Stanley Kubrick Fan Club

[Kirby101]

After going through the star gate Bowman is quickly aged through his life to be ready for the next step in evolution by the aliens. He becomes the star child, a new stage of mankind.

[Soubhagya]

Yes that pretty much sums up the ending. Kirby has an economy of words. Cool.

The clue to that ending is this sequence.



Pardon me for going through all this again. Just prior to this scene the apes have been shocked to find the monolith. So, this ape sees a bone and an idea comes to his mind. While this is going on there's a cut to the monolith indicating that the monolith is responsible. In a beautiful scene almost like a dance, he smashes the bones to pieces. There are cuts to animals falling down. That indicates they are going to hunt. And that is confirmed in a later sequence where they are shown eating flesh. Before those sequences it has been established that they don't hunt. They are vegetarians. And live in fear of being hunted. So, now they have progressed to be the dominant species and evolved due to that mysterious monolith.

That music cue is noticeably the same at the end. Those who know the meaning of that music 'Also Spach Zarathustra' know it means man approaching the gods. One benefit of using classical music. Those who don't know its meaning can still get it, as in how it has been used in the scene i posted. It signifies evolution from a lower stage to a higher one. So, the ending scene shows Bowman, seeing that monolith before evolving. (Its possible that he died and was reborn again. Old man in his deathbed to a baby. And that's no ordinary baby as he can fly in space unaided).

And i have read that he lifts his finger towards the monolith. That's similar to the famous 'Creation of Adam' by Michelangelo.

[Joker]

For example, it was Lucas' wife who contributed to ideas like the 'Trench run' in the first Star Wars. Originally, it was too long with Luke taking two runs at the exhaust port.

She essentially saved that movie. She was his editor. She went in and took his boring direction, cut and cropped scenes and made it a good movie. There's before and after comparisons, and when you watch them, you realize that she saved that movie.

The Prequels didn't work because Lucas is not a very good director, and she was no longer his editor. Also 'yes men' for sure.

[Soubhagya]

When i mentioned Lucas i didn't mean to criticize him. Just an example in showing how listening to others 'can' be great. But anyway moving on, I don't hear a lot about Eyes Wide Shut. I think it was a wonderful film. Its nice to hear from somebody else about that film. It is not a big thing. In the end they are also film fans like us. Still its cool to hear from them. After all i don't need to tell who they are.

[Soubhagya]

While watching A Clockwork Orange once again i noticed some details.

Alex comes to the writer again. This time after he was injured. He takes a bath and sits down to have dinner. I noticed that he was wearing the same robe which the writer was wearing when he attacked the writer earlier in the film.

Its such a small detail. But it brings so much to the table. (Ha! Made a pun). Here Alex is the victim just as the writer was. And the writer is in the position of power as Alex was. Its amusing, to see the positions reversed.

When Alex rings at the door, the shot is the same as before. The camera starts with the writer, pans to the right showing his bodyguard/servant who is dressed in an oddly pink costume as his wife had before. I had noticed the costume before. But not that the scene is shot in exact same way. I don't get why he's dressed like this but i am sure it must be due to some reason.

Later, when Alex is trapped and shouts to others to stop the music, there's a cut to the writer. The camera starts from his close-up as he is sadistically enjoying the music and slowly moves away from his face revealing the others. There are three of them. That's the same way the film started with the close up of Alex as the camera slowly moves back revealing others. It's like they are the writer's own three droogs.

Alex after leaving his parents' home, goes near the river and we get what's inside his mind without one line of dialogue. He watches the river and the camera slowly moves towards the river. Without one word one can get that Alex has suicidal thoughts.

[Riotzact]

^^^ Nice catches! More reasons for it to be my favorite film of all time.

Also, Eyes Wide Shut is criminally underrated, I rank it in the top tier of his films. I don’t understand where any of the critics of this movie are coming from. The only explanation is inflated expectations given the circumstances. But that still doesn’t makes sense to me because I feel it meets every expectation!

