Would you care to see Dick!Bats again?

[Aioros22]

Absolutely neutral about the pairing so I`ll pass that one but as far as Dick being Batman:

No. Not going to happen. Only Terry works and because of the concept, anything else is just filling in on temporary basis.

[gregpersons]

100% agree with OP. Absolutely yes. DickBats is the Batman version of "The Godfather Part II" and it should have its own separate ongoing/continuity where Bruce Wayne is permanently dead.

All of the core Batman themes are even stronger with Dick carrying on Bruce's legacy.

Dick Grayson is everything you like about Bruce Wayne, but better — he's not an ultra-prepared god. He's the guy who learned from the ultra-prepared god — so, he's good, but he's also fallible.

He also has to live up to the ideal of The Bat ... he has to somehow make it his, not just out of obligation. And it is the perfect evolution of Grayson's arc — he had been groomed since he was a child to one day inherit Wayne's legacy. Now he has, but he still needs to grow & evolve as an individual person — he has to ask himself, like Bruce did: why? Is this what my parents would have wanted? Is this the best solution to crime in the city? Who is Batman really serving?

As an action hero, DickBats is essentially BTAS Bats, like how Batman was before the 2000s when he became the prep-time Batgod. In several episodes of B:TAS, sometimes Batman loses to common thugs. Not on a fluke either, just because a fist-fight can sometimes go the other way even if you're 100x better. It wouldn't be inconceivable to see DickBats struggle more than Bruce would with certain things, which makes for a fun story with more tension — it's NOT a given that DickBats will win a given scenario, where it might have been with Bruce.

Which of course Dick is always reminded of ... by Damian Wayne, Bruce's evil genius bastard son, Bruce Wayne's genetic inheritor. Dick will never be good enough.

But Dick is the inheritor of Bruce's selflessness and willingness to sacrifice. He's the inheritor of the good in Bruce's spirit, as well as the darkness. Damian is a wayward youth raised by assassins -- only someone trained by Batman himself could hope to tame him, and to help him channel his anger, in the way that Bruce helped Dick.

Dick & Damian have the best superhero dynamic in comics. It's perfectly set up. The characters are so clear, and their relationship is so natural, that basically ANYONE that wrote the characters came away with good scenes. Morrison was the best at it, but Tomasi was no slouch, and it barely had enough time for other writers to explore. Reversing "grim Batman, cheerful Robin" alone is a fantastic innovation, and matching that with the aforementioned thematic elements...

Dick Grayson as Batman is the better version of the story; Bruce Wayne works better as a legend, in flashbacks.

[Jackalope89]

100% agree with OP. Absolutely yes. DickBats is the Batman version of "The Godfather Part II" and it should have its own separate ongoing/continuity where Bruce Wayne is permanently dead.

All of the core Batman themes are even stronger with Dick carrying on Bruce's legacy.

Dick Grayson is everything you like about Bruce Wayne, but better — he's not an ultra-prepared god. He's the guy who learned from the ultra-prepared god — so, he's good, but he's also fallible.

He also has to live up to the ideal of The Bat ... he has to somehow make it his, not just out of obligation. And it is the perfect evolution of Grayson's arc — he had been groomed since he was a child to one day inherit Wayne's legacy. Now he has, but he still needs to grow & evolve as an individual person — he has to ask himself, like Bruce did: why? Is this what my parents would have wanted? Is this the best solution to crime in the city? Who is Batman really serving?

As an action hero, DickBats is essentially BTAS Bats, like how Batman was before the 2000s when he became the prep-time Batgod. In several episodes of B:TAS, sometimes Batman loses to common thugs. Not on a fluke either, just because a fist-fight can sometimes go the other way even if you're 100x better. It wouldn't be inconceivable to see DickBats struggle more than Bruce would with certain things, which makes for a fun story with more tension — it's NOT a given that DickBats will win a given scenario, where it might have been with Bruce.

Which of course Dick is always reminded of ... by Damian Wayne, Bruce's evil genius bastard son, Bruce Wayne's genetic inheritor. Dick will never be good enough.

