Are we, as DC fans, 'jealous of the Marvel Cinematic Universe?

[Carabas]

The word Sith dates back to the 70s.

Sure, but you won't find it in the original trilogy.

[WebLurker]

The word Sith dates back to the 70s.

Okay, yeah, it was first used in the original New Hope novelization (a throwaway in in regards to Darth Vader's title) and the Sith order became story fodder for a lot of tie-ins in the '90s. However, the prequels were the first place that they went mainstream, for all practical purposes.

[The Darknight Detective]

Okay, yeah, it was first used in the original New Hope novelization (a throwaway in in regards to Darth Vader's title) and the Sith order became story fodder for a lot of tie-ins in the '90s. However, the prequels were the first place that they went mainstream, for all practical purposes.

Yeah, though comics even then would have loved the sales of that particular novelization (which my brother got as a birthday gift the day my family saw Star Wars for the very first time), it obviously didn't have the impact of the film. In fact, I had totally forgotten about the word being in the book until now (I read my brother's copy for the first and only time almost 40 years ago).

[Username taken]

The concept of "caving in" is feeling forced to do something. Often times something you wouldn't really want to do otherwise. So the Star Wars situation isn't an example of caving to fan pressure. There was no pressure. The Prequels may have a bad rep, but they made bank. So there was no pressure to make a change back to a more OT style and feel. I mean, I'm not saying Disney didn't have a pulse on things and get that fans would probably appreciate a return to such a feel. But at the same time their hands weren't tied; it wasn't a direction they HAD to go in.

So its not the same situation as JL. The DCEU has a bad rep AND has consistently underperformed. A change of direction HAD to happen (even if the resulting change of direction still wasn't any good). They felt forced to make major changes to JL because of that and a continuing chaos in producing JL. In that sense, they caved to fans only in the sense that fans weren't seeing the films. At least not enough. As Carabas said, piss poor Box Office. Star Wars has never had that problem.

Quoted for simple truth.

[WebLurker]

Yeah, though comics even then would have loved the sales of that particular novelization (which my brother got as a birthday gift the day my family saw Star Wars for the very first time), it obviously didn't have the impact of the film. In fact, I had totally forgotten about the word being in the book until now (I read my brother's copy for the first and only time almost 40 years ago).

Yeah, it was only one line early on. Also, for years, that novelization was the only place in the franchise that the Emperor's name, Palpatine, was used (subsequent tie-ins in the '90s did use that name long before the prequels adopted it). It can be pretty entertaining to look over the Star Wars franchise and see how many times abandoned ideas were re-used or elements from old tie-ins went on to become stapes of the mythos as a whole. But we digress from the thread's topic.)

[Vinsanity]

I do love the Marvel Cinematic universe so much but there is a big part of me that wishes it was the DCEU with so many great films and ideas under its belt.

I do like what Marvel does but I think DC shouldn't go similar. They should try to do their own thing or look what works in their animated properties.

[phonogram12]

Okay, so I finally saw Justice League. It wasn't anywhere near as bad as I had anticipated, but in a strange way, that was the most disappointing thing about it. It was average and ultimately, average tends to be pretty forgettable. If it was at least as spectacularly bad as something like Waterworld (or hell even Batman vs. Superman) it would've left me with some sort of lasting impression. This is the JUSTICE LEAGUE fer crying out loud! Superman! Batman! Wonder Woman! The Flash! A fim featuring this team together for the first time should be a cultural phenomenon!

One issue I've had with Snyder's take on the DCEU pantheon is that he tends to care more about aesthetics than storytelling or characterization. Casting the perfect square jawed actor or attempting to recreate an iconic comic book panel exactly as it appeared in print doesn't make up for the lack of these two things. If anything, it shines a light on them even more. I just don't buy Affleck as the world's greatest detective or Cavill as either a mild mannered reporter or a heroic inspiration (WW still holds that title after her movie). As a result of both this and WB's rush to catch up the competition, the gathering of this particular group of heroes doesn't feel earned. It really just kind of feels like a box the studio had to check to get to where they want to go instead of simply being interested in telling a good story.

Speaking of aesthetics, I realize that Snyder movies tend to have a particular look about them, but the way he uses CGI feels dated by at least a decade. Making everything look like a videogame kind of negates just how high the stakes are supposed to be when facing a world-ending threat or even when just trying to get a family out of harm's way.