[Soubhagya]

^^^ Nice catches! More reasons for it to be my favorite film of all time.

Also, Eyes Wide Shut is criminally underrated, I rank it in the top tier of his films. I don’t understand where any of the critics of this movie are coming from. The only explanation is inflated expectations given the circumstances. But that still doesn’t makes sense to me because I feel it meets every expectation!

I haven't seen all of his films. But i definitely love Eyes Wide Shut. Wonderful film in my opinion. Nice to hear from someone around here who shares this opinion.

[keeen]

Cool.

That was another reason why i started this thread. He has a number of films which lot of people know and have watched. 2001 and Clockwork Orange for example. But he has a number of other wonderful films which many might not have watched. I loved Spartacus.

t first i felt a bit underwhelmed. Unlike other films it felt like a more straightforward action-adventure-epic. There's a certain signature or voice within his films. At least that's what i have felt with other films that i have watched so far. A certain 'cold' tone and some themes he wishes to speak through the narrative.

Spartacus did not feel like that at first. It is more warm in tone and one might say it even has a happy ending. Where's that commentary on some theme or idea? But then it has something to say. The decay of a 'free' or 'advanced' society and government. 'Freedom' built on the back of slavery and exploitation. And its one of those 'epics' of that time. Kinda like superhero films of their time. Except they have some truly amazing films like 'Lawrence of Arabia' and 'Bridge on River Kwai'. I have heard that its one of the films he wasn't happy with. He was brought in the last minute by Kirk Douglas. A studio film where he did not have the kind of freedom he usually had.

For Spartacus he was more a gun for hire. It was Douglas' film, he produced it and controlled it. I believe Kubrick was not happy with the experience and there after had complete control over all his movies.

Literally just today I heard about The Killing for the first time (I think they mentioned it on We Hate Movies, a fun podcast everyone might enjoy), so I will have to watch that next. And yes, you both nailed it - my impression watching this was that it was basically his superhero movie, the big-budget genre pic he had to make to get the industry backing to go on and do his own thing. It didn't feel stylistically like a "Kubrick film" except in that it was incredibly competent. I was wondering if there's a modern equivalent, a director who would say, make a Marvel movie fairly early in their career and then go on to achieve the same kind of visionary auteur status.

Anyway, that and Paths of Glory really elevated Kirk Douglas in my eyes. I mentioned it before, but that scene in Paths of Glory where he's walking through the trench before they charge the hill may literally be the most memorable scene I've ever seen, haha. The way he's got such a badass, steely demeanor with all the explosions around him, juxtaposed with that general's flinching walk through the day earlier...man, that's really phenomenal visual storytelling, like that alone kind of sums up the whole theme of that movie, the cowards sending men to die in vain for their own glory, and the brave men who are constrained by law to follow those orders and die. It almost parallels the theme of Dr. Strangelove in that respect, although on a more personal level. Soubhagya, you mentioned the final scene. I don't think I realized it was a German song, but the impression I got was just that the girl did humanize the men, like even if they didn't understand what she was saying they felt her pain and began to acknowledge their own.

[keeen]

I looked up a little on Kubrick's relationship with Douglas.

This one confirms some of what was already mentioned about the studio control over his early pictures. Seems like Paths of Glory was more of an independent film and Spartacus was the big-budget picture.

https://variety.com/2016/biz/news/ki...ck-1201937274/

Here's Douglas talking about making Paths of Glory and Spartacus. He's speaking French at first, but stick with it and about a minute in he switches to English. He speaks very highly of Kubrick and has tons of insight on the behind the scenes business. Actually, they had a disagreement about that final scene, haha. Kubrick fought to keep it in. The payoff to that story is great, by the way

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7EEITi9DJ2U

[Soubhagya]

Literally just today I heard about The Killing for the first time (I think they mentioned it on We Hate Movies, a fun podcast everyone might enjoy), so I will have to watch that next. And yes, you both nailed it - my impression watching this was that it was basically his superhero movie, the big-budget genre pic he had to make to get the industry backing to go on and do his own thing. It didn't feel stylistically like a "Kubrick film" except in that it was incredibly competent. I was wondering if there's a modern equivalent, a director who would say, make a Marvel movie fairly early in their career and then go on to achieve the same kind of visionary auteur status.

