Why Dark Phoenix Saga?

[Divine Spark]

People see an obvious difference in looks and attitude, personality, everything really, between Famke Jansen and Sophie Turner. But even then people are clever enough to realise that two decades of real time requiresthe recasting ofa character that is supposed to be a teenager?
They see absolutely no difference between Patrick Stewart and Patrick Stewart playing the exact same character.

And really, how is timeline 1 Xavier in any way at all not the same guy as timeline 2 Xavier.

For starters Xavier in the new timeline is not a control freak.

I think most people see them as the same character since A.) Stewart played him (so it really did feel like the same character), B.) since both the OT Xavier and "new" one both branched off from the First Class version, there's some continuity there, C.) there's the meta aspect (as we're seeing Stewart's swan song for a role that we knew him in for a long time).

I think it’s definitely because it was a very familiar face in the role. Most people cared about what happened to the X-Men in Logan but a lot people are saying they don’t care about the X-Men in Dark Phoenix, despite the fact that they are literally the same X-Men that died in Logan.

I'm talking about the new additions in Cyclops, Jean, Nightcrawler, and Storm, obviously. And no, I don't care about Mystique. Not even a little bit, despite how hard they try to make me.

Did you found it tragic when they died in Logan?

[Divine Spark]

Btw

she looks 16. Jean should be more developed and realized before inserting the character into the DP storyline IMO.

Jean wasn’t really a developed character in the comic version of Dark Phoenix. She didn’t get a backstory until after she died. The casting list suggests we might get that in the movie version.

EDIT: Or are talking about physical developed?

[donpricetag]

Btw



Jean wasn’t really a developed character in the comic version of Dark Phoenix. She didn’t get a backstory until after she died. The casting list suggests we might get that in the movie version.

...what more development did Jean receive after that point (she got married, sabretooth conversation, Magneto war-thing, Cyclops/Emma, kissed Wolvie and uh death. I miss anything?)? Because from what I gather the character had been around for quite some time before then, and seeing as the X-Men haven't really aged much since that point it makes her out to be in her late 20s or very early 30s, same as Scott, Beast, Bobby and Warren. These new X-Men are young and look very young. From our prospective, they just became X-Men, and now without much of any build... Dark Phoenix? This thing could a giant snuff film and I doubt outside of the fact that they are kids, anyone would really care. There's very little attachment, thus the gravitas of it all is fleeting, at best.

[donpricetag]

Did you found it tragic when they died in Logan?

When who died in Logan? Logan? Xavier? I think your mixing conversations. I've got nothing in that discussion.

[Divine Spark]

These new X-Men are young and look very young. From our prospective, they just became X-Men, and now without much of any build... Dark Phoenix? This thing could a giant snuff film and I doubt outside of the fact that they are kids, anyone would really care. There's very little attachment, thus the gravitas of it all is fleeting, at best.

IDK, a lot people seem to care what happened to their older selves in Logan.

When who died in Logan? Logan? Xavier? I think your mixing conversations. I've got nothing in that discussion.

The X-Men that Xavier killed offscreen.

[sungila]

I don't watch the movies.

Dark Phoenix is one of the most significant and defining storylines in the X-Men comic book cannon. It's a classic. It's essential. It's ever-present. But that's about the comic books not the movies.

In the cinematic universe the Dark Phoenix Saga is just one of a million potential scripts that doesn't mean anything important, yet.

It'll have to do that if it does that by itself as a movie.

My guess would be that the Dark Phoenix Saga is a script that was shuffled to the top of the deck in the expectant wake of the breakthrough blockbuster performance and impact of the Wonder Woman event which was before Black Panther became the next best and even bigger event. Thusly putting things on hold until Marvel figures a perfectly exploitive means and moment for pushing their product through the primed societal pool they most wish to cash in on. How and 'the why' of presenting the X-Men to a vast market that hasn't been prefabricated to consume noXtalgia they don't have and a vibe that for it's beat of immediacy is very much a part of the time and place and people from which it generated from in response to, IMO means, JUST TELL AN ADAPTED STORY THAT'S COMPLETELY ITS OWN THING!

Disney knows how to do this with Fairy Tales. The cinematic X-Men who are casted from scripts that were writ in comic book format prior to 2000 will never work on screen now. Not in a way that satisfies those that were there, who are better off with collected omnibuses and well made hard copy editions, and certainly not for those who should and do demand contemporary stories and characters with contemporary voices to tell them.

[donpricetag]

IDK, a lot people seem to care what happened to their older selves in Logan.



The X-Men that Xavier killed offscreen.

