Official : Bendis gets both books

[daBronzeBomma]

So, after the latest reveal that Jon is now 17 years old, and Clark lost out on 7 years of his only child's formative years, I'm finally off of Team Bendis.

I cannot wait for his run to be over.

I really hope that Bendis gets bored with the Superverse sooner rather than later and that whomever takes over after him undoes EVERYTHING he brought to the table, including his stupid pet characters (esp Rogol Zaar) that hopefully no one will use after him.

Yeah, Bendis did manage to find Superman's voice, only to lose it when it came to Superman's wife and son, his two most important relationships.

So disappointed.

[Yoda]

I think it's made pretty clear this is the case on subsequent re-readings. Bendis does not always spell things out for the reader, he trusts them to figure it out for themselves.

Yeah, doubly so when you read some of his earlier interviews on the character and how he’s fighting for relevance both within the story and meta textually as well in pop culture. It also solidly explains her book, her need for some distance from him, and her reluctance to let him in on things fully. The execution is a little too subtle I think, but at least until I see something refuting it it works for me.

What does him being more proactive have anything to do with his family?And martian manhunter was acting very out of character.

Manhunter was a out of character, but the message he was giving was basically in line with Jor El’s and with what Lois saw in space. Superman is more than just a hero, hes a symbol to people and has the potential to lead and guide. Now Manhunter’s wanting him to take over is wrong and that caused Clark to completely shut him off, but he can do more than just react to problems. He can use his status to guide the world and the universe into a better place.

As for what it has to do with his family, I think that has to do with what Lois saw in space. They are not just a mild mannered reporter and his firecracker reporter wife raising a kid.They are more than that and always have been. Jon became more than that in space. They can do more than that and still be the loving family they are, just maybe not in the sense that they have to be home for dinner every night. And I don’t think we’ve seen the real new status quo for their relationship. Lois says they will figure out how to make it work and Bendis says it’s a work in progress on his end. And obviously Jon has to fit into this somehow. It makes sense, but again the execution has been lacking.

And like I said. We’ve seen Clark shut down two conversations that essentially were calling him out on or asking him to do more with his privilege. Lois knows him better than anyone so she’d know how to come at this in a way he won’t immediately close down. Likely her writing.

Jor el on the other hand is just a jerk. He was just being condescending. It is not like he can do better. From, "grandpa is crazy" to "starting a war" his ideas are not that great. He couldn't even convince his homeworld council to save themselves. If he was so proactive most of the kryptonIan s will be alive. If he knew about rogal zarr, jor el and his pro active self should have had measures to contain him. Atleast kandor would not have been destroyed then.he did not even warn clark or other leaguers on this threat. He is just all bark and no bite.

I would love a more pro active superman not at the cost of him a pushover clark or reckless fool.

I think you might have just fit the Jor El peice into this. I was wondering how they were going to keep him from going full villain. But Jor El was kinda just like Clark is now in a way on Krypton. He tried to convince the council that they were on the wrong path and couldn’t and his planet died. His son is alive because he went against them and acted. So maybe he’s going too far now in the other direction, involving himself directly in wars and the like, but it still fits. His criticism of Clark was over the top and condescending but the core of his message is kinda on par with Bendis’ thesis. That actually could be his motivation. He was saved by someone horrible from his own failure. But now he’s taking it too far both in his criticism of Clark and his own actions.

[manwhohaseverything]

I think you might have just fit the Jor El peice into this. I was wondering how they were going to keep him from going full villain. But Jor El was kinda just like Clark is now in a way on Krypton. He tried to convince the council that they were on the wrong path and couldn’t and his planet died. His son is alive because he went against them and acted. So maybe he’s going too far now in the other direction, involving himself directly in wars and the like, but it still fits. His criticism of Clark was over the top and condescending but the core of his message is kinda on par with Bendis’ thesis. That actually could be his motivation. He was saved by someone horrible from his own failure. But now he’s taking it too far both in his criticism of Clark and his own actions.

No, it doesn't. Since, jor el has not changed even now. As i mentioned,he was not proactive enough for rogal zarr, kandor's destruction.. Etc. His son is alive because he had the authority to take decision on behalf of his son who baby and was not in the frame of mind to take decision. He can't do that with the council. They have their own freewill. Jorel cannot force his decision on them. He could have told the people,though and let them decide for themselves.
His point is bullshit, and we have had this convo. Jor el basically says people who work in service sectors like police men, firefighters, nurses.. Etc who work day and night are worthless.since, there will always be another fire, patients or criminals. Ending all this in real time would be great. But we have not earned nor have we achieved ending diseases, accidents and crimes... Etc on our own free will or strength.
And i am not sure even superman can do these things.

You know my favourite line in max Fleischer cartoons "he fights a never ending battle for truth, justice and the american way". It's a never ending battle, but he can't quit. And no offence i would rather clark be analogue to a firefighter than some politician, or hypocritical leader. It is what attracts me and helps me relate to the character. He is not some shark like control freak like batman who wants to control everything and manipulate everyone. He helps people. But the decision they make with their life is their own to make. He is noone to control anyone,even in the name of justice.

And as far as pushing himself goes, he pushed himsef for days in the previous run. So much so, that he fainted while in mid flight and then somehow made it to home to fall, right into the bed.

[Yoda]

I get what you’re saying but that’s not at all what I think it’s actually happening in the story. Nor is it what I’m saying Superman should be here.

Jor El’s not going to be “right” nor is Martian Manhunter. But people can have a good underlying idea - Superman can do more - and still go at it wrong. That’s what both Jor El and MM did. And it in no way is a criticism of fire fighters, nurses, etc. nor is it a call to take over.

