DC has released King/Mann/Bellaire/Workman's Action Comics #1000 story online

[Flash Gordon]

In my head he's just Jon. I'll let someone else think of a codename if they think he should have one but it'll never be Superman in my book.

Yeah for sure. "Superman" isn't something that can be inherited. It's who Clark Kent/Kal-El is. Any child of his will surely do their own thing but they'll never be Superman.

[Superlad93]

Ha, yeah, we have. Probably more than twice. We're regulars, I think I've had the same conversation with the same people on so many topics dozens of times. And yeah, I mean, when it comes to me, I have an uphill climb as it is because I don't like the concept as it is. So I'm always going to be thinking of ways that I think will improve upon it, with a huge part of the reason being the selfishness of trying to make it more palatable to me. With at the same time genuine reasons of thinking how the character can excel longer term. But I'm sure plenty feel that even that is unnecessary. I respect that opinion as well.

Haha, it's not like I really mind. We have good debates.

I think the ground Jon is built on is more stable than you might think, and he's basically spoiled with tools at his disposal to both accentuate and deviate from the inherited aspects of his character. That's what Damian did. His original idea in Morrison's words were "Batman's evil son" and all that came with it. He started out as almost a parody of the ultra competent Morrison "Batgod" but the twist was that he killed as is being raised by Batman. Damian's character found solidification in Morrison's Batman and Robin where, again, in Morrison's own words "Robin is the Batman." He was the scowling, one-liner spouting, knuckle cracker who built a flying Batmobile, wanted to work alone, and wanted nothing more than to be Batman. And that was a fantastic and generally well liked take. It also formed the base of his character. He can never not be that guy to a large degree. And from a functional stand point, it lets a writer basically put Batman on a kids' or teens' team but play with the idea that he's still a child. I imagine that's part of the charm of Jon, and I also imagine he'll move much in the same way as Damian. The slightly exaggerated boy scout politeness and catching himself when he swears is both an endearing and fun character trait unique to him, and also something that conjures up a sort of loving parody of Superman. Keeping hold of that loving parody while forming a complementary character is the key, in my opinion.

[dan12456]

Damn I'm not even a Superman fan and that made me tear up.

[SiegePerilous02]

That was great. I want to see King on one of the main books even more now. And I'd LOVE to see it set in this future, where all sorts of crazy things can happen. Clark is effectively immortal, seeing what his adventures are like in the far ass future would be a great way to make everything fresh and exciting. So much cool stuff could be introduced in the expanded setting without it being forced to mingle with the status quos of the rest of the shared universe. And Lois is still with him!!

Screw legacy, there is only one Superman and he will always be around. And the "Black Hole Wars" sounds epic, make it happen.

[Superlad93]

Also, "Black Hole Wars". Seems like a throwaway cool idea, but then, so did the War of Jokes and Riddles before that became a whole arc. I don't think it's in question he wants to write Superman in a more extended fashion at some point - might this be setting up something there?

Sign me up for whatever King wants "Black Hole Wars" to be. Really hope he gets a maxi or something to at least start his future Superman deep dive.

All great points. And I don't mind Jon becoming Superman Secundus. It's almost the adult version of Superboy. There's still only one SUPERMAN, even if others take up versions of the mantle. That's how I parse it in my head.

Yeah, that's more or less--maybe not in those words-- how I've seen it, and I'd argue Morrison sees it much the same way. I don't think it's a coincidence that he literally makes Superman the living breathing sun that all other Supermen and Superwomen orbit around and draw power from. Kal Kent is even framed as a character who is constantly trying to live up to his ancestral forebears and Prime originator, Superman Prime. In DC 1 million, when Kal Kent think's he's dying and has failed to save the day with his super stunt of punching through time, he cries out saying "fathers, I've failed you." That's much in the same way you'd imagine a Superboy or Supergirl calling out. That's not to diminish Kal or his brothers, sisters, cousins, aunts, and uncles who came before him and far after Clark, but it's obvious that the perspective is never lost. He is their literal parent star at the center of their family solar system (his their All-mother, Lois).

[SanityOrMadness]

You know, I did see his slight stutter at that point kinda curious. Almost like, on a very small level the marbles aren't all there? Its small and there's nothing else to suggest a lack of cognition but its there then gone in a flash. Unless the stutter is him choking up a bit?

...seriously?

Let's break this down for a moment. His [Earth] parents are long, LONG gone. Even their bones will have rotted away billions of years before. But he keeps visiting, keeps maintaining their grave (presumably replacing the headstone from time to time) even when the Earth is long abandoned, a dead planet nothing could possibly live on. He hasn't let them go in all that time. And now even that's about to go. he's having to let them go once and for all, because even the PLACE is about to go forever. His very last physical tie to them.

And you're speculating he's lost his marbles because he's stuttering slightly when he has to acknowledge, in a word, that this is the FINAL visit he can make to their grave? Of *course* he's choking up a bit!

