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  1. #61
    Mighty Member Dark-Flux's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by JFP View Post
    Where in this thread have I stated there is a way of knowing the number of readers that crossover from TWD? Go ahead. Find it. I'll wait here.

    While this fool who puts words in my mouth tries to make himself look stupid, I'll reiterate my point: The leadership at Image are extremely uncomfortable with the idea of TWD cancelling. During the days of old Image, the cancellation of one book didn't make them uncomfortable. Therefore, current Image is not in a healthy position compared to old Image.
    "Where did i say i could prove any of the baseless shit im spewing? Huh?"

    Youre a fucking joke, dude.
    Currently Reading:
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  2. #62
    Ultimate Member numberthirty's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by JFP View Post
    Dude, I asked, "If TWD left, is there a comic with equal pulling power?"

    You named Kill or Be Killed and Black Monday Murders.

    TWD sold 73,978 units in April.
    KOBK sold 16,240 units in April.
    BMM sold 0 units in April.

    TWD = 77,407 units sold in Feb.
    KOBK = 16,584 units sold in Feb.
    BMM = 12,568 units sold in Feb.

    In both months, KOBK and BMM didn't sell 1/3rd as many comics combined as TWD.

    Furthermore, I've been talking about if this has been good for IMAGE COMICS. I'm not talking about what the creators think. I only care about Image Comics in this discussion. Image Comics. That's all. Quit talking about creators opinion because that's not what I'm asking.

    TWD has the power to pull non-Image readers into reading other Image Comics. I said no other comic has this power. Yet you still insist that these two comics that sell less than 1/3rd combined as TWD have the power to fill TWD's shoes in terms of reader popularity among Image Comics. How does that work? Question answered: it doesn't. 2 comics with small and engaged fanbases do not have the power to fill the shoes of a comic title known to even non-comic book readers.
    Politely, what you are talking about is essentially the equivalent of asking "Why aren't you taking that there are not enough urinals in this convent seriously?".

    If there is any real spill over in the numbers(which is what you seem to suggesting happens), it is absolutely not there in the numbers you just cited.

    Since that pull is seemingly non-existent, there being(or not being) a "TWD" title doesn't really matter when it comes to what those titles sell.

    Which is before you even seriously consider if the company is in a position that it believes is anything other than where it wants to be.

    You are essentially fretting over the solution to a problem that does not exist.
    Last edited by numberthirty; 06-03-2018 at 09:38 PM.

  3. #63
    Ultimate Member numberthirty's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by JFP View Post
    Where in this thread have I stated there is a way of knowing the number of readers that crossover from TWD? Go ahead. Find it. I'll wait here.

    While this fool who puts words in my mouth tries to make himself look stupid, I'll reiterate my point: The leadership at Image are extremely uncomfortable with the idea of TWD cancelling. During the days of old Image, the cancellation of one book didn't make them uncomfortable. Therefore, current Image is not in a healthy position compared to old Image.
    Source?

    ..........

  4. #64
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    Quote Originally Posted by numberthirty View Post
    As for what's in blue, the way Image operates makes it a non-issue. If you want to try to create a scenario where it actually is an issue, your call.

    As for what is in green, that is like saying that Merge Records will be in really big trouble after Arcade Fire left the label because at one point bands could sell more records. That's not what actually happened when that band left the label.
    Source...?
    Quote Originally Posted by numberthirty View Post
    As for that question, I gave you the correct answer.

    What you see as a fraction is actually "Because those titles have an engaged fan base that can support the title(even when no one know when the final arc of The Black Monday Murders will be on shelves), the amount of copies that The Walking Dead sells is a non-issue."
    Source...?
    Quote Originally Posted by numberthirty View Post
    Politely, you are missing the point.

    The "Black Monday Murders" thread could probably shed some light onto things. Heck, the "Kill Or Be Killed" thread...
    Source...?

  5. #65
    Ultimate Member numberthirty's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by numberthirty View Post
    As for what's in blue, the way Image operates makes it a non-issue. If you want to try to create a scenario where it actually is an issue, your call.

    As for what is in green, that is like saying that Merge Records will be in really big trouble after Arcade Fire left the label because at one point bands could sell more records. That's not what actually happened when that band left the label.
    Quote Originally Posted by JFP View Post
    Source...?
    Here is a link to Merge records current website. Since they are currently releasing new music, we have no reason to believe that they are(or have been) in really serious trouble in the time since Arcade Fire left the label.

    https://www.mergerecords.com/

  6. #66
    Amazing Member Erik Larsen's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by dimo1 View Post
    Of course there are a few gems in-between.
    Lets be honest, without TWD Image would probably be dead by now.
    Back in the day Image titles sold in their hundreds of thousands, even millions.
    Todays numbers are sometimes lower than 4,000.
    Yes, looks very healthy.
    Let's be really honest and admit you have no idea what you're talking about.

  7. #67
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    Quote Originally Posted by Erik Larsen View Post
    Let's be really honest and admit you have no idea what you're talking about.
    Erik, I think the guy's main point was to defend old Image vs. current Image. I see nothing wrong with other posters in this thread saying, "Old Image is garbage". So there's nothing wrong with thinking the opposite and saying current Image can't hold a candle to old Image.

    I believe in a lot of weird things: Sasquatch exists, Lochness Monster exists, Elvis is still alive, and the Nazis saved Hitler's brain. However, there's no chance in Hell yer gonna get me to believe current Image can hold a candle to old Image. Yes, there is good stuff. But old Image was a blast. Yes, I admit I'm looking at them thru biased nostalgia goggles. But I don't care. That's how I feel. And I'm not alone.

    That poster wasn't trying to trash Image. He was merely defending old Image to current Image by pointing out the sales and quality of the books. Yes, we've seen East of West, Kill or Be Killed, Snotgirl, and the like. It's good. However, when someone says that stuff is better than 90s Image with Gen13, CyberForce, and WildCATS??? Somebody needs their head examined pronto.

  8. #68
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    Quote Originally Posted by JFP View Post
    Erik, I think the guy's main point was to defend old Image vs. current Image. I see nothing wrong with other posters in this thread saying, "Old Image is garbage". So there's nothing wrong with thinking the opposite and saying current Image can't hold a candle to old Image.

    I believe in a lot of weird things: Sasquatch exists, Lochness Monster exists, Elvis is still alive, and the Nazis saved Hitler's brain. However, there's no chance in Hell yer gonna get me to believe current Image can hold a candle to old Image. Yes, there is good stuff. But old Image was a blast. Yes, I admit I'm looking at them thru biased nostalgia goggles. But I don't care. That's how I feel. And I'm not alone.

    That poster wasn't trying to trash Image. He was merely defending old Image to current Image by pointing out the sales and quality of the books. Yes, we've seen East of West, Kill or Be Killed, Snotgirl, and the like. It's good. However, when someone says that stuff is better than 90s Image with Gen13, CyberForce, and WildCATS??? Somebody needs their head examined pronto.
    Or perhaps they just have a different point of view then you do? I will take most current thing over 90% of 90s Image.

  9. #69
    Incredible Member icctrombone's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bor View Post
    Or perhaps they just have a different point of view then you do? I will take most current thing over 90% of 90s Image.
    I have to admit I only buy Savage Dragon from Image these days, but currently Image mostly publishes non Superhero books. If you're into Superheroes, the original version might be more beloved.

  10. #70
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    Quote Originally Posted by icctrombone View Post
    I have to admit I only buy Savage Dragon from Image these days, but currently Image mostly publishes non Superhero books. If you're into Superheroes, the original version might be more beloved.
    Sure and that is completely fine. But there is a difference between that and thinking someone needs their head examined because you think some of the current stuff is better then the stuff from the 90s.

    And comparing sales is pretty silly considering the speculate boom in the 90s too. If that stuff really still is as popular as back then why is it you can literaly find 10-15 copies of the same no. 1 book from back then in a most stores?

  11. #71
    Spectacular Member dimo1's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Erik Larsen View Post
    Let's be really honest and admit you have no idea what you're talking about.
    True, I have no idea.
    I can only see that todays interest in comics is low, dramatically low given the spotlight they receive from movies and T.V. shows.
    Comparing this with the excitement of Image at the beginning I cant really see where the positive aspects lie, but, as stated above, Im just a reader and have no insight whatsoever.

    Another confession, yes, Im horribly nostalgic looking back to the beginning days, and surely enough, quite a lot of what came out was not deep, but it really was so full of energy and fun, something I clearly find lacking in todays comics.
    And Im not alone, quite a few feel like too much politics and social issues drain comics of their entertainment.

    Being European Im more than aware that comics offer all ranges of stories, but for me most popular US comics were a nice way of ecapism, they have lost their innocence. For some its great, and to a certain extend I agree, but nostalgia gets the better of me.

  12. #72
    Amazing Member Erik Larsen's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by dimo1 View Post
    True, I have no idea.
    I can only see that today‘s interest in comics is low, dramatically low given the spotlight they receive from movies and T.V. shows.
    Comparing this with the excitement of Image at the beginning I can‘t really see where the positive aspects lie, but, as stated above, I‘m just a reader and have no insight whatsoever.

    Another confession, yes, I‘m horribly nostalgic looking back to the beginning days, and surely enough, quite a lot of what came out was not deep, but it really was so full of energy and fun, something I clearly find lacking in today‘s comics.
    And I‘m not alone, quite a few feel like too much politics and social issues drain comics of their entertainment.

    Being European I‘m more than aware that comics offer all ranges of stories, but for me most popular US comics were a nice way of ecapism, they have lost their innocence. For some it‘s great, and to a certain extend I agree, but nostalgia gets the better of me.
    You said, "without TWD Image would probably be dead by now" which makes no sense. Image doesn't profit from the book. Whether it sells two copies or two million copies makes no difference whatsoever to Image's bottom line.

    As for enjoying the books more or less then--that's up to readers. Certainly enthusiasm was high back in 1992 but those books were heavily criticized as well for being shallow and simpleminded. Current books are more critically acclaimed and more substantive. If that's not your cup of tea--well, that's your business.

    I miss a lot of the energy of the early stuff myself. At that point I was reading every Image book--at this point I don't. But we put out considerably more titles as well. So...there's that.

  13. #73
    Spectacular Member dimo1's Avatar
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    Sure enough, but Image as a publisher needs money, for this you need an audience in proper numbers to run your business profitably. As such as title like TWD works in as much as attracting new readers trying out all the other diverse titles.
    Again, I‘m just an outsider, but the way I see it without such a title Image‘s abilities to publish such an amount would not be given.
    Last edited by dimo1; 06-11-2018 at 02:23 AM.

  14. #74
    Ultimate Member numberthirty's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by dimo1 View Post
    Sure enough, but Image as a publisher needs money, for this you need an audience in proper numbers to run your business profitable. As such as title like TWD works in as much as attracting new readers trying out all the other diverse titles.
    Again, I‘m just an outsider, but the way I see it without such a title Image‘s abilities to publish such an amount would not be given.
    I get the feeling that this is more "Something That Folks Seem To Want To Believe Is The Case..." than "Something That Is Actually The Case..."

  15. #75
    Spectacular Member dimo1's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by numberthirty View Post
    I get the feeling that this is more "Something That Folks Seem To Want To Believe Is The Case..." than "Something That Is Actually The Case..."
    Sure enough, it‘s just one factor, but I think you need a pull factor for gathering an audience.

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