'THE SENTRY' From Jeff Lemire & Kim Jacinto

[ed2962]

You say this like the Rivera and Priest situations weren't a reaction from companies to those who constantly question the legitimacy of white males writing minority or female characters. Do you honestly think Rivera was hired for her comicbook writing chops and not because a certain crowd demanded a queer Latina to be written by a queer Latina?
The book was hailed all over mainstream and activist media for this very reason. As for the anti-white politics in the book itself, they're not exactly subtle and can't be misread when they so closely match the author's rants on twitter.
So of course people aren't going to see this the same way as a random straight white male (which happens to be the majority demographic in the genre) writing a straight white superhero.

It's not like people were picketing outside of Marvel, those concerns were made by fans who have seen any number of examples where well meaning people who weren't minorities tried writing minorities and turned in problematic stories. This isn't to say that only white people can write people, only black people can write black people, or only women can write women...I can think of examples were this has happened and the comics were terrible. But there's still something to be said about having an authentic voice on a title when it's supposed to be describing a certain experience. And Rivera wasn't just some random person that wandered in off the street, she has writing experience, she just wasn't a good fit for the title...it happens. What looks like a good idea on paper doesn't always work in practice, that doesn't mean you shouldn't try. And some people aren't seeing a white guy writing a white guy the same way they see a minority writing a minority because some fans think that the mere act of a minority solo title is extreme political statement.

Bringing it back to the Sentry, does this mean that only a person who's had mental issues should write the title? Of course not. But a good writer who has a mature understanding of psychology and knowledge of the different eras of comics would bring something to the title that some who can only do good actions scene won't.

[numberthirty]

Never followed Moon Knight. What did they do?

Without too much "Derail" or spoiling, the Lemire run ended in a very "Finished" green(to avoid spoiling) sort of a place. In contrast, the new run starts squarely in orange territory with absolutely zero details on how you got from green to orange.

Never mind that it feels like a direct successor to the "Volume Three" Huston run.

[numberthirty]

You spoke earlier of the unawareness you had about how comics had been tailored to you. This is another area where you're unaware of things because of your own identity. Also, you're making some pretty broad assumptions about the logic behind her hiring and why the comic was bad.

Please reconsider.

Along this line...

Food For Thought: Was the Lemire Moon Knight run not the sort of "Political"/"SJW" run you are bemoaning?

[numberthirty]

Back on topic, it is honestly Lemire's work at the close of "Volume Four" of Hawkeye that points to what he could really bring to Sentry.

[Lutecius]

What anti-white politics?

The first threat encountered in the book is literally "white energy" and America's immediate response: "pure white energy, uh? so let me give her a little of this brown fist"... No racial innuendo here.
Then her wonderfully diverse school gets invaded by evil white looking robots. And that's the first two issues.

You might dismiss it as a simple coincidence (though we all know if colors were reversed, there wouldn't be such generous interpretations) but when the writer tweets that she feels "triggered af at the mere sight/presence of white dudes, solo, but esp in groups, the panic & threat level is too real"... or things like "Holiday shopping got you down? Just go up to every white person in the stores and ask them if they work there, repeatedly, ignore when they say they don’t, ask where the bathroom is and if something is on sale, repeat til you can’t stop laughing" (and that's just a couple of her rants about "whiteness") it's hard to ignore the intent.

It's not like people were picketing outside of Marvel, those concerns were made by fans who have seen any number of examples where well meaning people who weren't minorities tried writing minorities and turned in problematic stories. This isn't to say that only white people can write people, only black people can write black people, or only women can write women...I can think of examples were this has happened and the comics were terrible. But there's still something to be said about having an authentic voice on a title when it's supposed to be describing a certain experience. And Rivera wasn't just some random person that wandered in off the street, she has writing experience, she just wasn't a good fit for the title...it happens. What looks like a good idea on paper doesn't always work in practice, that doesn't mean you shouldn't try. And some people aren't seeing a white guy writing a white guy the same way they see a minority writing a minority because some fans think that the mere act of a minority solo title is extreme political statement.

People don't picket outside Marvel or DC, they call the creators and companies racist/sexist/homophobe all over social media and blogs. As for "authentic voices", as a gay man, I sure don't find Rivera and Grace's runs any less problematic than whoever came before. And of course a minority solo isn't a political statement in itself but when you replace so many prominent male characters by females or minorities over such a short period, it's hard not to see a pattern. Same when you give an ongoing to someone with no experience in comics, who wrote one book and was better known for her slam poetry and activism. If you can't see it I don't know what to say. I'm going to stop now because this is way off topic.

[ed2962]

The first threat encountered in the book is literally "white energy" and America's immediate response: "pure white energy, uh? so let me give her a little of this brown fist"... No racial innuendo here.
Then her wonderfully diverse school gets invaded by evil white looking robots. And that's the first two issues.

You might dismiss it as a simple coincidence (though we all know if colors were reversed, there wouldn't be such generous interpretations) but when the writer tweets that she feels "triggered af at the mere sight/presence of white dudes, solo, but esp in groups, the panic & threat level is too real"... or things like "Holiday shopping got you down? Just go up to every white person in the stores and ask them if they work there, repeatedly, ignore when they say they don’t, ask where the bathroom is and if something is on sale, repeat til you can’t stop laughing" (and that's just a couple of her rants about "whiteness") it's hard to ignore the intent.

