What's your opinion on Sentry?

[Mike]

Never liked the character.
Don't like his shoehorned existence in Marvel's past.
Don't like that he is one, if not the most, powerful "heroes" in the Marvel Pantheon.
Should be Thor.
He's one of the reasons I have really soured on Marvel.

[Tendrin]

See, I really like your personal interpretation of the character as revolving around mental illness and would be totally on-board with that being the focus of the new.

It's not a personal interpretation.

Addiction is explicitly mentioned as is his agoraphobia.
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This is what the character is actually about and why many of us who like him really did not like what Bendis did with him. Fortunately, no character is ruined forever. It just takes the right writer to fix the mess.

I am not dismissing things that happened in canon. Every character has bad stories and moments we'd be better off looking away from and ignoring and the Sentry is no exception to that. What I am arguing, however, is that a lot of these things happened /less/ than some of his detractors would have you believe.

There are plenty of areas where I agree with those detractors. Bob being less of a person and more of a plot device is something we can lay at Bendis' feet, for example.

[Tendrin]

Never liked the character.
Don't like his shoehorned existence in Marvel's past.
Don't like that he is one, if not the most, powerful "heroes" in the Marvel Pantheon.
Should be Thor.
He's one of the reasons I have really soured on Marvel.

Oh noes mah power hierarchy!

[MyriVerse]

I dislike just about everything about the Sentry. From his non-defined powers to how they have tried to retcon him into the past lives of every character. Marvel does not need their own "edgy mentally ill" Superman knock off and never has. He just does not work in the greater MCU, and never really has no matter how hard they try to make it work.

Nailed it in one.

[Gridde]

It's not a personal interpretation.

Addiction is explicitly mentioned as is his agoraphobia.
24A02E84-4C5C-4DC3-999F-B5412EA9C839.jpg

Hm. Contradicted somewhat here, in an article 9 years prior by Sentry's other creator explicitly stating how they came to the 'suppressed memories' angle: http://www.rickveitch.com/2009/07/02...sentry-part-3/

But rather than labour the point, let's just say it's my personal interpretation is that Sentry's issues of mental illness are not executed very well in the comics, so while I can understand people liking that aspect of the character I feel it is overshadowed by how he is portrayed more frequently.

Hell, in his latest appearances in Doctor Strange, the Void is magically removed and sealed away and Bob is 'cured' off panel. If the Void is meant to be a metaphor for illness in current continuity, that is a pretty douchey way of doing it.

[Tendrin]

Hm. Contradicted somewhat here, in an article 9 years prior: http://www.rickveitch.com/2009/07/02...sentry-part-3/

The final result wound up being different than Veitch's take, however. Keep in mind, the article is from Veitch's point of view and Jenkins and Jae Lee went in another direction while retaining a lot of the underbelly he helped build. He really ought to get more credit than he does in his creation.

But rather than labour the point, let's just say it's my personal interpretation is that Sentry's issues of mental illness are not executed very well in the comics, so while I can understand people liking that aspect of the character I feel it is overshadowed by how he is portrayed more frequently

Oh, no. I don't disagree with you here. Writing mental illness is hard for a lot of writers. This part of Bob has been gotten wrong more often than it's been gotten right. Bendis got a lot wrong but he's not alone or unique in that.

Lemire is the right guy to get him back on tack.

Hell, in his latest appearances in Doctor Strange, the Void is magically removed and sealed away and Bob is 'cured' off panel. If the Void is meant to be a metaphor for illness in current continuity, that is a pretty douchey way of doing it.

It's kind of complicated by the multiple ways the Void has been (mis)handled over the years. XD

[ENTRYS]

Hell, in his latest appearances in Doctor Strange, the Void is magically removed and sealed away and Bob is 'cured' off panel. If the Void is meant to be a metaphor for illness in current continuity, that is a pretty douchey way of doing it.

The Sentry is a paranoid schizophrenic, who has the ability to change reality on a molecular level. Sentrys hallucinations and delusions become actual reality in the form of the Void. It has nothing to do with a metaphor.

[Gridde]

The Sentry is a paranoid schizophrenic, who has the ability to change reality on a molecular level. Sentrys hallucinations and delusions become actual reality in the form of the Void. It has nothing to do with a metaphor.

Sorry, how does any of that explain Stephen Strange being able to cure Sentry of the Void via magic?

My problem is that -given how Sentry's issues with illness is one of his strong points and the Void is a manifestation of this illness- we currently have a Sentry who is apparently completely free of any issues, mental or Void-related. It's also pretty uncomfortable to set a standard that a mental illness in Marvel can just be cured easily with magic without any real repercussion.

The final result wound up being different than Veitch's take, however. Keep in mind, the article is from Veitch's point of view and Jenkins and Jae Lee went in another direction while retaining a lot of the underbelly he helped build. He really ought to get more credit than he does in his creation.


Oh, no. I don't disagree with you here. Writing mental illness is hard for a lot of writers. This part of Bob has been gotten wrong more often than it's been gotten right. Bendis got a lot wrong but he's not alone or unique in that.

Lemire is the right guy to get him back on tack.




It's kind of complicated by the multiple ways the Void has been (mis)handled over the years. XD

To be honest, this discussion has helped make me remember that the base Sentry character and idea is actually pretty cool, but has been the victim of poor writing and misguided editorial dictate for much of his time in Marvel.

I really hate the current iteration of the character (ie post-Jenkins Sentry, who is practically a different character altogether), but am now actually pretty hopeful that Lemire's take will redeem him.

What I now think is interesting is that some people in this thread seem to love Sentry as he is, so may actually really dislike a more nuanced take that I personally hope Lemire delivers. I wonder if the fans/haters will just flip sides...

[Tendrin]

Sorry, how does any of that explain Stephen Strange being able to cure Sentry of the Void via magic?

He didn't, really. He did stabilize his mind, however, from the look of things. It's an open question just how much a part of Robert the Void is at this point. At the end of the first mini, Robert says he's lost what little control over it he'd had left, 'if he'd ever had any at all', and that the Void had become something independent. Then we've got the Bendis take on the Void, and so on. Honestly, way back when, I believed the obvious route for the Sentry to be brought into the mainstream MU was to have the Void show up as a villain in an event straight up with no Sentry to stop him, and the heroes not even knowing one existed.

My problem is that -given how Sentry's issues with illness is one of his strong points and the Void is a manifestation of this illness- we currently have a Sentry who is apparently completely free of any issues, mental or Void-related. It's also pretty uncomfortable to set a standard that a mental illness in Marvel can just be cured easily with magic without any real repercussion.

I don't think he's actually /free/ from issues. He's just not bugnuts atm like he was as a Horseman or by the time Siege rolled around.

[Thor-Ul]

Sentry has agood starting point, but his problem is than his stories work better as imaginary stories, stories than only happens in his mind.
When he was starring his own limited series, it was interesting. In the first one, the ambiguity of if everything happened in his head or not, it was part of his charm.
And then Marvel make him part of the canon and he became a deux ex machine for every story.
His second mini as part of the Marvel reality was confusing, because that never was his purpose.
Age of the Sentry also worked because it was a kind of "imaginary story".
If Jeff Lemire is going in that route, where you don't know what is real or what is isn't, it could be interesting.

But as part of the Marvel canon, Sentry is annoying and contradictory. Marvel has the habit of incorporate a lot of ideas than not always worked in their universe because they are popular and later forget them. Sentry is one of those ideas, but as I wrote, he can work in his own imaginary world.
I guess many readers would be more minded to the existencce of Sentry if it would be revealed then he has a power like Voyager and all those memories of the people about Sentry are Sentry own memories inserted in other peoples minds.
Because that is a weakness of him as character, the writers must make every other character less to him to shine: he is more inteligent than Mr Fantastic, more stronger than Hulk, more responsable than Spider-Man, he had more compassion than ben Grimm, he could punch Galactus alone... At that point, he could even know more magics than Dr. Strange. That is fun when it works in his own mind, but not as part of the storiy of Marvel. Mind you the "real" Sentry is the one from Bendis, which is basically a Superman clone with the Hulk (the Void) trauma.

[Gridde]

He didn't, really. He did stabilize his mind, however, from the look of things. It's an open question just how much a part of Robert the Void is at this point. At the end of the first mini, Robert says he's lost what little control over it he'd had left, 'if he'd ever had any at all', and that the Void had become something independent. Then we've got the Bendis take on the Void, and so on. Honestly, way back when, I believed the obvious route for the Sentry to be brought into the mainstream MU was to have the Void show up as a villain in an event straight up with no Sentry to stop him, and the heroes not even knowing one existed.



I don't think he's actually /free/ from issues. He's just not bugnuts atm like he was as a Horseman or by the time Siege rolled around.

Yeah I kinda assumed anyone who picks Sentry up afterwards will find a way to reintroduce Void and the mental issues or otherwise ignore the Doctor Strange appearance.

Just goes to show how erratically he is portrayed in the comics these days.

[Tendrin]

I always find it frustrating when people advance this argument, Thor-Ul, because it always seems to come down to preserving Marvel's already existant power hierarchy.

That said, it IS an open question how much of his adventures are going to be real. The degree of power at his fingertips, however, is always gonna be pretty high. Take that away and you undercut the whole reason that he had to be forgotten to begin with.

[Tendrin]

Yeah I kinda assumed anyone who picks Sentry up afterwards will find a way to reintroduce Void and the mental issues or otherwise ignore the Doctor Strange appearance.

Just goes to show how erratically he is portrayed in the comics these days.

I don't think there's anything necessarily contradictory in it. It's not the first time that the Sentry has been convinced the world is safe because the Void has been locked away. Heck, it was done in his own second mini.

[Gridde]

I don't think there's anything necessarily contradictory in it. It's not the first time that the Sentry has been convinced the world is safe because the Void has been locked away. Heck, it was done in his own second mini.

That's a good point, but in comics I tend to take things at face value as they happen, with the knowledge anything can change (or otherwise be subtly retconned) in the future. Otherwise nothing in Marvel/DC can really be considered fixed and no story arc concluded.

[Gridde]

I always find it frustrating when people advance this argument, Thor-Ul, because it always seems to come down to preserving Marvel's already existant power hierarchy.

That said, it IS an open question how much of his adventures are going to be real. The degree of power at his fingertips, however, is always gonna be pretty high. Take that away and you undercut the whole reason that he had to be forgotten to begin with.

This is an oddly circular argument. You're saying the power hierarchy isn't good, and the best way to address that is...have Sentry be the best at literally everything (as Thor-Ul mentioned, there have been several instances of him explicitly having influenced personalities of other characters or taught them lessons that has nothing to do with powers but are just a result of Sentry apparently being an all-round flawless individual)?

I'd have thought this was an aspect of the character you didn't like, since it seems to actually contradict the idea that the Sentry himself is quite troubled and mentally ill.

To me, this adds nothing to the character except apparent desperation by the writers to make us like Sentry (especially since the other Marvel characters make zero mention of Sentry when he's not actively in their book, even after they all regained their memories of him). I'd love it if the new series introduced the idea that these are false memories that Sentry implants into people's minds when they're near him, subconsciously or otherwise.