Congrats to X-Men Red: Gizmodo/io9 Feature

[yogaflame]

nation-state or stateless-nation?

Why this obsession with a nation? It is completely unnecessarily for self-actualization, of individuals or groups of individuals.

[WebLurker]

Why this obsession with a nation? It is completely unnecessarily for self-actualization, of individuals or groups of individuals.

Citizenship in a nation can greatly increase one's quality of life and if other nations don't treat you well, I could see wanting to form your own country where you wouldn't have to live in fear from your neighbors and government.

[yogaflame]

Citizenship in a nation can greatly increase one's quality of life and if other nations don't treat you well, I could see wanting to form your own country where you wouldn't have to live in fear from your neighbors and government.

Tell that to the billions oppressed by their own nations....

[DDM]

Genosha, Utopia, third time’s the charm right? And hey this one’s underwater, what could go wrong!

[Strong Girl Daken]

I brought this up in another thread but this is a better place for it. I love Red and I think it is the best written X-men team book right now and has the most interesting things to say.

I think the sentintes are a good metaphor for the real-world complex of misinformation, online bots, and right-wing media that feeds into hate. The "hate machine" in Red are little robots implanted in brains that send mental suggestions that have overtime contributed to anti-mutant sentiments, much like how mobile devices, the internet, and social media have planted mistrust that turns into bigotry. But in Red, the bigots have no agency in their bigotry and are treated as victims as well. Is this a slippery slope or just an example of when real-world parallels don't match up 1:1?

[Maestroneto]

I brought this up in another thread but this is a better place for it. I love Red and I think it is the best written X-men team book right now and has the most interesting things to say.

I think the sentintes are a good metaphor for the real-world complex of misinformation, online bots, and right-wing media that feeds into hate. The "hate machine" in Red are little robots implanted in brains that send mental suggestions that have overtime contributed to anti-mutant sentiments, much like how mobile devices, the internet, and social media have planted mistrust that turns into bigotry. But in Red, the bigots have no agency in their bigotry and are treated as victims as well. Is this a slippery slope or just an example of when real-world parallels don't match up 1:1?

"They can't help themselves, it's not their fault" is the official Centrist™ argument for bigotry.

[Strong Girl Daken]

"They can't help themselves, it's not their fault" is the official Centrist™ argument for bigotry.

Agreed. So is Red playing into this? Or do things change once actual mind control in a science fiction world is involved?

I wish Red's messaging on this was a bit different.

[anyajenkins]

I think it's just not matching 1:1. It seems the 'bigots' are bigots but aren't trying to kill people without the machines. There's likely a whole mess of people who have some prejudiced thoughts about a variety of things, but aren't trying to shot people or beat anyone beat up.

[Devaishwarya]

I think it's just not matching 1:1. It seems the 'bigots' are bigots but aren't trying to kill people without the machines. There's likely a whole mess of people who have some prejudiced thoughts about a variety of things, but aren't trying to shot people or beat anyone beat up.

Exactatiously.

This being "comics" and super-hero comics at that, I don't know why anyone would really expect it to line-up 1:1.

[Strong Girl Daken]

Exactatiously.

This being "comics" and super-hero comics at that, I don't know why anyone would really expect it to line-up 1:1.

Because the tiki torches and the news rhetoric lined up exactly. If Taylor went there, why wouldn't we expect a real-world commentary.

And if that guy in the hospital was a bigot, but the only reason he shot someone was because of the sentinites, does he still deserve compassion? Or was the entirety of the bigotry mind control?

[Robohut]

Agreed. So is Red playing into this? Or do things change once actual mind control in a science fiction world is involved?

I wish Red's messaging on this was a bit different.

I don't think that that argument, "they can't help themselves", was made to fit into the social metaphors on purpose. It seem it was put in there in order to fit into the classic superhero story mold: having a clear villain to beat. It's a case of the expectations of the medium limiting the writing, and ultimately, this might just prevent it from becoming a classic run.

Having said that, the endpoint of the story had a pretty sweet and classic x-men message: at the end of the day, after all is said and done, the ideal priority is simply nurturing empathy. Of course, this comic jumps ahead square into that by telepathic science-fictiony means, and although it's an understandable choice, it's also a lost opportunity.

Citizenship in a nation can greatly increase one's quality of life and if other nations don't treat you well, I could see wanting to form your own country where you wouldn't have to live in fear from your neighbors and government.

Tell that to the billions oppressed by their own nations....

But in this case, the mutant population already live oppressed by their nations. This would be a case of people seeking Independence from that. And even in the fully globalized world, that search for independence can unravel the other ways underlying realities of animosity, hate and violence (like what happened in Spain).