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  1. #1
    Moderator oldschool's Avatar
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    Default What classic villain will the new ASM writer use out of the box?

    We don't know for sure who the new ASM writer is yet (though Nick Spencer seems to be the heavy favorite) but we DO know that Slott is going out with a huge Green Goblin story and he has also used Doc Ock very heavily over the last 6-7 years. So, assuming that the new writer won't be touching Norman or Ock anytime soon, who might he turn to as a villain for his first stories (beyond new villains which every incoming writer tries to incorporate)?

    Personally, I hope the new writer takes a page from the old Uncle Rog playbook and uses some villains usually associated with other heroes for a change of pace; Stern did this remarkably well when he had Spidey fight The Cobra, Mr. Hyde, Juggernaut, etc. I also think it would be a good move if Spidey's rogues weren't lumped together so often like they are in Sinister Six stories or other bigger arcs. I feel it burns an appearance and also cheapens what should be formidable foes (Electro, Rhino).

    With Zdarsky using Tinkerer, Vulture and Kingpin to good effect presently over in PP:SSM, who would you like to see the new ASM writer take a swing at?
    I miss Kevin Nichols. Not as much as bacon, but still...

  2. #2

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    This is an interesting question.

    It'll be tough to use the big three because Slott did relatively recent big stories with Doc Ock and Venom, before the Green Goblin finale. The Lizard or Kraven would work.

    On the other hand, it would make sense to focus on someone Spider-Man hadn't fought before, just as that could be a more accessible story than featuring the return of a villain with years of backstory. If there was a good new villain introduced in a Marvel title in the last few years, who could pose a challenge to Spider-Man, that could be a way to make a splash.

  3. #3
    Moderator oldschool's Avatar
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    I also would welcome a new Sandman arc; it's been awhile since he has been used effectively and---when written correctly (see Marvel Team-Up #1), he has a fair amount of pathos to offer in addition to an interesting power set that provides challenges for Spidey.
    I miss Kevin Nichols. Not as much as bacon, but still...

  4. #4
    Mighty Member Lukmendes's Avatar
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    I guess it would be nice to pick a lame old villain and bring them back as more threatening by using their powers better, didn't they do that with Spot? I dunno who they'd use as a "big" villain if Otto and Norman aren't available though, maybe Mr Negative.

    Thinking about this is actualy making me think how complicated it is to use a villain, so many options, how to use them well, which ones shouldn't grow too much because it'd be unfitting...

  5. #5
    Moderator Frontier's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by oldschool View Post
    We don't know for sure who the new ASM writer is yet (though Nick Spencer seems to be the heavy favorite) but we DO know that Slott is going out with a huge Green Goblin story and he has also used Doc Ock very heavily over the last 6-7 years. So, assuming that the new writer won't be touching Norman or Ock anytime soon, who might he turn to as a villain for his first stories (beyond new villains which every incoming writer tries to incorporate)?
    I think if Spencer's work is any indication it seems he likes to draw on a lot of C to B-list villains for his books, and he made good use of Spidey's eclectic Rogues Gallery in Superior Foes (albeit with a more comedic bent I would rather not see in a main Spider-Man run).
    Personally, I hope the new writer takes a page from the old Uncle Rog playbook and uses some villains usually associated with other heroes for a change of pace; Stern did this remarkably well when he had Spidey fight The Cobra, Mr. Hyde, Juggernaut, etc. I also think it would be a good move if Spidey's rogues weren't lumped together so often like they are in Sinister Six stories or other bigger arcs. I feel it burns an appearance and also cheapens what should be formidable foes (Electro, Rhino).
    I don't remember the last time we got several one-offs with the classic Rogues. The Gauntlet, maybe?

    I think Spencer would do better at incorporating different villains then Slott was (I don't think Zodiac set the world on fire in their arc).
    With Zdarsky using Tinkerer, Vulture and Kingpin to good effect presently over in PP:SSM, who would you like to see the new ASM writer take a swing at?
    Vulture's kind of just there in Zdarksy's Spec run.

    He's like in Marvel's Spider-Man where he's not necessarily a major or significant lackey but an effective enforcer.
    Quote Originally Posted by Mister Mets View Post
    It'll be tough to use the big three because Slott did relatively recent big stories with Doc Ock and Venom, before the Green Goblin finale. The Lizard or Kraven would work.
    Slott did a Venom storyline but I don't think he really did all that much with Brock, since he seemed more interested in Flash as Anti-Venom.

    I think Renew Your Vows was where he really got to scratch his Venom itch.

    But I do think at this point that the big three have been so overused that they could all use a break, though Venom has his solo book still running so it's not like he and Spidey are likely to come-to-blows anytime soon (though Spencer and Cates are collaborating for the current Damnation event).

    I'm not sure if there's anywhere you can really go with Kraven in the Spider-Books anymore, because no one seems to have much of an idea of what to do with him since he's come back aside from having him be the villain in one-off stories.
    On the other hand, it would make sense to focus on someone Spider-Man hadn't fought before, just as that could be a more accessible story than featuring the return of a villain with years of backstory. If there was a good new villain introduced in a Marvel title in the last few years, who could pose a challenge to Spider-Man, that could be a way to make a splash.
    Who was the last new villain to really catch on? The Black Order as a whole?