But Dick is the inheritor of Bruce's selflessness and willingness to sacrifice. He's the inheritor of the good in Bruce's spirit, as well as the darkness. Damian is a wayward youth raised by assassins -- only someone trained by Batman himself could hope to tame him, and to help him channel his anger, in the way that Bruce helped Dick.

Dick & Damian have the best superhero dynamic in comics. It's perfectly set up. The characters are so clear, and their relationship is so natural, that basically ANYONE that wrote the characters came away with good scenes. Morrison was the best at it, but Tomasi was no slouch, and it barely had enough time for other writers to explore. Reversing "grim Batman, cheerful Robin" alone is a fantastic innovation, and matching that with the aforementioned thematic elements...

Dick Grayson as Batman is the better version of the story; Bruce Wayne works better as a legend, in flashbacks.

And seeing DickBats on the Justice League as well.

I really do see Dick passing the title on to Damian ASAP, particularly when Damian is old enough, and tall enough.

I know Dick has at least some history with Wonder Woman, is almost always friends with Superman, gets along well with the Flashes, has a history with Cyborg (come on DC, bring that back!), but has he had any real interaction with Jessica Cruz and Simon Baz?

[Celgress]

Given how we will be seeing the return of Damian!Bats in Arkham Asylum 2, it begs the question--would anyone care to see Dick Grayson as Batman again?....

I sure would.

[phantom1592]

As much as I like Bruce as Batman, I was ready for Dick to take over long-term since his first extended stint in PRODIGAL back in 1994. If there were such a thing as an ideal time to do it, it would have been then.

Buried Alien (The Fastest Post Alive!)

Prodigal was awesome. That was one of my favorite Grayson stories of all time and one of the reasons I love Nightwing as a character. I didn't feel the Post-Final Crisis DickBats lived up that... and maybe that was my extreme hatred of Damian.

I personally LOVE a Batman that is a detective and is fallible. One who outthinks his enemies and not just outpunches them... and Prodigal was everything that Bruce had evolved beyond. It was a 'better Batman than Batman.'

However, I also don't like Legacies. I don't really want Dick Grayson to grow beyond his role and gain the mantle... so much as I want Batman to act like Batman should. I want BRUCE to be that detective 'brain over fists' caped crusader who is an expert in so many things, yet still a mortal man.

Still an amazing story though.

[Ascended]

Given how we will be seeing the return of Damian!Bats in Arkham Asylum 2, it begs the question--would anyone care to see Dick Grayson as Batman again?

Many on here who know me know I prefer this version of the character, over Dick as Nightwing and Bruce as Batman, but I know this is an unpopular opinion. My question is, would anyone want to see a one-off or elseworlds storyline featuring Dick back in the cowl?

I just feel like we didn't get enough Batman stories with him before Bruce's return, and I really would love to read more of those.

Its not something I need to see again.

Dick Grayson is his own man. And I think it often gets ignored just how rare, and nearly impossible, his journey is in comics. How many sidekicks/legacies actually manage to break away from their original role and establish themselves as their own successful characters with their own names and stand on their own?

No one else from Dick's generation has managed that. Wally made himself popular but had to take Barry's name and costume to do it. Roy almost got out from Ollie's shadow, but between the Red Arrow name and the color-blind Ollie costume DC keeps pushing him back into, he hasn't managed it. Donna hasn't managed any of it on any level. I suppose we can say that Power Girl has managed to break away from Clark's shadow, but her popularity is questionable (I love her, but she's not on Nightwing's level).

Dick Grayson is Nightwing. Making him take over for Bruce feels like him stepping into another person's life, and I think it's ill fitted for him. Batman is dark, and edgy, and driven by vengeance.....and while Dick has a little of all of that in him, he's not Bruce. He's not The Batman. He's happy.

I don't mind Dick taking over the role temporarily every now and then when Bruce is unable to do his job. That's fine. But Dick has built a life for himself, with his own name. DC needs to keep that trajectory going and make Nightwing a bigger star, not try to force Dick into a mantle that doesn't fit him.

And besides, DC replace Bruce? They'd rather sell off every other property they own than write off Bruce Wayne. It'll never happen. And it never should.

