Where's the love?

[The Ray]

Exactly. Namor and Medusa, etc did this to get Reed and Sue back together again. It was an overly melodramatic way to accomplish it. Namor had no intention of following up. I hate when someone posts scans and then doesn't give the full story behind it. Just like the Reed slap of Sue when she was Malice.

But Sue didn't know that.

As far as she knew, Namor had full intention to ground New York and she accepted it. She stood by it. The same way that she concluded that her kidnapper was the true love of her life.

[Iron Maiden]

But Sue didn't know that.

As far as she knew, Namor had full intention to ground New York and she accepted it. She stood by it. The same way that she concluded that her kidnapper was the true love of her life.

It was a clumsily told story but put it in the context of a family where the father has done something to their child that horrifies the mother. Reed zapped Franklin with a anti-matter gun, an experimental one at that, and put him in a coma. Even Ben thought it was extreme and was a reason to split up the FF, let alone their marriage. Reed gets divorce papers a couple of issues later





Sue was not staying with Namor for a lengthy period of time. She was staying at her friends the Linders home when Namor came for her. Reed already had the divorce papers and Ben and Johnny came to talk to her. (FF #147) By the time Namor had taken her to Atlantis and then the fight to get her to come back begins. When Sue sees how an overmatched Reed is willing to fight Namor she comes to realize that she still loves Reed despite his flaws.

[CaptCleghorn]

Exactly. Namor and Medusa, etc did this to get Reed and Sue back together again. It was an overly melodramatic way to accomplish it. Namor had no intention of following up. I hate when someone posts scans and then doesn't give the full story behind it. Just like the Reed slap of Sue when she was Malice.

That's what happens when you don't actually read the issues.

[Michael Watkins]

So what if Ben thought it was harsh? He isn't a scientist. He didn't have a kinder alternative. Franklin's powers are dangerous.

[CaptCleghorn]

So what if Ben thought it was harsh? He isn't a scientist. He didn't have a kinder alternative. Franklin's powers are dangerous.

it's a powerful scene. Obviously played for melodrama, it serves to show that Reed's lack of emotion and pragmatic nature is a quality not every character has. It was the best choice he had. And saving the world or not, putting my son or godson into a coma is going to piss me off. I can't see where anyone has a problem with any of the characterizations in this scene.

[The Ray]

it's a powerful scene. Obviously played for melodrama, it serves to show that Reed's lack of emotion and pragmatic nature is a quality not every character has. It was the best choice he had. And saving the world or not, putting my son or godson into a coma is going to piss me off. I can't see where anyone has a problem with any of the characterizations in this scene.

I don't like the part where Sue runs into Namor's arms and stands by when he decided to destroy New York.

[TakoM]

it's a powerful scene. Obviously played for melodrama, it serves to show that Reed's lack of emotion and pragmatic nature is a quality not every character has. It was the best choice he had. And saving the world or not, putting my son or godson into a coma is going to piss me off. I can't see where anyone has a problem with any of the characterizations in this scene.

Uh I remember the wake up of Franklin poor Ultron now I know how Franklin got into a coma.

[CaptCleghorn]

I don't like the part where Sue runs into Namor's arms and stands by when he decided to destroy New York.

You really need to read both posts and the books you're talking about or you're going to continue to sound uninformed.

[Doctor Bifrost]

Joe Quesada explicitly said as his justification for One More Day that he didn't want kids reading to get the impression that divorce was an acceptable solution to marital problems. Either that, or divorce is too close to home for a lot of them and having it happen to the characters in the comics would completely suck out whatever fun and escapism was left in them.

I have to say, absolutely destroying a marriage and relationship between two deeply loving characters (to the point of wiping it out of reality) - by having those characters make a deal with Satan in order to save their elderly, fatally injured aunt - just screams "fun and escapism" to me!

The problem is the assumption that you can't have a fun comic if the characters are married, and so anything, no matter how illogical and dismissive, is better than that. I think that's a little short-sighted.

[Doctor Bifrost]

Who did that?

The Ray has created an entire thread dedicated to the belief that anyone having any sympathy or affection for Namor is proof of their lack of integrity and morality.

I'm not saying he's right or wrong, since I haven't kept up with the Namor story. (I often find superheroes to be surprisingly overforgiving of acts of extreme violence and/or evil. Batman, the epitome of justice, invited Lobo, a remorseless genocidal killer, to join a new team he was forming, and Batman's many superhero friends seem to just shrug that off. But I just consider that bad writing.) Just pointing out it's a big thing for him.

[Doctor Bifrost]

Sue actually lived with Namor for weeks at least, doing god-knows-what...

Playing parcheesi? Learning the mandolin? Making friends with a dolphin?

You don't mean... sex stuff, do you??!?!

[Huntsman Spider]

I have to say, absolutely destroying a marriage and relationship between two deeply loving characters (to the point of wiping it out of reality) - by having those characters make a deal with Satan in order to save their elderly, fatally injured aunt - just screams "fun and escapism" to me!

The problem is the assumption that you can't have a fun comic if the characters are married, and so anything, no matter how illogical and dismissive, is better than that. I think that's a little short-sighted.

My sentiments exactly. Like I said before, a lot of the people working at Marvel (and who were working at DC during the New 52 era) seem to not be able to grasp what a healthy, loving, stable marriage looks like and that factors into why marriages get treated the way they have been.

[King_Thor13]

Wiccan and Hulkling are still a happy couple AFAIK. They're one of the only ones. We've lost so many romances over the years. I suppose there's a desire to keep things fresh and new, but honestly, there are so many great relationships that ended abruptly that I wish could be renewed, or at least revisited. Daredevil & Elektra + Black Widow & Winter Soldier are two of Marvels best couples in my opinion.

Worth mentioning is the relationships writers are trying to save, or reinstate, namely Black Panther & Storm, Black Bolt & Medusa + Rogue & Gambit.

[Agent Z]

Playing parcheesi? Learning the mandolin? Making friends with a dolphin?

You don't mean... sex stuff, do you??!?!

Everyone knows that if two people of opposite gender spend any amount of time within proximity of each other it will lead to coitus. It's the law of the universe.

[anyajenkins]

I think it's gonna stay an industry problem as long as writers rotate. Most major Marvel heroes have had multiple long term relationships, but as soon as a different writer comes along it turns into this exact scenario:

"Hey, X shouldn't be with Y, they should be with Z."

That leads to either death, horrible argument then split, cheating, character moves away, selling souls to demons, etc.
(for some reason divorce is too difficult for writers/editors to wrap their heads around)

Honestly, I think Marvel would've already broken up Reed and Sue if not for their shared origin story~

Pretty much. Marvel's 'afraid' of marriages and serious long term relationships. So they're fine with a new writer who wants to stick x with z, for no reason other than that writer likes it. It doesn't have to a good story or logical, just 'different.'