As far as Zar and Kandor, there’s no indication that he knows Zar is alive. So until we see that, I don’t think that works against things.

All that said, this is all leading to the creation of the United Planets, not Superman taking over the galaxy.

[manwhohaseverything]

I get what you’re saying but that’s not at all what I think it’s actually happening in the story. Nor is it what I’m saying Superman should be here.

Jor El’s not going to be “right” nor is Martian Manhunter. But people can have a good underlying idea - Superman can do more - and still go at it wrong. That’s what both Jor El and MM did. And it in no way is a criticism of fire fighters, nurses, etc. nor is it a call to take over.

As far as Zar and Kandor, there’s no indication that he knows Zar is alive. So until we see that, I don’t think that works against things.

All that said, this is all leading to the creation of the United Planets, not Superman taking over the galaxy.

He knows rogal zarr exists and caused the destruction of krypton right? That is what is being implied. Then as what? 12th level intellect? He should be able to figure out that rogal zarr did not die. Therefore is out there. If he is trying to be proactive he should have plans containing rogal zarr or any other threats.i mean, it doesn't take scientist of a planet full of supermen to figure out something like rogal zarr cannot be killee easily. I mean who could kill him darkseid, mongul who?

Then what was and i quote "busy doing what? Putting out fires in your baby blankets?" this statement. It is a jab at superman as a firefighter.
United planets is a great idea. But humans had similar idea ages ago. And wasn't superman also working with UN in doomsday clock. He was also the only one allowed to cross boundries accross nations. Superman is not special to come up with an idea like that. Sure, he might work towards it, but that would be normal for superman. not proactive or out of the ordinary. Nothing that requires him to be different with his family. As we have seen clark be away and be busy all the time in the previous run. And i said, clark always pushes himself above and beyond. He even strives to bring hope to people, when he himself is angry or disturbed like in OZ effect.

I would have liked it, (or maybe that is what he is doing right now )
if bendis was saying "look guys, Jor el is a jerk and whatever he said is bullshit. What clark is doing is right thing? I am going to show you why?"
And then proceeds to show "crazy grandpa". Jon keeping his values from Clois and experiences he had. Jor el starts a war. Clark stops it(another fire). Heck! In the latest issue Jor el basically butchered those aliens, but still they returned with another armada to take over the earth. So much for not putting out fires and being proactive. Clark had to stop it as well.
I am also wondering, if bendis is doing the values from alterred or twisted birth parent vs values from adopted parents kents thing. Since, bendis showed Clark remembering them in couple of issues ago.

[HeroVladimir93]

I think Bendis put himself in a no-win scenario by turning Superboy into a teenager. Yes, it could be a great story but some people might accuse Bendis of only wanting to cause controversy to bring awareness to his comics and increase sales. This is the exact same thing that happened when Nick Spencer turned Captain America into an agent of HYDRA or when Dan Slott replaced Peter Parker, the iconic Spider-Man, with Otto Octavius. Sure, those stories eventually got cold feet and turned things back the way they were, but the damage was done. Those stories weren't remembered by their quality or their themes, but by their controversies. Let's say Bendis turns Superboy back into his previous age and reunites with Superman and Lois and they all become a happy family again. Happy ending, right? Yes, if you can ignore the people complaining that Bendis caused controversy for a ratings stunt or that he couldn't commit to the changes he imposed on the comics.

[manwhohaseverything]

Don't worry about that. Bendis is already being blamed for all the things mentioned. He might not care or even if he did He is a professional and a vetren. He can take it

[Superlad93]

Yes, it could be a great story but some people might accuse Bendis of only wanting to cause controversy to bring awareness to his comics and increase sales.

Remember when the actual same thing (like basically verbatim especially because Peter was still in high school) was being said about him when he created Miles? He seemed to do quite a lot of winning in the long run with that that situation, didn't he? It's the end of the world for comics fans all the time. Optimistic foresight of any kind tends not to be our strong suit. These "no-win situations" tend not to be as dramatic as we say at the time.

[Miles To Go]

Those stories weren't remembered by their quality or their themes, but by their controversies.

Superior Spider-Man is regarded as the peak of Dan Slott's career (I don't like the story personally, but it's hard to argue with sales) and even his fans believe everything he wrote after Peter came back was garbage...ironically Nick Spencer's run on Spidey is considered the best the character has been creatively since 2014, and this was Spencer's first project after the Hydra Cap nonsense.

[HeroVladimir93]

Superior Spider-Man is regarded as the peak of Dan Slott's career (I don't like the story personally, but it's hard to argue with sales) and even his fans believe everything he wrote after Peter came back was garbage...ironically Nick Spencer's run on Spidey is considered the best the character has been creatively since 2014, and this was Spencer's first project after the Hydra Cap nonsense.

I will not deny the success of Superior Spider-Man, even though I mostly kept away from it. My disagreement with that story's basic premise kept me and is still keeping me from reading it. As for Secret Empire, some people say that underneath all the controversy is a story worth reading. The problem is that those stories used controversy to bring in audiences, at least for their initial phases.

[Kon93]

I'm sorry folks,but bendis doesn't do what is best for the characters,he does what is best for sales and hype.

I hope the story is grand and leads to all.kinds of awesome stuff,but just remember he had to step on a 10 year old to do it(little.much,but true).

[Miles To Go]

Soplicits have leaked

[Miles To Go]

[manwhohaseverything]

Now, this what i want. Kick Jor el's ass Clark! Action seem to be picking up. Finally! Lois gets in on the fun.

[Miles To Go]

And indeed it's a father/son road trip story, as predicted by (I think) Sacred