[oasis1313]

I think there are times for Dickbats. "Being his own man" doesn't mean dumping his family; it means being comfortable enough in his own skin to work on his own OR with his family. Part of the problem is that no Bat-Hierarchy is ever set down. So Dick is the "angry young man" who tries to avoid everybody; Jason is the "black sheep"--SORT OF; Tim still has his umbilical cord attached; Damian is incorrigible might-be blood son. As far as I can tell, Dick is no longer adopted; Jason might be officially adopted; Tim is adopted by everyone; Damian might be blood--depending on whose paternity test is the right one. There are no family decisions, no discussion of legacy--it makes no sense how willy-nilly the Bat-"Family" does anything. But then, I gave up on DC making sense decades ago.

[gregpersons]

100% agree with OP. Absolutely yes. DickBats is the Batman version of "The Godfather Part II" and it should have its own separate ongoing/continuity where Bruce Wayne is permanently dead.

All of the core Batman themes are even stronger with Dick carrying on Bruce's legacy.

Dick Grayson is everything you like about Bruce Wayne, but better — he's not an ultra-prepared god. He's the guy who learned from the ultra-prepared god — so, he's good, but he's also fallible.

He also has to live up to the ideal of The Bat ... he has to somehow make it his, not just out of obligation. And it is the perfect evolution of Grayson's arc — he had been groomed since he was a child to one day inherit Wayne's legacy. Now he has, but he still needs to grow & evolve as an individual person — he has to ask himself, like Bruce did: why? Is this what my parents would have wanted? Is this the best solution to crime in the city? Who is Batman really serving?

As an action hero, DickBats is essentially BTAS Bats, like how Batman was before the 2000s when he became the prep-time Batgod. In several episodes of B:TAS, sometimes Batman loses to common thugs. Not on a fluke either, just because a fist-fight can sometimes go the other way even if you're 100x better. It wouldn't be inconceivable to see DickBats struggle more than Bruce would with certain things, which makes for a fun story with more tension — it's NOT a given that DickBats will win a given scenario, where it might have been with Bruce.

Which of course Dick is always reminded of ... by Damian Wayne, Bruce's evil genius bastard son, Bruce Wayne's genetic inheritor. Dick will never be good enough.

But Dick is the inheritor of Bruce's selflessness and willingness to sacrifice. He's the inheritor of the good in Bruce's spirit, as well as the darkness. Damian is a wayward youth raised by assassins -- only someone trained by Batman himself could hope to tame him, and to help him channel his anger, in the way that Bruce helped Dick.

Dick & Damian have the best superhero dynamic in comics. It's perfectly set up. The characters are so clear, and their relationship is so natural, that basically ANYONE that wrote the characters came away with good scenes. Morrison was the best at it, but Tomasi was no slouch, and it barely had enough time for other writers to explore. Reversing "grim Batman, cheerful Robin" alone is a fantastic innovation, and matching that with the aforementioned thematic elements...

Dick Grayson as Batman is the better version of the story; Bruce Wayne works better as a legend, in flashbacks.

Another reason DickBats is superior... It makes "Batman" more of a mask. Batman truly becomes an idea, rather than Bruce Wayne's real face.

Bruce Wayne is only Batman; Batman and Bruce Wayne are synonymous. You can't have one without the other. The argument that "Bruce Wayne" is more of a mask than "Batman" for the private Bruce Wayne is long established.

Anyone who inhabits the Batman costume will either be doing an imitation of Bruce Wayne or they make it something unique to them. In other words, if Bruce Wayne's legacy is about more than just personal vengeance, then Dick Grayson - Bruce Wayne's legacy - has to prove that and justify it by becoming Batman 2.0.

DickBats is essentially Batman Beyond but a more adult comics setting. Aside from liking Terry, Tim, Damian versions of 2nd Batman, it makes the most sense for it to be Dick Grayson. Since he was Robin in 1940, Dick always represented that Batman is about more than just one man, he's inspiring others to fight back as well. The idea that Robin grows up to become Batman was in the earliest stories.

In this hypothetical alternate universe, the other Future Batmen would be a fun rogues' gallery for DickBats. DickBats vs Future Damian vs Future Tim vs Terry McGinnis.