All this said, there were aspects of this movie that I enjoyed greatly. Ezra Miller is a freaking national treasure. He literally stole every scene he was in he had such energy (and I'm not talking about the Speed Force, either). Every Amazonian fight scene was great as well. Those scenes were absolutely visceral and I never had any doubt even for a moment that these women were born and raised to be some of Earth's finest warriors.

[Francisco]

I was just saying that many people think the only way for Superman to be good if they ripped off the Richard Donner films except that it didn't do well for Superman Returns and and the Christopher Reeve's version wasn't a perfect saint (no regard for property damage, killed Zod who was at his weakest, threw Luthor straight to prison without due process of the law, etc)

or going back after recovering his powers to beat up the guy he couldn't beat while at normal human levels.

Superman returns failed because it was a boring movie in which Superman left Earth for no good reason. Had they come up with a better reason for Superman leaving and then coming back. More and better action and a Luthor with an original plan instead of Luthor copying himself. And also more creative and original interactions between Supes and Lois.

[noisebloom]

Bumping this thread as there have been a lot of developments in both cinematic universes.

As a DC fan, I really enjoyed the birth of the MCU: Iron Man and Captain America were very good and sold me on two characters I was never that interested in. Years later, Guardians of the Galaxy was an unexpected delight. These movies had a really good balance of story, character development, action, and humor.

I was disappointed to see how much the DCEU stumbled when it launched, but honestly, the MCU got really bland and generic to me around the same time. They really started cashing in on how many jokes they could fit into single scenes, and the characters started to lose their identities as they were reduced to "joke machines". Granted, this wasn't the case for all of the movies, but the team affairs were really pretty lackluster and sometimes unwatchable for me post-2014.

DC Films has really gotten back on its feet and have released a run of really good movies; I hope this trend continues. I also hope that Marvel can dig in and create some more serious, meaningful movies with depth... I just worry that cashing out on dumb jokes is potentially more profitable than creating a novel work of cinema.

[Vakanai]

Eh, as much as I watch every MCU film in the theater, I rewatch very few of them. The MCU films are kinda disposable entertainment. And by kinda I mean like a solid 80% of them. I'm not going to be jealous of that as a DC fan. AT&T or WB exec or shareholder? Hell yeah. A fan? Nope.

[Pinsir]

Am I? No. Are DC fans broadly? Of course!

[charliehustle415]

Yes, very much so.

Marvel took C-Tier heroes and made S-Tier heroes on the sole basis of great writing.

They didn't have any of their superstar properties and hit it out of the park.

WB owns all rights to all DC characters and could not make a single movie that is close to a MCU movie. DC has SUPERMAN! BATMAN! WONDER WOMAN! and they couldn't do anything; and it's a sad state they cannot find talent to capitalize on this wave of superhero love.

This wave is not going to last forever and will go the way of the Western and I hope we get at least one movie that can be great

[Vakanai]

Yes, very much so.

Marvel took C-Tier heroes and made S-Tier heroes on the sole basis of great writing.

They didn't have any of their superstar properties and hit it out of the park.

WB owns all rights to all DC characters and could not make a single movie that is close to a MCU movie. DC has SUPERMAN! BATMAN! WONDER WOMAN! and they couldn't do anything; and it's a sad state they cannot find talent to capitalize on this wave of superhero love.

This wave is not going to last forever and will go the way of the Western and I hope we get at least one movie that can be great

They have made hugely successful Batman movies, and Wonder Woman was great.

[The no face guy]

Looking at the year of this post, I take it was most likely posted before Wonder Woman came out. I hear that Aquaman is good as well.

I'm not really jealous that Marvel has better movies, just saddened that they seem to have better owners who not only care about the quality of movies, but the comic sales as well. Don't quote me on this, but Disney seems to understand that the comic books are the creative life blood of superhero movie industry and seems to see the value in keeping them going.

AT&T on the other hand downgrades DC comics to a little kiosk at a major comic convention, to highlight Warner Brothers superhero actors. I find that insulting, without licensing to these characters, these multi billion dollar movies would not exist. You can't just uproot the comics and think they will continue to thrive on their own.

[charliehustle415]

They have made hugely successful Batman movies, and Wonder Woman was great.

Batman in reference to the Snydervers, not Nolan's Dark Knight trilogy.

Wonder Woman is debatable