Can We stop using the term Omega Level like it means anything???

[butterflykyss]

I LOVE Ororo, I would never pit her and Jean against each other. Jean is my favorite, but Storm is a very close second. And she stars in LifeDeath, my all-time favorite X-Men story. :-)

To me, Nicieza (and the editors) calling Jean an Omega mutant, was an Easter egg to all fans of Jean as Phoenix. They sort of said: ”Yeah, sorry, we retconned away her Phoenix powers, but see here, she is an Omega mutant, she has the potential to be all-powerful again someday. It may never happen, but at least she has the potential. Are you happy now?” :-) And that Easter egg to us Jean fans was sort of destroyed when all of a sudden lots of mutants were considered Omega mutants. Damm. :-)

Ahhhh OK. That makes sense. I mean I get it how many of her fans would be upset by the Phoenix being stripped from her as her bigger stories revolved around it. I think ultimately not having the Phoenix will be good for Jean to show just how tough of a cookie she can be without it.

[johnnysv75]

Why as a Jean fan do you think Ororo is more powerful given many fans state Jean is omega even without the Phoenix?

Ororo is perfectly in tune with the atmosphere and the ecosystem, in many ways she is perfectly in tune with the planet itself, especially since her source of power is the electromagnetic field. I don’t think there is much that can stand in the way of those powers, and I don’t think Jean’s telekinesis can do that (and I believe she is a very powerful telekinetic). And since Ororo’s willpower makes it hard for telepaths to defeat her, Jean’s telepathy doesn’t give her an edge either.

[johnnysv75]

Ahhhh OK. That makes sense. I mean I get it how many of her fans would be upset by the Phoenix being stripped from her as her bigger stories revolved around it. I think ultimately not having the Phoenix will be good for Jean to show just how tough of a cookie she can be without it.

Yes, I think so too. :-)

[butterflykyss]

Ororo is perfectly in tune with the atmosphere and the ecosystem, in many ways she is perfectly in tune with the planet itself, especially since her source of power is the electromagnetic field. I don’t think there is much that can stand in the way of those powers, and I don’t think Jean’s telekinesis can do that (and I believe she is a very powerful telekinetic). And since Ororo’s willpower makes it hard for telepaths to defeat her, Jean’s telepathy doesn’t give her an edge either.

Thanks for your analysis. I completely agree BTW. You should share your thoughts and knowledge of her in the Storm thread. The more the merrier (^_^)

[raidensix]

Ororo is perfectly in tune with the atmosphere and the ecosystem, in many ways she is perfectly in tune with the planet itself, especially since her source of power is the electromagnetic field. I don’t think there is much that can stand in the way of those powers, and I don’t think Jean’s telekinesis can do that (and I believe she is a very powerful telekinetic). And since Ororo’s willpower makes it hard for telepaths to defeat her, Jean’s telepathy doesn’t give her an edge either.

When first introduced, the White Queen telepathically knocked out Storm, Wolverine and Colossus at the same time. Rachel also blocked Storm's and other X-Men's access to their powers. Nothing against the character, I like Storm it's just that when writers try to make a character so powerful (specially when said character gets a solo series) the character needs to get powered/ignored down in team books.

[rutog98]

When first introduced, the White Queen telepathically knocked out Storm, Wolverine and Colossus at the same time. Rachel also blocked Storm's and other X-Men's access to their powers. Nothing against the character, I like Storm it's just that when writers try to make a character so powerful (specially when said character gets a solo series) the character needs to get powered/ignored down in team books.

While Emma did overwhelm Storm with her TP assaults initially, as Ororo's character grew, so did her mental defenses to where Emma was no match for them...and neither were Shadow King, Warskrull (who had the combined powers of Xavier, Psylocke, and Oracle), Dracula, Bogan (a Xavier-level psi) who had Rachel's power added to his own, etc.

[Havok83]

Jean is the Phoenix. It’s been implied and stated that the ultimate evolution of her mutant abilities is to access the Force. If she wants it, it’s her to utilize. That’s her omega potential and it was fully realized in New Xmen when she emerged as the White Phoenix. People may want to discredit her bc of this but the Phoenix is intimately tied to her. The power she possessed with it dwarfed any other X-men including those that have temporarily bonded with it

[rutog98]

Jean is the Phoenix. It’s been implied and stated that the ultimate evolution of her mutant abilities is to access the Force. If she wants it, it’s her to utilize. That’s her omega potential and it was fully realized in New Xmen when she emerged as the White Phoenix. People may want to discredit her bc of this but the Phoenix is intimately tied to her. The power she possessed with it dwarfed any other X-men including those that have temporarily bonded with it

Jean is not the Phoenix. They are two separate sentient beings. Jean's potential is to be the most suitable host for the PF. When it merges with Jean, then Jean becomes a TP/TK that surpasses all other psis along with gaining the other Phoenix abilities. The Phoenix Force is not tied to Jean Grey (or anybody) unless is bonds with them in a symbiotic fashion.

[Tmacaoni]

Seemed appropriate.

[rutog98]

Also:

http://2.bp.blogspot.com/MF2MTLoC_P1...c1R3IJwk=s1600
http://2.bp.blogspot.com/H4eroLZVaHz...xDzLNf1S=s1600

[Psyknight]

No, they keep "TRYING" to insist she's Omega, but it's annoying. I'd rather her NOT be Omega related anything.



