Marvel sales figures for January

[The Real Hawkeye Kate Bishop]

The thing people fail to realize is that in regards to Marvel Two In One is that it is a relic of a bygone era. The comic market has changed people no longer want to read about a group of white people going on science adventures. We want diversity in our comics we want our comics to tackle real social issues that matter not made up science stuff that we can't relate to. Now maybe if they remade the fantastic four as a more diverse team that explored gender and social issues than yes it would be more well received. But as it stands now we have decades of fantastic four stories why do we need more?
Marvel also drove off a lot of the old guard comic fans I noticed that my local comic shop has become more diverse as a result I am seeing a lot more people than the usual crowd of 30+ year old white men who used to frequent the shop.
Times change the fantastic four haven't they are still the same four people they were back in the 60s. If marvel wants the fantastic four to succeed they need to change the team to represent the kind of people who are buying comics now namely younger and more diverse.

[Prof. Warren]

I think Bendis still sells books. Him not being a top seller at Marvel just comes down to that he used to write the Avengers and the X Men and now he writes Jessica Jones, Miles, Riri and the Defenders. It makes sense that those characters aren't going to sell as well as A listers, no matter who writes them. Just the fact that Miles is a success and Riri is on her way are a testament that Bendis is still a top creator. I think DC would be beyond happy if he's able to create a character on par with Miles for them.

The interesting question is should they have put him on Superman, who doesn't really need him, or put him on something like Green Lanterns or Cyborg, books that have characters who could be elevated? Bendis on Superman feels like McDonalds putting out a massive ad campaign for Big Macs... how much more are you going to get out of your signature product? Maybe an advertising campaign on their new healthy options would make more sense. Not sure if that made sense here but it did in my head...

There was no way that DC could have persuaded Bendis to come over by offering anything less than their most A-list characters. Bendis going to DC meant that he was either going to do Batman or Superman right from the jump. I'm sure he'll do many others over time but DC has to make the biggest splash possible with Bendis' DC intro and Cyborg or even GL just wouldn't fit the bill on that.

The fact that Bendis sells less now because the characters he works on are more B and C list is true to a point (although I would argue that when Bendis was a bigger name, The Defenders would have automatically sold like hotcakes). But that also underlines why it was time for him to go elsewhere. He's had his turn at the biggest franchises at Marvel. He can't go back to them without it seem like retreading old ground.

As for what Bendis is going to be able to create for DC, we'll see. I don't know if he can duplicate what he's done at Marvel at DC in regards to creating new characters that gain a real foothold with fans. Marvel and DC are very different universes with very different fanbases. It's going to be interesting to see what Bendis does over there and how the DC readership reacts to it.

[Prof. Warren]

The thing people fail to realize is that in regards to Marvel Two In One is that it is a relic of a bygone era. The comic market has changed people no longer want to read about a group of white people going on science adventures. We want diversity in our comics we want our comics to tackle real social issues that matter not made up science stuff that we can't relate to. Now maybe if they remade the fantastic four as a more diverse team that explored gender and social issues than yes it would be more well received. But as it stands now we have decades of fantastic four stories why do we need more?
Marvel also drove off a lot of the old guard comic fans I noticed that my local comic shop has become more diverse as a result I am seeing a lot more people than the usual crowd of 30+ year old white men who used to frequent the shop.
Times change the fantastic four haven't they are still the same four people they were back in the 60s. If marvel wants the fantastic four to succeed they need to change the team to represent the kind of people who are buying comics now namely younger and more diverse.

Yes to more diversity.

No to the Fantastic Four necessarily needing to embody that in order to succeed.

Marvel Two-In-One is about two characters searching for the rest of their family. I think that's enough of an emotional hook that anyone of any gender, race or background can relate to.

As for what the Fantastic Four should be like when they return, we'll see. I do think there's an argument to be made that those characters are of a certain time and place and that, if the Fantastic Four was launched today, they surely wouldn't be four white people. On the other hand, I don't think the fact that they are invalidates the worth of those characters or means that there's no place for them in today's market.

[Daniel22]

There was no way that DC could have persuaded Bendis to come over by offering anything less than their most A-list characters. Bendis going to DC meant that he was either going to do Batman or Superman right from the jump. I'm sure he'll do many others over time but DC has to make the biggest splash possible with Bendis' DC intro and Cyborg or even GL just wouldn't fit the bill on that.

The fact that Bendis sells less now because the characters he works on are more B and C list is true to a point (although I would argue that when Bendis was a bigger name, The Defenders would have automatically sold like hotcakes). But that also underlines why it was time for him to go elsewhere. He's had his turn at the biggest franchises at Marvel. He can't go back to them without it seem like retreading old ground.

As for what Bendis is going to be able to create for DC, we'll see. I don't know if he can duplicate what he's done at Marvel at DC in regards to creating new characters that gain a real foothold with fans. Marvel and DC are very different universes with very different fanbases. It's going to be interesting to see what Bendis does over there and how the DC readership reacts to it.