People don't picket outside Marvel or DC, they call the creators and companies racist/sexist/homophobe all over social media and blogs. As for "authentic voices", as a gay man, I sure don't find Rivera and Grace's runs any less problematic than whoever came before. And of course a minority solo isn't a political statement in itself but when you replace so many prominent male characters by females or minorities over such a short period, it's hard not to see a pattern. Same when you give an ongoing to someone with no experience in comics, who wrote one book and was better known for her slam poetry and activism. If you can't see it I don't know what to say. I'm going to stop now because this is way off topic.

I'll reply, then I'll drop it. Did Marvel/DC get questioned about their hiring practices by some people? Sure. Did they get called racist/sexist/homophobes all over social media? Not to the degree you're suggesting. Again those very same male characters have been replaced or changed before within a comparable time in the past and while there was criticism there wasn't "PC agenda" catchphrase and accusation of things being "shoved down our throats" being hurled about. I'm not defending Rivera and Roxanne Gay as appropriate choices for comics, I'm pointing out that calling everything a person happens to dislike about a comic "SJW Marvel" in many cases is sometimes wrongheaded and many times folks just parroting terms they've heard other folks spew.

[Tendrin]

I just wanted to ask:

Does anyone else feel like the timing on this is really weird?

Like, Bendis leaves Marvel for DC and takes on Superman and Marvel, at that exact same time, brings back the Sentry?

I don't know that there's any spite involved in that, and I find it pretty unlikely that there is, but it does /feel/ weird.

I wonder if other writers had wanted to do stuff with Sentry earlier and Bendis was sort of in the way of that.

[numberthirty]

While the timing does certainly fit into "Huh, Odd." territory, this also feels like one of those shots in the dark that Marvel will take when they just aren't sure what to do with a property.

[Tendrin]

While the timing does certainly fit into "Huh, Odd." territory, this also feels like one of those shots in the dark that Marvel will take when they just aren't sure what to do with a property.

Well, I mean, if any character deserves a fresh start in a post Bendis MU, it's Bob.

[numberthirty]

Certainly agreed on that.

Even if it only winds up being a new shot at a "Foundational" run that is cast aside by other writers in short order, an attempt at something like what you are mentioned is far from the worst idea Marvel has ever had.

[Kevinroc]

I just wanted to ask:

Does anyone else feel like the timing on this is really weird?

Like, Bendis leaves Marvel for DC and takes on Superman and Marvel, at that exact same time, brings back the Sentry?

I don't know that there's any spite involved in that, and I find it pretty unlikely that there is, but it does /feel/ weird.

I wonder if other writers had wanted to do stuff with Sentry earlier and Bendis was sort of in the way of that.

I doubt there's any connection to Bendis. They've done or undone things related to Bendis' work well before they were aware he was leaving.

It actually makes me curious if publishing got wind of something the movies were doing, even though there's not as strong a connection as there once was.

[Tendrin]

I doubt there's any connection to Bendis. They've done or undone things related to Bendis' work well before they were aware he was leaving.

It actually makes me curious if publishing got wind of something the movies were doing, even though there's not as strong a connection as there once was.

It's been rumored frequently that they'd like to do Sentry in late phase 4.

And I doubt there's much to do with it, I mean he was brought back by Remender already earlier, but still, the timing just makes it seem weird.

[PyroTwilight]

This should be interesting to see all things considered. I'm a big fan of Sentry. Alas I never really read Age of Sentry though. Probably grab it from the library to catch up.

While I wasn't a fan of how Bendis ended using Bob in Siege. I actually loved all the other things he's done with him. If only because after a while Sentry's history became a game of pick your own adventure which while annoying almost makes a weird sense for Sentry.

Whether an expy of sorts of Superman, Miracleman/Shazam or even Spectre I loved a character with so much built in duality. It was a great way of allowing you to kind of do whatever.

Of course I wish they did the one thing the previous mini implied but never touched on. Sentry as a ragnarok level event. IE That Sentry and Void would battle one another over and over and history would be erased to cover it up afterwards. I always read the original mini as such especially the way it ended. Void will always return he and Sentry will battle. World will forget at some point. Lather rinse and repeat.

[SuperiorIronman]

The timing may be coincidental. The Sentry was brought back (just not with his own comic), and it's not possible Bendis immediately got Superman and likely had to pitch something. Even if that was the case, I doubt Bendis just blabbed about it. Comics take awhile to get green-lit in order to make sure everybody is onboard and the comics themselves are usually completed some ways in advance prior to launching, which is why when something has to end early it can come to a stop and feel natural (at least that's the intention).

I'd say it's mostly coincidental timing.

[Tendrin]

The timing may be coincidental. The Sentry was brought back (just not with his own comic), and it's not possible Bendis immediately got Superman and likely had to pitch something. Even if that was the case, I doubt Bendis just blabbed about it. Comics take awhile to get green-lit in order to make sure everybody is onboard and the comics themselves are usually completed some ways in advance prior to launching, which is why when something has to end early it can come to a stop and feel natural (at least that's the intention).

I'd say it's mostly coincidental timing.

I don't disagree. Like I said, it feels weird but I think Lemire's pitch for the character and the possibility of a Cinematic MU version of the character needing more to drawn on are probably the bigger things.