All the this! It's good they stop referring to her as the third, 2nd or 11ty billionth most powerful Telepath also.

*shrugs* I’ll never understand why these things bother you so much.

[Tazirai]

*shrugs* I’ll never understand why these things bother you so much.

That she's an Omega level?
Or her not being the 3rd best Telepath?

As the thread states. I would not Mind Psylocke being a super powerful character. But that's literally all we have is super powered supers with lots of power.
I don't like it with Ice Man either. But with Iceman it was different. When it happened to him he had to wear a special belt, just to contain his power. Then Emma frost came and mentally showed him new ways of using his ability.
Then Bobby trained and trained and trained. Then Age of Apocalypse showed us what a fully realized Iceman would look like.

That effort took like 7 years.
Psylocke got boosted by Jean and Claremont then she was suddenly the most powerful thing ever. It's kinda like how people arguing Storm is Omega and shuld curb stomp EVERYONE including Galactus of all people. It's a real argument.

Am I wrong for wanting more down to Earth and somewhat relatable heroes like in the 80's and early 90's?

Or am I stuck in a time when being a team member on a Super team meant that everyone contributed, but all had strengths and weaknesses?

I play Mutants and Masterminds 2nd edition and our GM was like Each of you get 3 complications (Weaknesses). Mental, Physical, and Power related.
In comics, heroes used to have something like this. Now even Batman is Omega Level. Dude literally beats EVERYBODY...(With Prep time of course).

I don't mind her being top tier. But is she really the Third most powerful Telepath on Earth with all the other Telepaths running around?
It's like how she was on her way to becoming the Warrior, got more experience, became better in the field, became team leader, Made a sacrifice, and BAM Insta Ninja, BAM Insta Omega, BAM Insta beat everyone.

I don't know Psyknight. I'm sick of the stupid power creep with no build up or explanation.

I'm not the only one who notices this. Tropes has whole pages dedicated to Psylockes and other heroes random ass power and skill upgrades.

[Tazirai]

Psylocke Tropes

Possibly an inadvertent subversion — while on paper going from supporting psychic to badass ninja sounds like an upgrade, she actually proved far less effective in ninja mode, losing most of her super powers, frequently filling in as the Worf of the team, and getting rather brutally eviscerated by Sabretooth, an enemy she had previously been able to defeat by psychic powers alone.


Anyway, Depending on the Writer... it counted as played straight (ninjas do evade a lot of attacks, unlike her previous, armor-clad self... plus her psychic blade in combination with her superior telepathy proved often to be a Game-Breaker) or subverted (The Worf Effect mentioned above).


Of course, that writer from shortly before her death to many years after her resurrection is the Action Heroine-loving-to-Author Appeal-levels Chris Claremont for quite some time. After her resurrection, she's been kicking ass, taking names, and making a lot of bad guys feel the wrath of her psychic blade, which now looks like a katana because Katanas Are Just Better. Against opponents who should rightfully be well out of her Super Weight class, she will, as per one of Claremont's favorite Author Catchphrases of late, "find a way to win." Today she is definitely more badass than where she started, even if it wasn't a consistent, steady climb.


The type and level vary wildly over the years, as mentioned above. Sometimes telepathic, sometimes telekinetic, seldom but sometimes both at once; sometimes just enough give a little edge to a mostly Badass Normal ninja, sometimes Phoenix-grade.

Here's the one that makes me nuts. Apply this to all of them, but especially to her.

The X-Men's most egregious example. From her inception, no one seems able to decide what powers she should have. She started off as a telepath/precog, then dropped the precognition in favor of stronger telepathy, then got a "psychic knife" after her Race Lift. A near-death experience left her with the ability to teleport through shadows in addition to that, and then she lost all her powers during a fight with the Shadow King, only to come back with telekinesis and a shiny new sword. And that was before she died and came back... Since then, Psylocke has grown quite a bit in power, so much so that writers described her as coming into the Omega Class mutant bracket, namely, the most powerful type of mutant around, the ones whose powers have nigh-infinite potential. Her powers (which now are both telepathic and telekinetic) were described as in a league with the likes of Phoenix or Cable. Lately though, Betsy has manifested her powers as manifesting assorted melee weaponry out of psychokinetic energy. So far she's created morning stars, swords, knives, bows and arrows... each one with tremendous destructive power.


Warning the Tropes website is addicting. I have to immediately close the page once I find a singular topic lol.

[SpiderClops]

Warning the Tropes website is addicting. I have to immediately close the page once I find a singular topic lol.

It really is addicting. I can say that by experience.

[MetalPsyc]

No, they keep "TRYING" to insist she's Omega, but it's annoying. I'd rather her NOT be Omega related anything.

Yeah.. I know what you're saying. There were several attempts that writers try to go Omega on her.
First time I recall by Claremont's "Her tk can smash mountain" and "She's resurrected to be the weapon against the Anti Phoenix (Four Forsaken)";
Then Remender called her Omega Class Telepath (just like Fraction's calling Emma Omega class telepath), creating a new term of Omega and adding more confusion.

Honestly I'm sorta on board with you. Being a very powerful character can be boring and when he/she's not performing well (in fighting scenarios) in the comics, many will complain. Thus less writers will want to use him/her.

I'd rather for her to be extra skillful, cunning, using all her resources when facing very powerful opponents. And IMO these several years they've been doing that (mostly).