  6. #6
    Helping the Helpless Denirac's Avatar
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    Mysterio???? Or just to be Awkward- Baltroc

  7. #7
    Mighty Member Lukmendes's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Denirac View Post
    Mysterio???? Or just to be Awkward- Baltroc
    Mysterio is in Las Vegas though, he retired as well, and even if/when he returns to villainy, he'd probably deal with Ben instead, unless Scarlet Spidey is canceled.

    Anyways, didn't Anya use to deal with some secret Wasp group? I hear that they just disapeared, maybe Spidey could deal with them briefly, if they're alright villains that is.

  8. #8

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    Quote Originally Posted by Frontier View Post
    I think if Spencer's work is any indication it seems he likes to draw on a lot of C to B-list villains for his books, and he made good use of Spidey's eclectic Rogues Gallery in Superior Foes (albeit with a more comedic bent I would rather not see in a main Spider-Man run).

    I don't remember the last time we got several one-offs with the classic Rogues. The Gauntlet, maybe?

    I think Spencer would do better at incorporating different villains then Slott was (I don't think Zodiac set the world on fire in their arc).

    Vulture's kind of just there in Zdarksy's Spec run.

    He's like in Marvel's Spider-Man where he's not necessarily a major or significant lackey but an effective enforcer.

    Slott did a Venom storyline but I don't think he really did all that much with Brock, since he seemed more interested in Flash as Anti-Venom.

    I think Renew Your Vows was where he really got to scratch his Venom itch.

    But I do think at this point that the big three have been so overused that they could all use a break, though Venom has his solo book still running so it's not like he and Spidey are likely to come-to-blows anytime soon (though Spencer and Cates are collaborating for the current Damnation event).

    I'm not sure if there's anywhere you can really go with Kraven in the Spider-Books anymore, because no one seems to have much of an idea of what to do with him since he's come back aside from having him be the villain in one-off stories.

    Who was the last new villain to really catch on? The Black Order as a whole?
    It's been a while since a new villain caught on. A further issue is that some acclaimed recent runs (Ms. Marvel, Waid's Daredevil) have characters who have less power than Spider-Man, so it would be tough to make the new bad guys major antagonists for Spider-Man.

  9. #9
    Mighty Member Lukmendes's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mister Mets View Post
    It's been a while since a new villain caught on. A further issue is that some acclaimed recent runs (Ms. Marvel, Waid's Daredevil) have characters who have less power than Spider-Man, so it would be tough to make the new bad guys major antagonists for Spider-Man.
    As long as the writter doesn't try to do it like JMS and pull a Morlum to make a villain sound awesome (By saying shit like "Not even the Hulk hit me that hard" or "You're the first villain who ticked me off") that would be a start, but for a villain to be really major, they need to be interesting, it's why Mr Negative is still around even though he's not that powerful.
    Last edited by Lukmendes; 02-26-2018 at 05:11 PM.

  10. #10
    Mighty Member LordMikel's Avatar
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    I'm trying to think of characters not mentioned yet.

    Swarm, so we can use Killer Bees. (*Points if you know that joke)
    Hydro Man. Maybe some kind of new Elements team. With Sandman
    Perhaps a new Hobgoblin. Or something like a Hobgoblin League. 4 or 5 of these guys.
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  11. #11
    Loony Scott Taylor's Avatar
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    We haven't seen Kangaroo in a while.
    Every day is a gift, not a given right.

  12. #12
    Ultimate Member Digifiend's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lukmendes View Post
    Mysterio is in Las Vegas though, he retired as well, and even if/when he returns to villainy, he'd probably deal with Ben instead, unless Scarlet Spidey is canceled.

    Anyways, didn't Anya use to deal with some secret Wasp group? I hear that they just disapeared, maybe Spidey could deal with them briefly, if they're alright villains that is.
    Honestly, they shouldn't use that group unless they intend to actually include Spider-Girl in the story. They're Anya's rogues.

  13. #13
    Moderator Frontier's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by LordMikel View Post
    I'm trying to think of characters not mentioned yet.

    Swarm, so we can use Killer Bees. (*Points if you know that joke)
    Hydro Man. Maybe some kind of new Elements team. With Sandman
    Perhaps a new Hobgoblin. Or something like a Hobgoblin League. 4 or 5 of these guys.
    I don't think Spidey's fought Hydro-Man in forever.

    The last time I can think of was one of the close-to-Superior issues, but that was SpOck.

  14. #14
    World's Greatest Hero blackspidey2099's Avatar
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    I'd like to see some villains who aren't regularly Spider-Man rogues as well, but in terms of just from Spidey's own rogues gallery, maybe the Scorpion/Mac Gargan?

  15. #15
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    I want to see more Lizard, but at the same time I would appreciate him being less dinosaur.
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