I think you're probably right about DC wanting to make a big splash. I'd also assume Bendis wanted some assurance he'd get a chance to create some characters down the line, since that's a real passion of his. I'd imagine it was a trade off both parties were happy with, Bendis gets big sales by being on Bats or Supes (which makes them both happy) and eventually will do original characters (which makes him happy, and if they stick, makes DC ecstatic.

Definitely true and I totally agree on your second point about him having already done everything at Marvel. Not sure about Defenders, though.. Bendis did Moon Knight and Spider-Woman at his height and neither lasted past 12 issues, although there might have been reasons for that that I don't know/am forgetting.

He's going to have a tough go creating new characters at DC. I agree the fan bases are very different. My personal experience is that DC fans are older, more conservative and less open to new characters. That's just based on my experience and not meant to be a definitive factual statement.

[The Ray]

The thing people fail to realize is that in regards to Marvel Two In One is that it is a relic of a bygone era. The comic market has changed people no longer want to read about a group of white people going on science adventures. We want diversity in our comics we want our comics to tackle real social issues that matter not made up science stuff that we can't relate to. Now maybe if they remade the fantastic four as a more diverse team that explored gender and social issues than yes it would be more well received. But as it stands now we have decades of fantastic four stories why do we need more?
Marvel also drove off a lot of the old guard comic fans I noticed that my local comic shop has become more diverse as a result I am seeing a lot more people than the usual crowd of 30+ year old white men who used to frequent the shop.
Times change the fantastic four haven't they are still the same four people they were back in the 60s. If marvel wants the fantastic four to succeed they need to change the team to represent the kind of people who are buying comics now namely younger and more diverse.

I know you are baiting, but...

You are aware that Kate Bishop is a rich, privileged white girl whose vanilla adventures have nothing to do with "real social issues", right?

[Iron Maiden]

The thing people fail to realize is that in regards to Marvel Two In One is that it is a relic of a bygone era. The comic market has changed people no longer want to read about a group of white people going on science adventures. We want diversity in our comics we want our comics to tackle real social issues that matter not made up science stuff that we can't relate to. Now maybe if they remade the fantastic four as a more diverse team that explored gender and social issues than yes it would be more well received. But as it stands now we have decades of fantastic four stories why do we need more?
Marvel also drove off a lot of the old guard comic fans I noticed that my local comic shop has become more diverse as a result I am seeing a lot more people than the usual crowd of 30+ year old white men who used to frequent the shop.
Times change the fantastic four haven't they are still the same four people they were back in the 60s. If marvel wants the fantastic four to succeed they need to change the team to represent the kind of people who are buying comics now namely younger and more diverse.

The core Fantastic Four family should always be the same. IMO they are a constant in the Marvel Universe and always should remain so as a tribute to what Stan and Jack created. Ben Grimm is a Jewish guy from Hell's kitchen, not a WASP as some seem to believe. And need I remind you that in was in the pages of the Fantastic Four that the Black Panther made his debut?

The Fantastic Four team has been different at times and they can achieve some diversity in that respect. Luke Cage subbed for Ben once and BP and Storm took Reed and Sue's place when they took a break from the team after the turmoil of Civil War. One of the brilliant ideas Hickman had was to create the Future Foundation. There were the Moloid children, a Wakandan child, and even a cloned child of an enemy, Bentley Whitman. When Reed and Sue return, they could add Lunella Lafayette.

[Crimz]

The thing people fail to realize is that in regards to Marvel Two In One is that it is a relic of a bygone era. The comic market has changed people no longer want to read about a group of white people going on science adventures. We want diversity in our comics we want our comics to tackle real social issues that matter not made up science stuff that we can't relate to. Now maybe if they remade the fantastic four as a more diverse team that explored gender and social issues than yes it would be more well received. But as it stands now we have decades of fantastic four stories why do we need more?
Marvel also drove off a lot of the old guard comic fans I noticed that my local comic shop has become more diverse as a result I am seeing a lot more people than the usual crowd of 30+ year old white men who used to frequent the shop.
Times change the fantastic four haven't they are still the same four people they were back in the 60s. If marvel wants the fantastic four to succeed they need to change the team to represent the kind of people who are buying comics now namely younger and more diverse.

The FF are a family adventure book. Not every book needs the message of social or gender issues, each book tackles a different subject or genre. If you want a book that tackles social issues and being minorities you can read the X-Men (which have been failing at that aspect for a while). If you want classic superhero stories read the Avengers. The Fantastic Four already have genre, my problem was that the science adventure took a backseat to the family aspect too often. I personally think Johnny should be bi, but other than that there is nothing wrong with the make-up of the team especially when you include the Future Foundation.

The FF needs change, but their genre and race is not one of them.

[yaddle]

Ben = Jewish
Reed = Atheist
Sue = Woman
Johnny = WASP?

[Crimz]

Ben = Jewish
Reed = Atheist
Sue = Woman
Johnny = WASP?

Some think Reed might be autistic.

