate the utopian dreams as well.it brings nothing but death and destruction.Funny enough, everyone wants it. A better tomorrow is better than a utopia.All star superman is about a guy who comes from the stars and "fixes" humanity with his hocus pocus. If the story didn't promise a utopia and just a better tomorrow its works. A sinless world would be a lifeless world. Superman's mortality is the thing that makes it work for me. Otherwise, it doesn't work.

[Vordan]

Check out Miracleman then, that’s a story about “Superman” forcibly changing the world with his powers and his tech. Even tells Thatcher off which I think you would enjoy as you’re French right? Doesn’t even do the usual cop out of “Superman can’t change the world because he’d be EVIL”, he creates a utopia at the end (albeit one with a very dystopian undercurrent).

But the reason mainline Superman doesn’t solve world hunger or whatever is simple: he’s a corporate character who isn’t built to actually tackle real world issues like that, same as how Batman isn’t actually built to be “grounded”. Batman’s Rogues would’ve all been killed “resisting arrest” long ago, yet they continue to somehow get sent to Arkham. Spider-Man is pals with gods and billionaires, why does he still have money problems? Tony gave some girl he barely knew a goddamn Iron Man suit, he can’t toss $1 million to Pete? That’s chump change for him. And on and on.

All-Star Superman’s world is not a “realistic” one. It’s a modern day Silver Age tale. Who says they even have world hunger problems? They never say they do, maybe ASS Superman DID solve all that stuff. He used the Kandorians to cure a bunch of kids of disease iirc.

[Robanker]

I think you may be hung up on the Brainiac comparison. The write up said "kind of like Kandor" but never once does it say "just like Kandor". And if you're reading Bendis' Legion of Super-Heroes then you'll remember that in issue 1 Jon think Metropolis is bottled, but he's corrected on this and learns that it's not bad and people can freely move in and out. So when it comes to going with BC's take on what the city being under a dome means, and what the author of the books has set it up to mean, I'll go with the latter.

My guess is that this is Jon on the reason why he went to the Legion to begin with. Brainy explains that Jon needs to come back to the present with knowledge and understanding of the near utopia that is the 31st century to ensure both eras live. And given the fact that Bendis keeps having every character pat the young man on the back for coming up with the novel idea of the UP, I imagine he's gonna have some support for his upcoming forward thinking ideas such as this new city.

Based on what's been said in the books, this sounds more like the first straight up futurist take on Superman. And Bendis himself has said, in an interview regarding his Superman run, that he personally idealizes futurist heroes, and that's why Tony Stark was such a favorite of his.



It's worded poorly, but I don't think that's what they meant. Sounds more like it's just Metroplis under a dome, and that's the defining aspect/crown jewel of 5G in terms of setting it apart from the present and past DCU.

Have you ever read the story "Superman of 2020"? It features the newest in line for the Superman title in the year 2020 (it's being passed onto him by his dad), and the version of Metoplois is floating and in a dome.

Remember early on Bendis said that he wanted to make Metropolis as recognizable as Gotham? How because it was home to the world's most famous immigrant, immigrants would come to live there? Well, Jon advancing the city with ideas from the 31st century, and his idea of the UP making it so interstellar relations are more common seems like it'll result in those things by bring a little piece of the 31st century with him.



The write up says it's the long term status quo for the 5G imprint/future. That status quo seeming to be Jon making Metropolis the most advanced city on Earth.

Normally I'd be with you, but I've learned to expect the worst from DC when it comes to Superman. Despite my misgivings, I will of course give it a couple issues to see where they go and then I'll make my decision on if it's something I want to support.

But domes are a Brainiac thing in Superman's corner. You can't have clown iconography in Gotham without it somehow referring to the Joker and putting a city under a dome is a Brainiac thing.

You bring up the Legion, but Brainy is there too. On some level, those concepts are linked in the IP... And I dunno, I consider Metropolis an open place and Superman a character of limitless possibility and freedom of movement (hence flight), so a restrictive geographical setting is already feeling wrong.

If DC had a better track record with Superman, I'd likely not assume the worst, but again I'm still going to buy a couple issues to decide for myself if they pull it off or not.

[kilderkin]

Just reviewing the general comments here about what is going on in the books

Not commenting on opinions, just what seems to be happening story wise

Glad I dropped BMB superman books

Looking forward to him moving on to something else

Far far away

[Ra-El]

Did new 52 Clark not keep cool **** in his fortress? If not then his loss.
All Star Superman seemed pretty close with Jimmy-who isn’t the brightest bulb. And even so I don’t really see the problem with Kal wanting to associate with smart people.
Anyway I never understood why fans like to finds ways to label versions of the character as liberal or conservative, when more than half the time the comic doesn’t even touch politics.

The things New 52 Superman had in his Fortress dwarfed All Star Superman by far. All Star Superman Fortress was a cave, full of the things he gathered over the years, while New 52 was the kryptonian crystal one, with the entire knowledge from Krypton. So who was the most selfish?