"Superior Iron Man" and More Headline Marvel's "Avengers NOW!"

[cranger]

Bringing up an in-universe detail in response to a comment made in an essentially out-of-universe discussion (whether anyone else who wielded Mjölnir went by "Thor") doesn't make the observation any less accurate. If you were reading Thor's book from 1991 to 1993, you were reading about Eric Masterson.

It is not about whether it is accurate but what it is relevant to. If someone was claiming that no one has ever stood in for the role of Thor then it would be relevant. When the discussion is about whether it makes sense for someone to take on the name given at birth to a character than the details determine whether it is relevant. If you want to bring up some in-universe detail than expect it to be challenged.

[Flash Gordon]

even recently...We had a justice league lineup that had Dick Grayson Batman, Donna Troy, Mon El, and Congorilla.

And how that WASN'T awesome still boggles my brains.

[Moriarty]

And how that WASN'T awesome still boggles my brains.

i thought that run was awesome IMO.

[jphamlore]

I have heard a speculation in this forum that Tony Stark could make the heroes situation worse in AXIS by having compiled a dossier and perhaps even an armory to exploit specific hero weaknesses. This could tie in to Captain America's situation where it is possible S.H.I.E.L.D. related tech may have helped strip Steve Rogers of his Super Soldier Serum.

Another possibility it seems to me relates back to the original Ultron who I believe was eventually revealed to have been accelerated by Hank Pym using his own engrams. What if Tony Stark has been collecting the brain patterns of all the heroes to help him accelerate his own AI program and the new Red Skull hacks this database? That could explain the rumor that the new Red Skull somehow enslaves the heroes since they, if they were not fools, would have gone into battle with some sort of telepathy defense but might not know that Red Skull knows their specific brain patterns and thus can control them anyways with the powers of Xavier's brain.

At least for the Avengers movie since I suspect it will be LONG and amazingly expensive, I expect a twist such as sub-Ultrons are created that specifically target each Avenger.

[Arfguy]

Marvel. Please pay me to design your characters. Most of those characters have really crappy looking costumes. Falcon as the new Captain America was very predictable, but the least they could have done is given him a kick ass costume.

Instead, they tried to combine the two characters and it just looks messy, like when Marvel and DC crossed over and they thought combining Captain America's costume with a red underwear on the outside and a LITERAL S shield was a good idea.

UGH!

[TresDias]

It is not about whether it is accurate but what it is relevant to. If someone was claiming that no one has ever stood in for the role of Thor then it would be relevant. When the discussion is about whether it makes sense for someone to take on the name given at birth to a character than the details determine whether it is relevant. If you want to bring up some in-universe detail than expect it to be challenged.

The claim was "the complaint is that it's not the role of 'God of Thunder' that was being taken away (something that's been done before) but the character's own name too: in the past, when the mantle shifted, it went to someone of a different name."

This was inaccurate, so I pointed it out. If you want to discuss how much sense it makes for the name "Thor" to go with the hammer, that's a different topic altogether.

[Dabrikishaw]

At least Tony isn't somehow turning evil. Again.

[stingnewell]

Well whether its Tony becoming a bigger ass or Arno I look forward to the new Superiors fans screaming in delight at how awesome he is than when Tony returns start booing like crazy and creating a petition like they did for Superior Spider-Man. Meanwhile i will laugh at their expense and failure.

[megaharrison]

I can't figure out why Marvel keeps wanting to make Stark a badguy.

Well actually I can figure out why, it's because Marvel can't wrap their heads around how someone associated with unashamed capitalism, a confidence in the government, and an association with the military couldn't be a badguy. This same kind of syndrome has been effecting Nick Fury, Maria Hill (and just about every long-established SHIELD character), and Reed Richards for a while now, and it's getting quite tedious.

[Punisher007]

I have heard a speculation in this forum that Tony Stark could make the heroes situation worse in AXIS by having compiled a dossier and perhaps even an armory to exploit specific hero weaknesses. This could tie in to Captain America's situation where it is possible S.H.I.E.L.D. related tech may have helped strip Steve Rogers of his Super Soldier Serum.

Another possibility it seems to me relates back to the original Ultron who I believe was eventually revealed to have been accelerated by Hank Pym using his own engrams. What if Tony Stark has been collecting the brain patterns of all the heroes to help him accelerate his own AI program and the new Red Skull hacks this database? That could explain the rumor that the new Red Skull somehow enslaves the heroes since they, if they were not fools, would have gone into battle with some sort of telepathy defense but might not know that Red Skull knows their specific brain patterns and thus can control them anyways with the powers of Xavier's brain.

At least for the Avengers movie since I suspect it will be LONG and amazingly expensive, I expect a twist such as sub-Ultrons are created that specifically target each Avenger.

That would be a blatant ripoff of Batman's plans from Tower of Babel.

[protege]

At least Tony isn't somehow turning evil. Again.

Not yet, anyway.

[Sardorim]

That would be a blatant ripoff of Batman's plans from Tower of Babel.

Yeah, Tower of Babel is pretty iconic and well known.

[cranger]

The claim was "the complaint is that it's not the role of 'God of Thunder' that was being taken away (something that's been done before) but the character's own name too: in the past, when the mantle shifted, it went to someone of a different name."

This was inaccurate, so I pointed it out. If you want to discuss how much sense it makes for the name "Thor" to go with the hammer, that's a different topic altogether.

Again, Eric did not just take on the name Thor, he was pretending to be Thor to everyone else at Thor's request. His pretending to be Thor was only to hide the fact that Thor was missing. He was still Eric Masterson, well, accept for the two years before that when he actually was Thor because they were merged. Still, even when the hammer went to him, and him alone, it went to Eric Masterson, he just let people think he was Thor.

We do not know enough about how this story will play out but we know the Eric Masterson era was not just him getting the name by default because he had the hammer.

[Tony Stark]

I can't figure out why Marvel keeps wanting to make Stark a badguy.

Well actually I can figure out why, it's because Marvel can't wrap their heads around how someone associated with unashamed capitalism, a confidence in the government, and an association with the military couldn't be a badguy. This same kind of syndrome has been effecting Nick Fury, Maria Hill (and just about every long-established SHIELD character), and Reed Richards for a while now, and it's getting quite tedious.

He has been trying to get away from the government for years though. He only went with the government for CW because he believed in registration. He got to be Secretary of Defense because he didn't trust the government with his things. Also he has gotten away from the military as well, but I do agree especially by naming it Superior that they are trying to make Tony do more villainous things. That's why Alonso said the named it Superior.

[TresDias]

Again, Eric did not just take on the name Thor, he was pretending to be Thor to everyone else at Thor's request. His pretending to be Thor was only to hide the fact that Thor was missing. He was still Eric Masterson, well, accept for the two years before that when he actually was Thor because they were merged. Still, even when the hammer went to him, and him alone, it went to Eric Masterson, he just let people think he was Thor.

We do not know enough about how this story will play out but we know the Eric Masterson era was not just him getting the name by default because he had the hammer.

Are you really still making a stink about this? Look at the claim again: "in the past, when the mantle shifted, it went to someone of a different name."

Masterson is the most notable example of the mantle shifting, and the claim does not hold up. That's it. Again, you can bring up all the in-universe details you want (stuff that we don't even know about the female Thor yet to compare this to, might I remind you and Brian), but that doesn't change the fact that Brian's claim is simply inaccurate.

It is not true that "in the past when the mantle shifted, it went to someone of a different name." It is simply not.