[chamber-music]

Ben = Jewish
Reed = Atheist
Sue = Woman
Johnny = WASP?

Plus Johnny's Native American college buddy Wyatt Wingfoot used to sometimes go on adventures with the Fantastic Four sometimes.

[CIA]

The thing people fail to realize is that in regards to Marvel Two In One is that it is a relic of a bygone era. The comic market has changed people no longer want to read about a group of white people going on science adventures. We want diversity in our comics we want our comics to tackle real social issues that matter not made up science stuff that we can't relate to. Now maybe if they remade the fantastic four as a more diverse team that explored gender and social issues than yes it would be more well received. But as it stands now we have decades of fantastic four stories why do we need more?
Marvel also drove off a lot of the old guard comic fans I noticed that my local comic shop has become more diverse as a result I am seeing a lot more people than the usual crowd of 30+ year old white men who used to frequent the shop.
Times change the fantastic four haven't they are still the same four people they were back in the 60s. If marvel wants the fantastic four to succeed they need to change the team to represent the kind of people who are buying comics now namely younger and more diverse.

Yeah, the comic market want to read about lame mantle stealing characters so much that most of them are selling sub-indie level numbers.

[Cosmicbeing]

The sales are doing well if marvel and dc didn't become such multimedia powerhouses, although I find it strange that with the success of their movie and tv franchises more and more people should/would be buying and reading comics in 2018?! The mainstream public in general has quite unknowledgable and uncomplicated minds, I am suprised picture books aren't more popular.

Does anyone have a theory why hundreds of thousands of more people aren't reading comics, as at least in my opinion they are super awesome. Although I understand these figures do not reflect all of the market and possible over 50% of it isn't shown.

If price is a issue I am sure you don't have to look long to find cheap quality content; for example Secret War Paperback 256 pages for $4.86 on Kindle.

https://www.amazon.com.au/Secret-War...ds=secret+wars

The comic market has changed people no longer want to read about a group of white people going on science adventures..

This is actually exactly why I love reading comic books.

[Ra-El]

There was no way that DC could have persuaded Bendis to come over by offering anything less than their most A-list characters. Bendis going to DC meant that he was either going to do Batman or Superman right from the jump. I'm sure he'll do many others over time but DC has to make the biggest splash possible with Bendis' DC intro and Cyborg or even GL just wouldn't fit the bill on that.

The fact that Bendis sells less now because the characters he works on are more B and C list is true to a point (although I would argue that when Bendis was a bigger name, The Defenders would have automatically sold like hotcakes). But that also underlines why it was time for him to go elsewhere. He's had his turn at the biggest franchises at Marvel. He can't go back to them without it seem like retreading old ground.

As for what Bendis is going to be able to create for DC, we'll see. I don't know if he can duplicate what he's done at Marvel at DC in regards to creating new characters that gain a real foothold with fans. Marvel and DC are very different universes with very different fanbases. It's going to be interesting to see what Bendis does over there and how the DC readership reacts to it.

Superman is my favorite superhero, but I'm more curious about the imprint DC will be given Bendis. In that podcast he said that he will be bringing some big name creators to it. Now what a corner of DCU run by Bendis would look like? What creator he will bring? I think is almost certain that Fraction will be one.

About the sales figures, I don't really care . The only thing I pay atention to is if the books I'm reading are doing ok and are not in risk of being cancelled. if they are safe I'm happy.

[whiterabbit]

The thing people fail to realize is that in regards to Marvel Two In One is that it is a relic of a bygone era. The comic market has changed people no longer want to read about a group of white people going on science adventures. We want diversity in our comics we want our comics to tackle real social issues that matter not made up science stuff that we can't relate to. Now maybe if they remade the fantastic four as a more diverse team that explored gender and social issues than yes it would be more well received. But as it stands now we have decades of fantastic four stories why do we need more?
Marvel also drove off a lot of the old guard comic fans I noticed that my local comic shop has become more diverse as a result I am seeing a lot more people than the usual crowd of 30+ year old white men who used to frequent the shop.
Times change the fantastic four haven't they are still the same four people they were back in the 60s. If marvel wants the fantastic four to succeed they need to change the team to represent the kind of people who are buying comics now namely younger and more diverse.

FF by Jonathan Hickman is an incredible book and it's not that old. Diversity isn't a tried and true formula to make something work, you need something more than that. Iceman, America, Cyborg, Mockingbird, Angela, GI Joe by Aubrey Sitterson. If you want to make a book about minorities interacting with social issues then the X-Men is -> that way lol.

[Iron Maiden]

It's not like social issues were never addressed in the Fantastic Four. When it is revealed in Doom's origin way back in FF annual #2 that he is a gypsy, the mistreatment of his tribe is a key point.
And I am pretty sure the Fantastic Four may have been one of the first comic books to bring up the issue of apartheid in FF #119.

But I see we have a hit and run poster who brought up the issue of the Fantastic Four/MTIO being "a relic of a bygone era". The Real Hawkeye Kate Bishop hasn't returned to continue the conversation.