Anyway, that and Paths of Glory really elevated Kirk Douglas in my eyes. I mentioned it before, but that scene in Paths of Glory where he's walking through the trench before they charge the hill may literally be the most memorable scene I've ever seen, haha. The way he's got such a badass, steely demeanor with all the explosions around him, juxtaposed with that general's flinching walk through the day earlier...man, that's really phenomenal visual storytelling, like that alone kind of sums up the whole theme of that movie, the cowards sending men to die in vain for their own glory, and the brave men who are constrained by law to follow those orders and die. It almost parallels the theme of Dr. Strangelove in that respect, although on a more personal level. Soubhagya, you mentioned the final scene. I don't think I realized it was a German song, but the impression I got was just that the girl did humanize the men, like even if they didn't understand what she was saying they felt her pain and began to acknowledge their own.

Great catch!

I had not noticed that when i watched this the first time. I did watch it again today. And its awesome. Kubrick wasn't simply showing off, (though i wouldn't mind anyone showing off) it makes perfect sense in terms of the film's themes and the story itself. I have noticed that Kubrick's films are such that they reward repeat viewings. I liked the film a lot in my first watch. But i like it even more. I had mentioned in a previous post that i was looking at it differently. Hoping for a desirable conclusion for the three soldiers. But it does not happen. Its such a punch to the gut.

I actually read up online about the song. I couldn't understand at all why it was there. I am still not fully sure why its there though i think you are quite right. I don't think its about humanizing them. They already were humanized in the film. Yet, if you say it humanized them even more, i agree with you. French soldiers could hum along with the simple song of a German girl, even if they couldn't understand the words is a powerful scene.

The first time i did not like it because i don't like to see a woman like her feeling uncomfortable at stage. Its a terrifying experience when a helpless girl in a foreign land is made to sing before unruly and leering soldiers. This time i can say it completes the film. Its beautiful. The film does so much in its short run time that i will have to agree that its one of the best war films i have seen.

I have developed a lot of respect for Kirk Douglas. When i see an actor having commanding roles in two great films, i develop respect for them. I must admit when i watched Spartacus i could not go beyond his Hollywood looks at first. He had the quintessential tough hero look including that chin. It somehow creates an impression of less acting talent. That he got this by his looks. But he was great in a film filled with great performances. His was a compelling lead. Paths of Glory has him play a similar kind of role. But it does not matter. He was great here too. Love him.

I will watch the Killing soon. I have heard its a great film. At one time it was in IMDB Top 250. That list does not mean much. But it has a lot of great films along with the more popular ones. And thanks for mentioning that podcast. I may check it out sometime.

[Soubhagya]

I looked up a little on Kubrick's relationship with Douglas.

This one confirms some of what was already mentioned about the studio control over his early pictures. Seems like Paths of Glory was more of an independent film and Spartacus was the big-budget picture.

https://variety.com/2016/biz/news/ki...ck-1201937274/

Here's Douglas talking about making Paths of Glory and Spartacus. He's speaking French at first, but stick with it and about a minute in he switches to English. He speaks very highly of Kubrick and has tons of insight on the behind the scenes business. Actually, they had a disagreement about that final scene, haha. Kubrick fought to keep it in. The payoff to that story is great, by the way

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7EEITi9DJ2U

Thanks for sharing this. One would guess that Kubrick would be the one fighting against it. His films weren't much sentimental. But here Kubrick was the one wanting to keep that and Kirk Douglas against it. Its kind of surprising.