[Really, the only question is why - in an universe of immortality serums, Lazarus Pits and occasional literal visits to/from the afterlife - they stayed dead the whole time.]

[Embryonic Superman]

I've never been a fan of the immortal Superman idea, but this is a bit different. This one lets Superman keep his family, a meta-commentary on the notion that Superman IS forever, and, unlike the futures portrayed in works like Kingdom Come or DC One Million, so is his supporting cast. If new Superman stories exist on the actual day in our future when the sun consumes the husk of the abandoned planet Earth, Lois Lane will still be present and accounted for.

[Sacred Knight]

double post

[Sacred Knight]

...seriously?

Let's break this down for a moment. His [Earth] parents are long, LONG gone. Even their bones will have rotted away billions of years before. But he keeps visiting, keeps maintaining their grave (presumably replacing the headstone from time to time) even when the Earth is long abandoned, a dead planet nothing could possibly live on. He hasn't let them go in all that time. And now even that's about to go. he's having to let them go once and for all, because even the PLACE is about to go forever. His very last physical tie to them.

And you're speculating he's lost his marbles because he's stuttering slightly when he has to acknowledge, in a word, that this is the FINAL visit he can make to their grave? Of *course* he's choking up a bit!

[Really, the only question is why - in an universe of immortality serums, Lazarus Pits and occasional literal visits to/from the afterlife - they stayed dead the whole time.]

I already broke down the more likely scenario just fine on my own. The latter is just a speculative tangent that made a few of us think. Nothing more.

So yes, seriously.

[JasonTodd428]

This story was great and it really makes me want to see King on a Superman title right now.

[Nelliebly]

I've never been a fan of the immortal Superman idea, but this is a bit different. This one lets Superman keep his family, a meta-commentary on the notion that Superman IS forever, and, unlike the futures portrayed in works like Kingdom Come or DC One Million, so is his supporting cast. If new Superman stories exist on the actual day in our future when the sun consumes the husk of the abandoned planet Earth, Lois Lane will still be present and accounted for.

Yes! Yes! Thank you. And I think this is kind of what gets me choked up about it and why I'm ok with this even though, like you, I never care for the immortal Superman idea either. But for so many years, Lois has essentially been killed off or cut out of this narrative and let's be real here....I think we are more aware now that many of the times that happened...it probably shouldn't have. I think a lot of writers at DC are more aware now (just as readers are more aware) than they were 20 years ago about the negative impact of killing women off so casually. Even Mark Waid, who arguably is the most famous person to ever write this kind of story has openly said he has regrets now about Kingdom Come. Which speaks volumes. Because it's not like Waid would have to say he has regrets if he didn't have them. KC is extremely famous and well regarded even as it's been criticized over the years for some of it's treatment of women. But as Waid himself as grown and matured and I think seen the impact of what killing her off does to a story and how the fandom can start to devalue her or even openly plan for her death....I think he now realizes that he contributed to that in some way. He gets openly defensive now on twitter when people try to assume that he wrote KC with the assumption that Lois should always die and Superman should always end up with Wonder Woman. He doesn't agree with that at ALL and he's made that very clear that he thinks his story was misunderstood.

So...I don't know. I'm not doing a good job of putting this into words and I'm sorry for that. But it makes me almost emotional to see her get that chance to survive and thrive and be treated like the special person she is who is worthy of this kind of majestic and magical and eternal joy with her husband and son. It feels like justice for all the times she was killed off. Let her live and be part of this adventure until the bitter end. She's earned that much in 80 years.

[Superlad93]

Just for some general perspective and background info on the whole "maybe Superman is crazy" theory,

I just wanna point out that the theory was born directly from King's Swamp Thing special that came out recently. That story, without giving away too much, is based on the idea that Swamp Thing's mind wasn't quite right, and his reality was in question. Because both comics are basically one man shows, and have a melancholy theme of moving on, some people feel like they share story beats.

But I genuinely feel people only think this because the stories came out relatively close to on another. Outside of that, there's nothing in the Superman story that points to Superman being delusional. Unlike the Swamp Thing comic, there's nothing here to have us believe our narrator is unreliable, thus no reason to not take him at his word. The slight catch in his throat? That's a common "King-isim" along with his repetition. The catches, as others have pointed out, come at very pivotal and emotional swells in the dialog. One where he has to come to grips that this is last time he'll do this, one where he's talking about the grandson that they've never seen, another where he's trying to express just how proud of his son he is to the people that raised him, and a final where he has to admit the futility of coming back to a dead rock while he knows that's not his parents.

It's only 5 pages, and I'm sure King won't actively be against people interpreting his work in other ways, but I feel like getting the context that birthed this reading is important.

[Johnny Thunders!]

So good, nice King Sized Superman story!

[superduperman]

So Lois gets to spend all of eternity as a computer?

[Superlad93]

So Lois gets to spend all of eternity as a computer?

What? That wasn't in the story.