So why can't Marvel do both (solo and "legacy")?
And who's to say Falcon won't have his own book after his run as Cap ends?
So many people act as if this is an either/or situation without acknowledging that there are many different ways to address the matter of diversity. Truth be told, I think there are more interesting potential choices for the "new" Captain America (Warpath, Cannonball, etc -- mainly for the "mutant" angle) but Sam is the one that makes the most sense from a historical perspective.
As another poster pointed out, it's very telling that it only becomes a "PC" move when a person of color, a woman, or any other "minority" is involved in the storyline -- so where does the real "problem" lie: in the "change" itself or in the "change" of color, sexuality, religion and/or gender of the people involved in said storyline?
Last edited by aja_christopher; 07-17-2014 at 05:35 AM.
Sam makes no sense because at best he is a street level hero. He really doesn't have the power set for the type of shit Steve does. If you really really wanted to put a minority character in the Captain America spot, you should do it with Luke Cage. Luke Cage makes sense being cap because he is part of the legacy of the Erskine Super Soldier Program and the weapon Plus program.
It's pandering because the replacements don't make sense in context and other minority characters who would have a better claim to the mantle of thier mentors are being pushed aside. Which is hilarious considering the fact the same people supporting this move marvel is taking are making up excuses as to why Sif and Valkyrie shouldn't be the ones to take up the mantle of Mjolnir.As another poster pointed out, it's very telling that it only becomes a "PC" move when a person of color, a woman, or any other "minority" is involved in the storyline -- so where does the real "problem" lie: in the "change" itself or in the "change" of color, sexuality, or gender of the people involved in said storyline?
Honestly, I didn't really see what the big deal with diversity was until Ms. Marvel came out & as an Indian American, it really felt like the first time I've seen my culture represented in comics in any meaningful way. I really do think that if Marvel wants to expand its readership beyond what it already is, a more diverse (and well written, of course) lineup of books can only help them. Anyway, it's not like She Thor & Falcon Cap are going to be permanent. But if the books are good, I can see both characters getting spinoff solos like Bucky did.
I'm not bothered when I see women or people who aren't white. The people who complain that a black man or a woman are getting a high profile are the people I don't want to be around. I'm glad that Marvel is ignoring their complaints.
Well this thread hasn't gotten as ugly as I would imagine. It's hard to accept change. It really is. The world is changing, and comics are changing with them, though it would be nice if we had more diversity behind the scenes, rather than just on the page. I believe that more diversity, appealing to people that aren't just straight white males, is what's going to save the industry from destruction. There's no reason to get upset about these kind of changes, because we all know what people who aren't into comics don't. The big two are cyclical. Changes like these, as much as marvel likes to say are permanent, aren't. Thor will be worthy again, and Steve will sling that shield again by the time avengers 2 roll around. That's the real sad thing. There's nothing wrong with nostalgia trippin, but how much is too much?
Now I know that some will say that "why don't they just make new characters instead of replacing old ones?" Brand new characters are very hard sells. It's a little disheartening that the only way to have diversity is to have legacies, but I think that could change if there were more diversity among the writers, artists, and editors. They could tell different kinds of stories.
Also, to the people who don't like this stuff, you don't have to read it, no one said you did, or maybe do read it. You might like it.
The problem here for me is that it feels like a marketing ploy. Miles Morales was basically exactly the same thing as they're doing here, but to me it felt like a natural progression for Ultimate Spider-Man. However, with that, I knew that Miles would be the new Spider-Man, and he wasn't a placeholder, filling in the suit until Peter Parker came back, whereas I am pretty sure that the characters here will go back to their respective costume soon enough.
This sort of thinking is what led to WCW's demise. Eric Bischoff thought he could rake in money and make WCW the #1 wrestling promotion by doing all sorts of crazy stuff to shake up the industry. The problems is that that half the stuff he did made no sense in the overall context of the storylines, shit was done with intent of creating buzzes on the internet that would bring in newer viewers who were interested in the shock but at the same time it drove all of the WCW's base support over to the competition (WWF) which was offering more traditional storylines. When the newness of the of shocking swerves were over, the casual fans left as the usally do and the base fans gone. In fact, WCW stragled fpr three years going form shocking swerve to shocking swerve to bring in newer veiwers because they drove all of thier core fans.
The point of the story is that you can't expect to keep going from shocking story to shocking story which is what marvel has been doing on a constant basis since Civil War. It drives readers away and the only way to you can get any newer readership is by doing these publicity stunts which eventually end up being flash in the pans in any event.
I accept the new Thor. It's a good temporary change but I'm definitely going to miss Thor because he's one of my favorite Avengers members ( aside from BP and Scarlet Witch). I did mention I like Captain America but it the likeness kinda went down so he's not in my favorite 4 (include Sentry) avengers anymore. I like the female Thor but her costume is ugly (image above). I hope that's not how it really shows when the book comes.
I have always thought and I know some agreed with me ( there was a thread made about Falcon and I think most of us felt the same way) that Falcon is kind-of-not interesting character among the Avengers. Aside from that, I believe there are other characters who would be a better Captain America than him and I've said this on my previous post from another thread. Why not Black Panther or Iron Fist or Daredevil as Captain America?
For Iron Man, I'm not sure if I like his new costume. The black colored part of the costume could be the reason why I'm leaning to not liking it, and the trunks part I think. The design seems simple ( but maybe we'll get to see a better Superior Iron Man soon ). I always love Magneto with the red and purple and when he went with white costume, it was cool still because eventhough his red and purple costume looked more attractive, his white costume had more design.
Medusa looks like Jean Grey with longer hair.
Angela reminds me of Red Sonja and sometimes Darkchylde too. Angela's costume is too simple when compared to how she is drawn in Image. But well, we know Image artists are more concerned about how
The cape is fine but what happened to the design on Strange body costume? He looks like Strange in Nightcrawler's body. And the moustache?
I don't like the costume of Bucky, Deathlok and Captain America.
Ant-man, Scarlet Witch and Inferno are fine.
Am I the only person that likes the idea of Steve Rogers as an old man an consultant/Strategist? If Marvel can make that work I can see Sam being Cap for a good long while. Also it's very possible that Sam Wilson of the movieverse will assume the role as well.
If that happens then the racist troll rage is going to be epic.
As for Lady Thor cosplay made it cool so I'm down for it.
I'm actually stupefied about some of the posts made in this thread.
Are we all living in the same world ?
It's like there's planet white male readers, where everything's blue and fine... And planet everyone else, where everything's not so shiny.
Maybe it's a flawed attempt from Marvel...but at least it's an attempt.
And on this particular topic, trying too hard doesn't exist - if anything they should keep pushing forward for more diversity in the medium.
That's how change can be obtain: by trying, again and again.
I'm a woman, I certainly won't complain about Marvel making efforts toward their female characters, even less given how they used to be treated for years - not that it's perfect now, far from it, but things have gotten better...
And I'm pretty confident it's the same for members of every other community out there.
All I'm hoping for is that quality in term of art and stories will follow, that's all.
"The means are as important as the end - we have to do this right or not at all.
Anything less negates every belief we've ever had, every sacrifice we've ever made."
"Power corrupts. Absolute power corrupts absolutely."
"No justice, no peace."
It wouldn't have made sense in universe for daredevil or iron fist to take the mantle. They sort of tried something like that with black panther, it wasn't well recieved.
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