And it was nice to hear Kirk Douglas.

[Soubhagya]

Stanley Kubrick was very secretive. He would not give a lot of interviews. So, hearing what were his favorite films is rare. There are many films mentioned by second and third hand sources. They can be easily found on the internet. But he gave a personal top 10 in an interview to a magazine named 'Cinema' in 1963. Needless to say these might have changed over the years. Still its quite a list.

1. I Vitelloni (Fellini, 1953)
2. Wild Strawberries (Bergman, 1957)
3. Citizen Kane (Welles, 1941)
4. The Treasure of the Sierra Madre (Huston, 1948)
5. City Lights (Chaplin, 1931)
6. Henry V (Olivier, 1944)
7. La notte (Antonioni, 1961)
8. The Bank Dick (Fields, 1940---above)
9. Roxie Hart (Wellman, 1942)
10. Hell’s Angels (Hughes, 1930)

My question is has anyone watched any of these films? Any opinions you would like to share.

I recently watched 'Wild Strawberries'. And it was great. I liked it a lot. Watching it again, i liked it a bit more. I have a feeling considering its subject matter that i will only keep liking it more and more. Apart from that i have watched Citizen Kane. That film will definitely be within my top 20.

[Kirby101]

Stanley Kubrick was very secretive. He would not give a lot of interviews. So, hearing what were his favorite films is rare. There are many films mentioned by second and third hand sources. They can be easily found on the internet. But he gave a personal top 10 in an interview to a magazine named 'Cinema' in 1963. Needless to say these might have changed over the years. Still its quite a list.

1. I Vitelloni (Fellini, 1953)
2. Wild Strawberries (Bergman, 1957)
3. Citizen Kane (Welles, 1941)
4. The Treasure of the Sierra Madre (Huston, 1948)
5. City Lights (Chaplin, 1931)
6. Henry V (Olivier, 1944)
7. La notte (Antonioni, 1961)
8. The Bank Dick (Fields, 1940---above)
9. Roxie Hart (Wellman, 1942)
10. Hell’s Angels (Hughes, 1930)

My question is has anyone watched any of these films?

I recently watched 'Wild Strawberries'. And it was great. I liked it a lot. Watching it again, i liked it a bit more. I have a feeling considering its subject matter that i will only keep liking it more and more. Apart from that i have watched Citizen Kane. That film will definitely be within my top 20.

I have seen them all except La Notte and Roxy Hart. Though I've seen plenty of Felini and Antonioni.

[C_Miller]

I've seen what are arguably the most mainstream of these. Citizen Kane, Treasure of the Sierra Madre and City Lights. I've also seem parts of Hell's Angels. It was one of my grandpa's favorite films. Sierra Madre is very telling. I actually would argue that the themes of that movie runs through a lot of his work.

[Soubhagya]

I've seen what are arguably the most mainstream of these. Citizen Kane, Treasure of the Sierra Madre and City Lights. I've also seem parts of Hell's Angels. It was one of my grandpa's favorite films. Sierra Madre is very telling. I actually would argue that the themes of that movie runs through a lot of his work.

Then i guess i shall watch Sierra Madre next. Films which have influenced your favorite film makers can be an interesting watch. For sometime i am wishing to see some John Ford films. Orson Welles was a big fan of them. Do you like any of the films? I would like to hear your thoughts on any of them in one word or more. I should have framed my question better.

I have seen them all except La Notte and Roxy Hart. Though I've seen plenty of Felini and Antonioni.

I have heard quite a bit about Antonioni and Felini. Any opinions on the films listed? I should have framed my question better.

After watching some recent films, notably of Kubrick i am seeing what films can be. I am making it very reductive but Wild Strawberries felt like Kubrick made a feel good film. I can't put my finger on it. But film makers like Kurosawa, Kubrick or Hitchcock were excellent storytellers in film. Each frame, sound or cut would mean something. Where silence could say just as much as words.