It happened off-screen and was only alluded to. I felt nothing. I felt worse for the family that got slaughtered just for giving Logan, Laura and Xavier shelter for the night. Cared about Jean when she "died" in X2...

[donpricetag]

I don't watch the movies. My guess however would be that the Dark Phoenix Saga is a script that was shuffled to the top of the deck in the wake of the breakthrough blockbuster performance and impact of the Wonder Woman event which was before Black Panther became the next best and even bigger event. Thusly putting things on hold until Marvel figures a perfectly exploitive means and moment for pushing their product through the primed societal pool they most wish to cash in on.

Never looked at it that way. That this movie is just Fox following suit and chose the story that would put a female lead front and center (because, face it, there are no major stories starring Mystique... because she's not a X-Man.)... even though they did a version of the story already. Doing it not because they have story to tell worth telling as it was with Wonder Woman, but just because "we should do it, too!" Which seems to be Fox's thing before Deadpool and Logan, by that I mean, chasing trends.

[Divine Spark]

It happened off-screen and was only alluded to. I felt nothing. I felt worse for the family that got slaughtered just for giving Logan, Laura and Xavier shelter for the night.

Well it wasn’t merely alluded to but explicitly stated in Xavier’s heartfelt confession. That may have not worked for you but it did for many people because to them that was the same X-Men they knew since 2000, despite the new timeline. Similarly the tragedy in Dark Phoenix is more about Xavier’s failure as a mentor, or at least that’s what the interview suggest.

[Divine Spark]

I don't watch the movies.

Dark Phoenix is one of the most significant and defining storylines in the X-Men comic book cannon. It's a classic. It's essential. It's ever-present. But that's about the comic books not the movies.

In the cinematic universe the Dark Phoenix Saga is just one of a million potential scripts that doesn't mean anything important, yet.

It'll have to do that if it does that by itself as a movie.

My guess would be that the Dark Phoenix Saga is a script that was shuffled to the top of the deck in the expectant wake of the breakthrough blockbuster performance and impact of the Wonder Woman event which was before Black Panther became the next best and even bigger event. Thusly putting things on hold until Marvel figures a perfectly exploitive means and moment for pushing their product through the primed societal pool they most wish to cash in on. How and 'the why' of presenting the X-Men to a vast market that hasn't been prefabricated to consume noXtalgia they don't have and a vibe that for it's beat of immediacy is very much a part of the time and place and people from which it generated from in response to, IMO means, JUST TELL AN ADAPTED STORY THAT'S COMPLETELY ITS OWN THING!

Disney knows how to do this with Fairy Tales. The cinematic X-Men who are casted from scripts that were writ in comic book format prior to 2000 will never work on screen now. Not in a way that satisfies those that were there, who are better off with collected omnibuses and well made hard copy editions, and certainly not for those who should and do demand contemporary stories and characters with contemporary voices to tell them.

Never looked at it that way. That this movie is just Fox following suit and chose the story that would put a female lead front and center (because, face it, there are no major stories starring Mystique... because she's not a X-Man.)... even though they did a version of the story already. Doing it not because they have story to tell worth telling as it was with Wonder Woman, but just because "we should do it, too!" Which seems to be Fox's thing before Deadpool and Logan, by that I mean, chasing trends.

Dark Phoenix was filmed long before Wonder Woman came out, iirc.

[Carabas]

The X-Men that Xavier killed offscreen.

Why would anybody care about characters that are not important enough to die on screen or even get mentioned by name?

[Divine Spark]

Why would anybody care about characters that are not important enough to die on screen or even get mentioned by name?

They were suppose to die onscreen. But it was cut for reasons I can’t remember.

[Carabas]

Dark Phoenix was filmed long before Wonder Woman came out, iirc.

Dark Phoenix started filming in June 2017, a month after Wonder Woman came out.

[Carabas]

They were suppose to die onscreen.

Irrelevant, they didn't.

[Brian B]

Btw



Jean wasn’t really a developed character in the comic version of Dark Phoenix. She didn’t get a backstory until after she died. The casting list suggests we might get that in the movie version.

EDIT: Or are talking about physical developed?

No offense, but ridiculous. Jean had 66 issues of backstory in the original X-Men and almost 33 in All-New, All-Different, plus significant guest appearances including one of the greatest bronze-age Marvel Team-Ups. Jean had plenty of backstory.

And that's part of the reason why I think this Dark Phoenix movie might be bad. The posters who say there's not enough backstory in the movies might be right. Jean Grey in the comics had plenty of backstory, which is partially why the whole thing was shocking at the time. Also, the other posters who said we saw this in Last Stand are right, too. We have seen this before, we didn't care about it then, and what viewer will care about it, now? Fox's X-Men need Feige to the rescue, ASAP.