Page 11 of 11 FirstFirst ... 7891011
Results 151 to 157 of 157
  1. #151
    Incredible Member
    Join Date
    May 2014
    Location
    Canada
    Posts
    993

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by dancj View Post
    I'm not being a grammar nazi. My point is that when people are being self-destructive, we need to help them break that cycle. Judging them or their behaviour is basically shaming and doesn't give them the support they need. I've no idea what you mean by "Gotcha moment".
    Judging does not automatically equate to shaming. You can have positive and negative judgements of something to varying degrees of severity. Being firm on your disapproval of a course of action isn't shaming or bullying, its not being an enabler. Sometimes having too soft a touch, being too subtle, doesn't cut it. The Gotcha moment was you splitting hairs on terminology to infer a different context from the point I laid out. The "oh, you slipped up, I'm focusing on one word and making that the entire linchpin of what you're saying, regardless of the stated intent" moment. Disapproval and harsh disapproval are not the same thing, have different effects and are both judgements. Just like your attempt to break the cycle is a value judgement on the cycle that persons choosing to engage in, their personal choice, is not something you support and are even going to attempt to actively circumvent. If you didn't judge, it would be because you didn't care

  2. #152
    Incredible Member Jackmando7's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2014
    Posts
    698

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Raefe Mahadeo View Post
    Judging does not automatically equate to shaming. You can have positive and negative judgements of something to varying degrees of severity. Being firm on your disapproval of a course of action isn't shaming or bullying, its not being an enabler. Sometimes having too soft a touch, being too subtle, doesn't cut it. The Gotcha moment was you splitting hairs on terminology to infer a different context from the point I laid out. The "oh, you slipped up, I'm focusing on one word and making that the entire linchpin of what you're saying, regardless of the stated intent" moment. Disapproval and harsh disapproval are not the same thing, have different effects and are both judgements. Just like your attempt to break the cycle is a value judgement on the cycle that persons choosing to engage in, their personal choice, is not something you support and are even going to attempt to actively circumvent. If you didn't judge, it would be because you didn't care
    Where do you draw the line between someone being compassionate and sympathetic to someone being an enabler? This is something I have been struggling with lately, on more issues than just weight problems.
    When I was seventeen,
    I drank some very good beer,
    I drank some very good beer
    I purchased with a fake ID.

    My name was Brian McGee,
    I stayed up listenin' to Queen
    When I was seventeen.

  3. #153
    Incredible Member
    Join Date
    May 2014
    Location
    Canada
    Posts
    993

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Jackmando7 View Post
    Where do you draw the line between someone being compassionate and sympathetic to someone being an enabler? This is something I have been struggling with lately, on more issues than just weight problems.
    There is being silent when it's clear you should say something. Staying silent on a problem can be construed as tacit approval. After that, it's really a question of degrees as is warranted by a situation. Stressing a point a bit more if it came off as too mild the first time around and the serious concern didn't quite register. Of course making people aware you are there for them but not making excuses (an enabler will make excuses or pleasantries to feel good about themselves, which isn't helpful, just enforcing a delusion of healthy behaviour). Just honestly engaging that there is a problem and showing commitment, tact where needed and a willingness to address the serious implications of the problem and the need to address it being out of love/ caring. Sometimes, some people don't want help with a destructive vice, I'm sad to say. That's my advice since you asked, hope its helpful

  4. #154
    Extraordinary Member Malvolio's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2014
    Location
    Freeville, NY
    Posts
    7,375

    Default

    It also depends on the relationship between yourself and the person you're talking to. For instance, a man can be harsh when he tells his best friend, whom he's known since high school, that he's putting on a few pounds, but that same man may need to be more delicate telling the same thing to his wife.

  5. #155
    Astonishing Member dancj's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2014
    Posts
    3,788

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Raefe Mahadeo View Post
    Judging does not automatically equate to shaming. You can have positive and negative judgements of something to varying degrees of severity. Being firm on your disapproval of a course of action isn't shaming or bullying, its not being an enabler. Sometimes having too soft a touch, being too subtle, doesn't cut it. The Gotcha moment was you splitting hairs on terminology to infer a different context from the point I laid out. The "oh, you slipped up, I'm focusing on one word and making that the entire linchpin of what you're saying, regardless of the stated intent" moment. Disapproval and harsh disapproval are not the same thing, have different effects and are both judgements. Just like your attempt to break the cycle is a value judgement on the cycle that persons choosing to engage in, their personal choice, is not something you support and are even going to attempt to actively circumvent. If you didn't judge, it would be because you didn't care
    It sounds like we're working to slightly different definitions of "judge", but it's clear you aren't judging them in the way I was talking about.

    I wasn't splitting hairs. I genuinely misunderstood you.

  6. #156
    Incredible Member
    Join Date
    May 2014
    Location
    Canada
    Posts
    993

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by dancj View Post
    It sounds like we're working to slightly different definitions of "judge", but it's clear you aren't judging them in the way I was talking about.

    I wasn't splitting hairs. I genuinely misunderstood you.
    I misunderstood where you were coming from as well, then. Sorry if however caustic I may've come off seemed unwarranted

  7. #157
    Astonishing Member dancj's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2014
    Posts
    3,788

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Raefe Mahadeo View Post
    I misunderstood where you were coming from as well, then. Sorry if however caustic I may've come off seemed unwarranted
    It's all good.

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •