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  1. #1
    Uncanny Member Digifiend's Avatar
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    Default Spectacular Spider-Man #304 preview

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  3. #3
    Formerly Assassin Spider Huntsman Spider's Avatar
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    Having read the issue as it came out today, I have to say, I thought it was an interesting look into what would have happened to the Marvel Universe if Spider-Man had ever quit for good. Needless to say, it's not a pretty picture, and J. Jonah Jameson is actually ashamed and appalled at himself --- getting what he thought he always wanted, a world without Spider-Man, isn't such a paradise, after all. Probably as close to the opposite of paradise as one can get on Earth. Not gonna give away too much for those who haven't read it yet, but it is a compelling look at what might have become of the MU we know and love without Peter Parker remaining Spider-Man.
    The spider is always on the hunt.

  4. #4
    Extraordinary Member Jman27's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Huntsman Spider View Post
    Having read the issue as it came out today, I have to say, I thought it was an interesting look into what would have happened to the Marvel Universe if Spider-Man had ever quit for good. Needless to say, it's not a pretty picture, and J. Jonah Jameson is actually ashamed and appalled at himself --- getting what he thought he always wanted, a world without Spider-Man, isn't such a paradise, after all. Probably as close to the opposite of paradise as one can get on Earth. Not gonna give away too much for those who haven't read it yet, but it is a compelling look at what might have become of the MU we know and love without Peter Parker remaining Spider-Man.
    it reminds me of that smallville episode where clarks wishs he never came to earth and Jor-el showed him what could happen. Things weren't good in that timeline

  5. #5
    World's Greatest Hero blackspidey2099's Avatar
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    I thought the issue was written well, but the plot was utterly stupid.

    spoilers:
    Spider-Man's absence is certainly not going to make this much of a difference - if anything, the fact that Peter was doing good at Parker Industries means the world would be better off, since alt. Peter was clearly trying to do good with his technology. The likes of Norman Osborn and Doc Ock could be taken out by someone like Thor, or even Iron Man, without a second glance. Other than that, Chip seemed to conveniently forget that Peter is just as smart as Reed/Tony, and has shown that he CAN build a time machine before - in a story written by Stan Lee, no less. A Peter who dedicated his life to studying and science should be even more knowledgeable than our Peter, and the two of them together could build a time machine without breaking a sweat. I'm hoping that next issue will be that Doctor Doom is dead, and Peter will have to end up building it himself, otherwise this resolution will be pretty stupid.

    Other than that, I liked the way he portrayed Gwen and JJJ. I already mentioned why I didn't like his helpless and stupid Peter (both of them) in this issue, but the other characters were cool.
    end of spoilers
    "Anyone can win a fight when the odds are easy! It's when the going's tough - when there seems to be no chance - that's when it counts!" - Spider-Man

  6. #6
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    Quote Originally Posted by blackspidey2099 View Post
    I thought the issue was written well, but the plot was utterly stupid.

    spoilers:
    Spider-Man's absence is certainly not going to make this much of a difference - if anything, the fact that Peter was doing good at Parker Industries means the world would be better off, since alt. Peter was clearly trying to do good with his technology. The likes of Norman Osborn and Doc Ock could be taken out by someone like Thor, or even Iron Man, without a second glance. Other than that, Chip seemed to conveniently forget that Peter is just as smart as Reed/Tony, and has shown that he CAN build a time machine before - in a story written by Stan Lee, no less. A Peter who dedicated his life to studying and science should be even more knowledgeable than our Peter, and the two of them together could build a time machine without breaking a sweat. I'm hoping that next issue will be that Doctor Doom is dead, and Peter will have to end up building it himself, otherwise this resolution will be pretty stupid.

    Other than that, I liked the way he portrayed Gwen and JJJ. I already mentioned why I didn't like his helpless and stupid Peter (both of them) in this issue, but the other characters were cool.
    end of spoilers
    In what story did Stan have Peter build a time machine?

    Whatever story that may have been, I think it's a misstep to have Peter be on THAT level. I think when you have Peter able to create a freaking time machine without breaking a sweat, you're taking his scientific acumen just a bit too far. Seriously, if he's that good that building time machines comes easy to him, he doesn't need to keep being Spider-Man.

    And as for Thor and Iron Man being able to take out the likes of Osborn, if Osborn figured out a way to preemptively take them out first in order to clear the way for his and Harry's rise to power, then that would make sense.

  7. #7
    Extraordinary Member Lukmendes's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by blackspidey2099 View Post
    I thought the issue was written well, but the plot was utterly stupid.

    spoilers:
    Spider-Man's absence is certainly not going to make this much of a difference - if anything, the fact that Peter was doing good at Parker Industries means the world would be better off, since alt. Peter was clearly trying to do good with his technology. The likes of Norman Osborn and Doc Ock could be taken out by someone like Thor, or even Iron Man, without a second glance. Other than that, Chip seemed to conveniently forget that Peter is just as smart as Reed/Tony, and has shown that he CAN build a time machine before - in a story written by Stan Lee, no less. A Peter who dedicated his life to studying and science should be even more knowledgeable than our Peter, and the two of them together could build a time machine without breaking a sweat. I'm hoping that next issue will be that Doctor Doom is dead, and Peter will have to end up building it himself, otherwise this resolution will be pretty stupid.

    Other than that, I liked the way he portrayed Gwen and JJJ. I already mentioned why I didn't like his helpless and stupid Peter (both of them) in this issue, but the other characters were cool.
    end of spoilers
    spoilers:
    To be fair, that's the overall problem with alternate world stories, one super hero stops working or something else tragic happens and the whole world goes to hell, even good stories have this kind of dumb ****, like Days of Future Past.

    I'll say that Young Peter giving up makes some sense, since he did it to protect other people, kinda like RYV, and even if he can make a time machine, doesn't mean he will since he clearly is not helping them (Though clearly he wants to do something, but he seems to be afraid).
    end of spoilers.
    Last edited by Lukmendes; 05-10-2018 at 12:06 PM.

  8. #8
    Formerly Assassin Spider Huntsman Spider's Avatar
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    I think the point of a story like this is to show that one person can make more of a difference than s/he tends to think is possible, and as Doctor Strange himself said to Spider-Man in one issue (maybe ASM 500), "You've made enough of a difference for a hundred lifetimes."
    The spider is always on the hunt.

  9. #9
    Loony Scott Taylor's Avatar
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    This reminded me a little of the scenario Mephisto showed Peter in OMD where he never became Spider-Man but rather became a successful businessman. That was just a tiny slice of the picture, whereas this is the entire picture.

    So the plot may seem over the top but I feel that Peter has had his hand in enough of the affairs of the other heroes and their struggles over time to where the premise of the plot is earned. Spider-Man really is that important to the health of the Marvel Universe.

    Its hard to name a hero Peter hasn't helped in their moment of need at one point or another. And in most of those incidents, Peter was the only one who could save the day.
    Every day is a gift, not a given right.

  10. #10
    The Superior One Celgress's Avatar
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    It's a Wonderful Life Spidey. The concept behind one of my favorite Christmas movies and one of my favorite comic book characters meet sweet.
    "So you've come to the end now alive but dead inside."

  11. #11
    World's Greatest Hero blackspidey2099's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Prof. Warren View Post
    In what story did Stan have Peter build a time machine?

    3967420-4dc20d1e49e99659eec677d4e0951ac2[1].jpg

    Word of god right there as far as Spider-Man is concerned. I remember Peter needed to ask Reed something before it worked though.

    Whatever story that may have been, I think it's a misstep to have Peter be on THAT level. I think when you have Peter able to create a freaking time machine without breaking a sweat, you're taking his scientific acumen just a bit too far. Seriously, if he's that good that building time machines comes easy to him, he doesn't need to keep being Spider-Man.
    I mean, building a time machine is far from his best feat. Remember when he discovered a source of limitless energy and was the only one who could control it in the Alpha story? Or what about when he solved the impossible equation of interdimensional travel in Spider-Men? Or when he created a device which could suck life-force from people? Or when he and Reed fixed technology from like 3 trillion years into the future? Or when he created a device that could duplicate the core of the Sun and contain it? Or when he reverse-engineered a weapon meant to take down Celestials? I mean, even in his second appearance he casually whipped up a device that could nullify a fundamental field of nature...! Comparatively, a time machine is not too hard. Reed and Doom did it, and I think so did Hank Pym. The extra-annoying thing was when Peter wanted to ask Tony for help even though Tony is someone who had a whole storyline when he got stuck in the past due to Doom's time machine and couldn't figure out how to build another one until he asked Hank Pym to help him.... While Peter has actually been able to build one with minimal help.

    Anyways, it's already true that Peter doesn't need to be Spider-Man. He would be a much more effective hero if he didn't spend his time as Spider-Man. Remember when he cured some flesh-eating disease in a few minutes? Or Zodiac poison just on a whim? That's part of why I like Peter and think he's unique. Not only does he end up messing up his personal life by being Spider-Man, but he ends up self-sabotaging his efforts to be a hero due to his guilt and inferiority complexes.

    And as for Thor and Iron Man being able to take out the likes of Osborn, if Osborn figured out a way to preemptively take them out first in order to clear the way for his and Harry's rise to power, then that would make sense.
    Because Osborn is smart enough to take out someone who can stand in the heart of the Sun and have a conversation? I find it funny that you're fine with this but not with Peter being able to build a time machine...

    Quote Originally Posted by Lukmendes View Post
    spoilers:
    To be fair, that's the overall problem with alternate world stories, one super hero stops working or something else tragic happens and the whole world goes to hell, even good stories have this kind of dumb ****, like Days of Future Past.

    I'll say that Young Peter giving up makes some sense, since he did it to protect other people, kinda like RYV, and even if he can make a time machine, doesn't mean he will since he clearly is not helping them (Though clearly he wants to do something, but he seems to be afraid).
    end of spoilers.
    I mean, fair enough, but it's not like Peter completely disappeared. He just quite being Spider-Man. He could have done a lot more good with his brain than as Spider-Man, and literally anyone he has beaten with his powers could have been stopped much easier by him in a lab. I can see why Young Peter is so scared, but Chip overdid it. And for the time machine, I meant our Peter can build one, not Young Peter (though Young Peter should be able to as well).
    Last edited by blackspidey2099; 05-10-2018 at 04:48 PM.
    "Anyone can win a fight when the odds are easy! It's when the going's tough - when there seems to be no chance - that's when it counts!" - Spider-Man

  12. #12
    World's Greatest Hero blackspidey2099's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Scott Taylor View Post
    So the plot may seem over the top but I feel that Peter has had his hand in enough of the affairs of the other heroes and their struggles over time to where the premise of the plot is earned. Spider-Man really is that important to the health of the Marvel Universe.

    Its hard to name a hero Peter hasn't helped in their moment of need at one point or another. And in most of those incidents, Peter was the only one who could save the day.
    The only issue I see with this is that Peter hasn't disappeared, and he still wants to be a good guy. every time Peter helped a hero with his powers, he could have done the same thing with his tech. Heck, our Peter created armor that replicated all of his abilities except Spider Sense for Prowler. He could have done that if he didn't want to be Spider-Man himself. Not to mention that every time Peter saved the day with his powers, he could have done so more effectively in a lab. Peter's greatest strength has always been his intelligence.
    Last edited by blackspidey2099; 05-10-2018 at 04:47 PM.
    "Anyone can win a fight when the odds are easy! It's when the going's tough - when there seems to be no chance - that's when it counts!" - Spider-Man

  13. #13
    Extraordinary Member Lukmendes's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by blackspidey2099 View Post
    I mean, fair enough, but it's not like Peter completely disappeared. He just quite being Spider-Man. He could have done a lot more good with his brain than as Spider-Man, and literally anyone he has beaten with his powers could have been stopped much easier by him in a lab. I can see why Young Peter is so scared, but Chip overdid it.
    Yeah they could always mention how he could be helping out people, all we get is Gwen mentioning that he always tries to make things better and making low cost technology for the world, but that's vague on how he's being helpful, specialy since there's barely any mentions on what he's doing; and while I can see your point about Zdarsky overdoing it, it seems that having this life worked out better for Young Peter, since Gwen is alive, otherwise he'd probably have backed out of it.