[theoneandonly]

ambivalent on the idea but since Bruce's death was being hinted at it may be that we will soon see dick don the mantle but I think it should be someone who has yet hasn't had a stint even when Jim had one. maybe Jason or perhaps batwoman should step up to the plate. maybe batwoman and Cassie could be the new dynamic duo if Bruce dies. however given the developments of fall of batmen its pretty unlikely. however in an au I would like to see a story where all the members of the bat family have done theit stint and ether passed the viel or moved on and the spirit of batman searches for a suitable host to possess him and make him batman for a time. he could show him the tenures of various bat family when they donned the mane to give him a idea of what he was getting into.

[dietrich]

And seeing DickBats on the Justice League as well.

I really do see Dick passing the title on to Damian ASAP, particularly when Damian is old enough, and tall enough.

I know Dick has at least some history with Wonder Woman, is almost always friends with Superman, gets along well with the Flashes, has a history with Cyborg (come on DC, bring that back!), but has he had any real interaction with Jessica Cruz and Simon Baz?

LoL nice one. That made me spit up tea

[Elmo]

100% agree with OP. Absolutely yes. DickBats is the Batman version of "The Godfather Part II" and it should have its own separate ongoing/continuity where Bruce Wayne is permanently dead.

All of the core Batman themes are even stronger with Dick carrying on Bruce's legacy.

Dick Grayson is everything you like about Bruce Wayne, but better — he's not an ultra-prepared god. He's the guy who learned from the ultra-prepared god — so, he's good, but he's also fallible.

He also has to live up to the ideal of The Bat ... he has to somehow make it his, not just out of obligation. And it is the perfect evolution of Grayson's arc — he had been groomed since he was a child to one day inherit Wayne's legacy. Now he has, but he still needs to grow & evolve as an individual person — he has to ask himself, like Bruce did: why? Is this what my parents would have wanted? Is this the best solution to crime in the city? Who is Batman really serving?

As an action hero, DickBats is essentially BTAS Bats, like how Batman was before the 2000s when he became the prep-time Batgod. In several episodes of B:TAS, sometimes Batman loses to common thugs. Not on a fluke either, just because a fist-fight can sometimes go the other way even if you're 100x better. It wouldn't be inconceivable to see DickBats struggle more than Bruce would with certain things, which makes for a fun story with more tension — it's NOT a given that DickBats will win a given scenario, where it might have been with Bruce.

Which of course Dick is always reminded of ... by Damian Wayne, Bruce's evil genius bastard son, Bruce Wayne's genetic inheritor. Dick will never be good enough.

But Dick is the inheritor of Bruce's selflessness and willingness to sacrifice. He's the inheritor of the good in Bruce's spirit, as well as the darkness. Damian is a wayward youth raised by assassins -- only someone trained by Batman himself could hope to tame him, and to help him channel his anger, in the way that Bruce helped Dick.

Dick & Damian have the best superhero dynamic in comics. It's perfectly set up. The characters are so clear, and their relationship is so natural, that basically ANYONE that wrote the characters came away with good scenes. Morrison was the best at it, but Tomasi was no slouch, and it barely had enough time for other writers to explore. Reversing "grim Batman, cheerful Robin" alone is a fantastic innovation, and matching that with the aforementioned thematic elements...

Dick Grayson as Batman is the better version of the story; Bruce Wayne works better as a legend, in flashbacks.

You hit the nail on the head. This is exactly how I feel.

[oasis1313]

100% agree with OP. Absolutely yes. DickBats is the Batman version of "The Godfather Part II" and it should have its own separate ongoing/continuity where Bruce Wayne is permanently dead.

All of the core Batman themes are even stronger with Dick carrying on Bruce's legacy.

Dick Grayson is everything you like about Bruce Wayne, but better — he's not an ultra-prepared god. He's the guy who learned from the ultra-prepared god — so, he's good, but he's also fallible.

He also has to live up to the ideal of The Bat ... he has to somehow make it his, not just out of obligation. And it is the perfect evolution of Grayson's arc — he had been groomed since he was a child to one day inherit Wayne's legacy. Now he has, but he still needs to grow & evolve as an individual person — he has to ask himself, like Bruce did: why? Is this what my parents would have wanted? Is this the best solution to crime in the city? Who is Batman really serving?

