As a whole, the Batbooks are in poor shape. Agree? Disagree?

[Caivu]

It seems like the major complaint with Detective is that a character isn't getting enough panel time

I like Detective, a lot, and I'd say this is kinda one of its biggest issues right now. There hasn't been enough downtime for the team to really feel like a team. The stuff that has been in that vein has been good, but it's not been enough.

If the recent Annual had been just a flashback of them all running Mud Room scenarios or just sparring, that would've done wonders, especially to give contrast to the current happenings.

[Pohzee]

It seems like the major complaint with Detective is that a character isn't getting enough panel time and/or is going in a direction you don't like.

Is that fair to say, those of you who don't like Detective? Or are there other main reasons?

Not in the slightest. The more Tynion focuses on a character, the less I end up liking them. There are a lot of reasons I dislike Tynion, but the fact that he doesn't do enough with Batwing, etc. is not one of them.

[Twice-named]

It seems like the major complaint with Detective is that a character isn't getting enough panel time and/or is going in a direction you don't like.

Is that fair to say, those of you who don't like Detective? Or are there other main reasons?

I dropped Detective because I didn’t like the change to Jacob Kane. Namely, that he was grooming Kate to head the Colony. It doesn’t make sense vis-a-vis 52, Elegy, Go, Cutter, etc.

With respect to the main Batwoman title, I’ll give it another chance when it gets a new writer.

[Caivu]

I dropped Detective because I didn’t like the change to Jacob Kane. Namely, that he was grooming Kate to head the Colony. It doesn’t make sense vis-a-vis 52, Elegy, Go, Cutter, etc.

With respect to the main Batwoman title, I’ll give it another chance when it gets a new writer.

Oh, I beg to differ. It makes a lot of sense. And you're missing out on the new series.

[SamGuthrie1977]

Yes, very bad.

Tom King's Batman is trash.

[JasonTodd428]

It seems like the major complaint with Detective is that a character isn't getting enough panel time and/or is going in a direction you don't like.

Is that fair to say, those of you who don't like Detective? Or are there other main reasons?

Actually for me that has always been the least of my problems with Tynion's work. For me it boils down to what I feel are weaknesses in his writing. His overall execution is very weak. His plot points are not executed very well because he relies to much on things happening off panel that maybe need to be seen happening instead. He does far to much telling without enough showing, which stretches the limits of a reader's suspension of disbelief.

[oasis1313]

All the Bat-books just seem to be like a bunch of ground-up and ground-out stuff; it's too complicated (and expensive) to try to keep track of all the Metal stuff and cross-overs. It's jut not worth it.

[Barbatos666]

Actually for me that has always been the least of my problems with Tynion's work. For me it boils down to what I feel are weaknesses in his writing. His overall execution is very weak. His plot points are not executed very well because he relies to much on things happening off panel that maybe need to be seen happening instead. He does far to much telling without enough showing, which stretches the limits of a reader's suspension of disbelief.

Huh, I have the exact same problems with King. Lousy executions, no showing just a whole lot of telling.

I honestly think both Batman and Tec need a revamp.

[Barbatos666]

O'Neil was NOT a fan of Catwoman at all so if he came back, you would still get shipping, just with his creation and Catwoman would pretty much be gone. Like gone, gone. No stories with her in it at all.

Um no, there was no Bat/Talia shipping when O'Neal was editor. There was no shipping period during his tenure. He himself removed Son of the Demon from continuity. I've come to believe that shipping is a cancer. It killed my interest in Arrow, New 52 Superman and now Batman is headed in the same direction. So O'Neal's policy if true was a sensible one.
Catwoman got her book under him and she still appeared in various titles. She didn't disappear anywhere.

[Moonwix]

Um no, there was no Bat/Talia shipping when O'Neal was editor. There was no shipping period during his tenure. He himself removed Son of the Demon from continuity. I've come to believe that shipping is a cancer. It killed my interest in Arrow, New 52 Superman and now Batman is headed in the same direction. So O'Neal's policy if true was a sensible one.
Catwoman got her book under him and she still appeared in various titles. She didn't disappear anywhere.

I do agree with you on the shipping thing. Nightwing may never recover from the damage of it. I do like the bat/cat relationship but so far, since Tom king started writing them together, I have started losing interest in batman and the relationship as a whole, batman 39&40 was the nail on the coffin for me. It now feels very fanfiction to me.

[The Dying Detective]

I think when it comes down to it fanfiction is the answer to the problem mostly because sometimes there can be writers with brains doing the story. O'Neil should never have retconned Son of the Demon out now Damian's origin has become a big mess as well.

[HandofPrometheus]

Batgirl and her sister title BoP is in a rut. I'm sorry but the writers are doing a terrible job. Just find writers who can actually write these characters. Burnside Babs should've been dropped soon as Rebirth started. BoP haven't been written interesting since Simone and that title is just bad. Put Tom Taylor on these titles. He writes a better Dinah and Barbara than whoever is writing them now. Not to mention Babs does not have any memorable stories ever since this Burnside foolishness so I don't understand why DC thinks it successful.

[Barbatos666]

I think when it comes down to it fanfiction is the answer to the problem mostly because sometimes there can be writers with brains doing the story. O'Neil should never have retconned Son of the Demon out now Damian's origin has become a big mess as well.

Except Son of the Demon isn't Damian's origin. It's Batman and Son, the character from SOTD could never have grown up to be Damian, so Morrison would have changed it anyway to fit with his idea of what Damian was supposed to be who is the character we know today. Only Bruce/Talia shippers are salty about it.

[Aahz]

It seems like the major complaint with Detective is that a character isn't getting enough panel time and/or is going in a direction you don't like.

Is that fair to say, those of you who don't like Detective? Or are there other main reasons?

It is at least one problem. Most of the characters were far more developed pre flashpoint, and TEC is just not taking it's time to bring that back.

[The Dying Detective]

Except Son of the Demon isn't Damian's origin. It's Batman and Son, the character from SOTD could never have grown up to be Damian, so Morrison would have changed it anyway to fit with his idea of what Damian was supposed to be who is the character we know today. Only Bruce/Talia shippers are salty about it.

I think it was possible to follow Son of the Demon to the hilt in making Damian I know I am going to try even if he was adopted by a well adjusted couple. It's possible that he will be almost the same character he is today especially when the traits of Bruce and Talia would come to the surface as he grew up. But yeah it was up to Morrison to refit the story fit Damian's introduction but he did it in a clumsy fashion by relying too much on memory which ended up causing Talia's character some grief. I in a way prefer Bruce and Selina to be together but there are times that I see these shipping wars the same way one likes to watch a sporting event except I prefer to see it with a neutral standpoint and just watch for the sake of seeing which side would win.