Civil War Without The Foolish and Evil Actions of The Pro-Reg Side

[XPac]

I get that the Marvel Universe government is cartoony-evil. that's quite besides the point. Rogers played directly into their hands with his renegade act. and, simply because of who he is, others followed him into this foolishness. your average marvel civilian doesn't know that they were enabling Wilson Fisk's rise to power. they don't know the civil liberties that are being abused on a daily basis. that's why Cap should have been out front w/ Stark; embracing the registration act. you kill something like that from the inside. Ghost figured that out, immediately; during Dark Reign. the Anti-regs were just unwilling to sacrifice their ability to beat people up without restrictions. it would have been temporary; lasting only until the next big threat reminded everyone that their safety is totally in the hands of the special superpowered demi-gods running around. you can't fight a law with fists and laser beams.

The point of Hill attempting to take him into custody before the law was even passed was to force Rogers to go renegade. That was the brilliance, or stupidity of her actions depending on how you look at it.

If not for Hill, I'll wager Steve would have been more than happy to fight the law by more conventional means... but that ability was taken from him. And honestly it needed to, because otherwise this would have been a pretty darn boring event. It's a comic. We need heroes punching stuff. Laws can't be punched, but SHIELD agents trying to capture Captain America for refusing to go along with a law that hasn't been passed yet can be.

But in the end it all worked out for the best. The US government itself lossed out the law, Steve's life and reputation were cleared, and Stark paid the price for some of his less savory actions.

[Lukmendes]

The Bullseye mini also revealed that he was making up some if not all of the story and explanations he was giving people.

Yeah, but in that one in particular he never denied, he could still be lying about it though.

context matters. are you sure that he wasn't just creating doubt because the information is classified? I haven't read the issues, in question. the wiki article makes it seem just as likely that he was lying when he recanted all of the "lies" that he told. some of them were half-truths.

Everytime he says he was lying about something, seemed like he was doing it just to mess with people, not to withhold information.

[davew128]

they should embrace this as canon. there's a lot of story potential in it. it would explain how someone like Norman Osborn could go from prison to, basically, becoming America's top cop. it also would explain how Henry Peter Gyrich continued to get work.

Gyrich always gets work because he is a career government bureaucrat, who also happens to have the countries best interest at heart. He represents the everyman as a guy in government is scared to death by the powers of people running around the world. We as readers see him as an anti-social jerk who is rude and interferes with the heroes. The in story powers that be see him as someone who helps keep those powerful people in check. Despite all of his hardball stuff, at the end of the day he is a patriot and don't forget the way he refused to betray the Avengers to a disguised Red Skull.

[Agent Z]

The point of Hill attempting to take him into custody before the law was even passed was to force Rogers to go renegade. That was the brilliance, or stupidity of her actions depending on how you look at it.

If not for Hill, I'll wager Steve would have been more than happy to fight the law by more conventional means... but that ability was taken from him. And honestly it needed to, because otherwise this would have been a pretty darn boring event. It's a comic. We need heroes punching stuff. Laws can't be punched, but SHIELD agents trying to capture Captain America for refusing to go along with a law that hasn't been passed yet can be.

But in the end it all worked out for the best. The US government itself lossed out the law, Steve's life and reputation were cleared, and Stark paid the price for some of his less savory actions.

Tony offered Steve a chance to have a sit down and air out his grievances and Steve spat in his face. Hill was not the only one on the pro-reg side and Steve could have used any opportunity after the confrontation with her to get in touch with Tony.

A comic even can be more than just punching nor does that have to be heroes punching other heroes.

Steve may have been right to resist Hill's attempts to arrest him on trumped up charges but everything else was him going off the rails.

[Carabas]

The point of Hill attempting to take him into custody before the law was even passed was to force Rogers to go renegade. That was the brilliance, or stupidity of her actions depending on how you look at it.

If not for Hill, I'll wager Steve would have been more than happy to fight the law by more conventional means... but that ability was taken from him. And honestly it needed to, because otherwise this would have been a pretty darn boring event. It's a comic. We need heroes punching stuff. Laws can't be punched, but SHIELD agents trying to capture Captain America for refusing to go along with a law that hasn't been passed yet can be.

But in the end it all worked out for the best. The US government itself lossed out the law, Steve's life and reputation were cleared, and Stark paid the price for some of his less savory actions.

Yeah, it really is one of those moments where the curtain slips and you see the machinery. It's just a dumb scene where Millar throws Hill under the bus and has her do something incredibly stupid just to move the plot from A to B where B would be incredibly out of character for Captain America..

[XPac]

Tony offered Steve a chance to have a sit down and air out his grievances and Steve spat in his face. Hill was not the only one on the pro-reg side and Steve could have used any opportunity after the confrontation with her to get in touch with Tony.

A comic even can be more than just punching nor does that have to be heroes punching other heroes.

Steve may have been right to resist Hill's attempts to arrest him on trumped up charges but everything else was him going off the rails.

Hill was not the only one on the pro-reg side... but she was the one in charge of it until the end of the story. And the one in charge of it essentially established Captain America as a fugitive from the law.

And getting in touch with Tony wouldn't change anything, because apparently futurist Tony already predicted Steve would do this anyways.

But yes... a comic can be more than JUST punching, and I think it's fair to say this book was. But it does require punching especially if it's a company wide event. 7 issues of Steve testifying before Congress wouldn't work.

[Michael Watkins]

Gyrich always gets work because he is a career government bureaucrat, who also happens to have the countries best interest at heart. He represents the everyman as a guy in government is scared to death by the powers of people running around the world. We as readers see him as an anti-social jerk who is rude and interferes with the heroes. The in story powers that be see him as someone who helps keep those powerful people in check. Despite all of his hardball stuff, at the end of the day he is a patriot and don't forget the way he refused to betray the Avengers to a disguised Red Skull.

Tell it to Domino's ex husband