As an action hero, DickBats is essentially BTAS Bats, like how Batman was before the 2000s when he became the prep-time Batgod. In several episodes of B:TAS, sometimes Batman loses to common thugs. Not on a fluke either, just because a fist-fight can sometimes go the other way even if you're 100x better. It wouldn't be inconceivable to see DickBats struggle more than Bruce would with certain things, which makes for a fun story with more tension — it's NOT a given that DickBats will win a given scenario, where it might have been with Bruce.

Which of course Dick is always reminded of ... by Damian Wayne, Bruce's evil genius bastard son, Bruce Wayne's genetic inheritor. Dick will never be good enough.

But Dick is the inheritor of Bruce's selflessness and willingness to sacrifice. He's the inheritor of the good in Bruce's spirit, as well as the darkness. Damian is a wayward youth raised by assassins -- only someone trained by Batman himself could hope to tame him, and to help him channel his anger, in the way that Bruce helped Dick.

Dick & Damian have the best superhero dynamic in comics. It's perfectly set up. The characters are so clear, and their relationship is so natural, that basically ANYONE that wrote the characters came away with good scenes. Morrison was the best at it, but Tomasi was no slouch, and it barely had enough time for other writers to explore. Reversing "grim Batman, cheerful Robin" alone is a fantastic innovation, and matching that with the aforementioned thematic elements...

Dick Grayson as Batman is the better version of the story; Bruce Wayne works better as a legend, in flashbacks.

Excellent comments. I'd say that Dick is a Batman you can actually LIKE, instead of creepy Bat-God. And I think Dick is a perfect Batman IF that is what Dick chooses to do. I think he'd make a great sub in the Justice League books because I can't imagine Bruce having ANY interest in anything beyond Gotham City. And I'd say that Dick has a better chance of making a human being out of Damian than Bruce does.

[millernumber1]

I know some people are still mad about the way Dick became Batman through the terrible Battle for the Cowl, and characters like Jason and Cass getting the shaft in that event. However, I think DickBats was an amazing era for Batman - you got Black Mirror, Gates of Gotham (two of the best things Snyder's ever done), Batman Reborn and Batman Inc, two great status quo shifts for Batman with extremely solid lines (I mean, you got Batwoman Elegy, Red Robin, Gotham City Sirens, Streets of Gotham, and Steph Batgirl out of it!) I loved Dick as Batman, and the way the world had to gradually reshape itself as he grew into the mantle. I don't know if I ever really believed it would last, but I loved it while it was there.

But then again, I also loved Gordon Batman.

[oasis1313]

I know some people are still mad about the way Dick became Batman through the terrible Battle for the Cowl, and characters like Jason and Cass getting the shaft in that event. However, I think DickBats was an amazing era for Batman - you got Black Mirror, Gates of Gotham (two of the best things Snyder's ever done), Batman Reborn and Batman Inc, two great status quo shifts for Batman with extremely solid lines (I mean, you got Batwoman Elegy, Red Robin, Gotham City Sirens, Streets of Gotham, and Steph Batgirl out of it!) I loved Dick as Batman, and the way the world had to gradually reshape itself as he grew into the mantle. I don't know if I ever really believed it would last, but I loved it while it was there.

But then again, I also loved Gordon Batman.

Both DickBats and GordonBats indicate that you can have solid Batman stories without Bruce Wayne in them. I liked GordonBats, too. I love Terry McGinnis in Batman Beyond. DC is always pushing the idea that it's the mask that matters and not who's wearing the mask--then they always chicken out.

[Jcady59]

Both DickBats and GordonBats indicate that you can have solid Batman stories without Bruce Wayne in them. I liked GordonBats, too. I love Terry McGinnis in Batman Beyond. DC is always pushing the idea that it's the mask that matters and not who's wearing the mask--then they always chicken out.

No they don't, DC never pushes the idea that it's the mask and not who wears it, if anything they go out of there way to reinforce the idea that Bruce is the one and only Batman. Any time any other hero puts on the cowl things turn to **** or the hero in question feels like they don't meseure up, or they go completely insane and become a bigger threat than most of the criminals in Gotham. It's almost like DC is telling us that when Bruce is not Batman things are not the way they are supposed to be.