    And for the time machine, I meant our Peter can build one, not Young Peter (though Young Peter should be able to as well).
    Well, I'm against Peter being able to build a time machine, but if they were to keep his smarts on that level, they could always mention that Peter wants to be really sure if he's building a right one (Since he's also traveling to another universe), and/or needing material to build one which Doom has.

    Anyways, I now realized that Young Peter doesn't make any mentions of Teresa in #304, even though in #303 it seemed that 616 Peter was going to tell the characters from that world about her.
    Last edited by Lukmendes; 05-10-2018 at 09:45 PM.

  14. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by blackspidey2099 View Post
    3967420-4dc20d1e49e99659eec677d4e0951ac2[1].jpg

    Word of god right there as far as Spider-Man is concerned. I remember Peter needed to ask Reed something before it worked though.
    Yeah, I'm not counting that as in continuity.

    As I recall, that was a supplemental story or back-up running over a couple of issues in the BND era.

    If you had a Stan story when he was the lead writer on ASM, that'd be valid. This is just a cute fluff piece, not meant to be taken seriously.

  15. #15
    World's Greatest Hero blackspidey2099's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lukmendes View Post
    Yeah they could always mention how he could be helping out people, all we get is Gwen mentioning that he always tries to make things better and making low cost technology for the world, but that's vague on how he's being helpful, specialy since there's barely any mentions on what he's doing; and while I can see your point about Zdarsky overdoing it, it seems that having this life worked out better for Young Peter, since Gwen is alive, otherwise he'd probably have backed out of it.
    Also, even without being Spider-Man, Peter could easily have stopped all that catastrophe from happening by building tech and stuff. They made it seem like peter completely stopped doing good when he just quite being Spider-Man to save those closest to him. He could still have done something like building armor drones or whatever to stop bad guys. So I don't like Peter just sitting there and letting Osborn win, especially after Osborn almost killed Aunt May. If anything, it would have been more in-character for Peter to have nearly killed Osborn after that and then quit, not become such an impotent person.


    Well, I'm against Peter being able to build a time machine, but if they were to keep his smarts on that level, they could always mention that Peter wants to be really sure if he's building a right one (Since he's also traveling to another universe), and/or needing material to build one which Doom has.
    I don't see what's there to be against it or for it? Peter's one of the absolute best scientists and inventors on the planet. He can literally build anything, given the time and/or resources, and that's how he's always been written.

    Anyways, I now realized that Young Peter doesn't make any mentions of Teresa in #304, even though in #303 it seemed that 616 Peter was going to tell the characters from that world about her.
    Maybe she died and that's another reason why he acts cowardly? Because he's ashamed of failing her? Or maybe she saves the day next issue? I'd be surprised if Chip doesn't say anything about that next issue, or that would be a plot hole too.

    Quote Originally Posted by Prof. Warren View Post
    Yeah, I'm not counting that as in continuity.

    As I recall, that was a supplemental story or back-up running over a couple of issues in the BND era.

    If you had a Stan story when he was the lead writer on ASM, that'd be valid. This is just a cute fluff piece, not meant to be taken seriously.
    I don't think it's up to you whether it is in-continuity or not, LOL... Spectacular Spider-Man is a supplemental story to ASM - would you say it isn't in-continuity? The Marvel Wiki says it was 616 Spider-Man, which means it is widely accepted to be in-continuity. Is there any resource where Marvel says it isn't in-continuity?

    Besides, Stan Lee wouldn't have written that if he didn't think it was something Peter is capable of doing. Or do you think you know more about Spider-Man's capabilities than his own creator?

    Also, as I said before, Peter has done much more impressive things than building a time machine... Heck, even his WebWare design was similar to those interdimensional and intertemporal teleporter devices from Spider-Verse.
    Last edited by blackspidey2099; 05-11-2018 at 07:03 PM.
    "Anyone can win a fight when the odds are easy! It's when the going's tough - when there seems to be no chance - that's when it counts!" - Spider-Man

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