Queer Kitty Pryde

[spirit2011]

That's good to know. But instead of advocating for more gay characters to be included. Would it not be more effective to have a gay character who is more fleshed out and portrayed in a positive light? And by positive I mean given depth, dignity their own personality.
.

That is what he meant. Also we can have quality and quantity

I miss Cal.


Notably an establishment Storm picked out. “X-Men don’t discriminate”.


Even funnier, Shan for example wasn’t canonically a lesbian for her first 2 decades in publication. And even then there was less existing subtext for her than there was with supposedly “straight” A-list characters like Ororo or Kitty.

I love Shan too though and always decry when she isn’t used. Like notably at Kitty’s bachelorette party, despite being closer to Kitty than nearly half the ladies present (Jean, Domino, Brand, Betsy, etc). That’s actually the issue, not the fans ignoring these characters but the creators. Get a new strawman.

That is what I was gonna to say, the problem is that Queer character rarely get used. It's harder to ignore the big names like Iceman

[DDM]

There’s more canonical subtext supporting GLBTQ Kitty than there was for Iceman. Mekanix and The End aren’t really even subtext, it’s overt and explicit there. This “canon” argument is nonsense because it’s actually the canon people are pointing to. It supports the argument for, not against.

Same for Storm tbh, XXM laid that out on the table with her both literally and figuratively coming out of the closet.

[johnnysv75]

The irony certainly isn’t lost on me that it seems a lot of the people who wish to dream of their favorite characters as being queer tend to either never mention the canon queer characters in the same breath or flat out ignore that they even exist while complaining about the level of queer representation.

I LOVE Shatterstar and Rictor, and I wish we had gotten more ”on screen” kisses. I think Anole is a great character, and I love Northstar immensely. Karma has always been a favorite. I am catching up to the X-books at the moment and was just introduced to Benjamin Deeds. Look forward to his scenes with Nathaniel Carver. And I LOVED that they made Iceman gay. But how many more do we have? Mystique and Destiny? Not sure how much we have seen of it. Daken? Is he really bi, or does he just use men to get what he wants?
That’s 11 characters. (Even though I am sure I have forgotten some.) How many characters exist in the X-Men universe? I would love proper representation - 5-7 percent.

The tv-show Supergirl received some backlash when some of the actors made fun of how fans were shipping Supergirl and Lena Luthor. Some of the actors meant that Supergirl already had one lesbian couple, fans should be satisfied with that. The fans reply? Why should we be content with just one lgbt couple? There are straight people everywhere in media, it shouldn’t be to much to ask for one more gay couple. Again: representation matters.

[spirit2011]

There’s more canonical subtext supporting GLBTQ Kitty than there was for Iceman. Mekanix and The End aren’t really even subtext, it’s overt and explicit there. This “canon” argument is nonsense because it’s actually the canon people are pointing to. It supports the argument for, not against.

Same for Storm tbh, XXM laid that out on the table with her both literally and figuratively coming out of the closet.

Yep. There is a lot of not so subtext about Kitty and Storm. It's all on canon

I LOVE Shatterstar and Rictor, and I wish we had gotten more ”on screen” kisses. I think Anole is a great character, and I love Northstar immensely. Karma has always been a favorite. I am catching up to the X-books at the moment and was just introduced to Benjamin Deeds. Look forward to his scenes with Nathaniel Carver. But how many more do we have? Mystique and Destiny? Not sure how much we have seen of it. Daken? Is he really bi, or does he just use men to get what he wants?
That’s 10 characters. (Even though I am sure I have forgotten some.) How many characters exist in the X-Men universe? I would love proper representation - 5-7 percent.

The tv-show Supergirl received some backlash when some of the actors made fun of how fans were shipping Supergirl and Lena Luthor. Some of the actors meant that Supergirl already had one lesbian couple, fans should be satisfied with that. The fans reply? Why should we be content with just one lgbt couple? There are straight people everywhere in media, it shouldn’t be to much to ask for one more gay couple. Again: representation matters.

It's almost like the supergirl tv show wanted to check boxes with their lesbian couple. I really didn't like that they castmocked the lena and supergirl shippers, like don't crap on people that watch your crap tv show ok?

[KurtW95]

Weirdos? You mean fans who are desperate for recognition and are tired of being queer baited? Representation matters so much. 5-7 percent of the population is gay, but there are nowhere near that many gay characters in comics (or movies or tv-shows for that matter). That is why hints that a characters might be gay (or at least bi-curious) gets so much recognition by fans - there are so few other gay characters out there for us to identify with.

First of all, the latest data says it’s 4.1%. Don’t know where you got the 7. Second, the whole “representation” thing is nonsense. It’s selfish and sociopathic that someone can’t identify with someone who doesn’t look like themselves or have sex like them, therfore we have to change a character that has existed for 50+ years. I know plenty of white people that love Static Shock and plenty of black people that prefer Peter Parker to Miles Morales. Also, don’t pretend that comics and comic TV shows don’t overrepresent the hell out of people. And nobody has a problem with gay characters that were created as gay. Just don’t advocate for changing characters or pretending that they somehow were when that clearly weren’t. Those that do aren’t real fans of the character in the first place because they seek to turn them into something completely difefent.

*Claps* people like to act like shipping gay characters is a sin and there is a bunch of gay ships on canon.

The problem is they’re not shipping gay characters. They’re shipping straight characters in gay relationships. Don’t tell me you wouldn’t be upset if every single gay character got fanfictions with them romancing the other gender and tons of graphic fanart. It debases and disrespect the character.

[DDM]

**** representation, I just want official acknowledgement for what’s clearly already there. It took decades to get that for Mystque, Destiny, Iceman, Northstar, Karma, Rictor, etc. If articles like this help speed things along for Kitty (and by extension Rachel and Illyana, who I ACTUALLY ship omg come on it’s PERFECT do it Rosenberg) than good. The canon already supports it.

[The Man With The Stick]

Jean? I dont recall him writing her as one

He certainly used some of his other fetishes on her though, like the Hellfire Club stuff in Dark Phoenix Saga and that issue around 1990 where her arms were changed into tentacles and she started to like it.

[spirit2011]

First of all, the latest data says it’s 4.1%. Don’t know where you got the 7. Second, the whole “representation” thing is nonsense. It’s selfish and sociopathic that someone can’t identify with someone who doesn’t look like themselves or have sex like them, therfore we have to change a character that has existed for 50+ years. I know plenty of white people that love Static Shock and plenty of black people that prefer Peter Parker to Miles Morales. Also, don’t pretend that comics and comic TV shows don’t overrepresent the hell out of people. And nobody has a problem with gay characters that were created as gay. Just don’t advocate for changing characters or pretending that they somehow were when that clearly weren’t. Those that do aren’t real fans of the character in the first place because they seek to turn them into something completely difefent.



The problem is they’re not shipping gay characters. They’re shipping straight characters in gay relationships. Don’t tell me you wouldn’t be upset if every single gay character got fanfictions with them romancing the other gender and tons of graphic fanart. It debases and disrespect the character.

That is what you are saying, not really what is in the books.

There is like around 10 gay characters? so don't come with this reverse flawed analogy, th eimplications are very problematic like "gay cure"

[johnnysv75]

First of all, the latest data says it’s 4.1%. Don’t know where you got the 7.

Got it from an article about how big the gay population is in UK. The article said that taboo still persists to this day, and that people are afraid to admit they are gay even in an anonymous survey.

Second, the whole “representation” thing is nonsense. It’s selfish and sociopathic that someone can’t identify with someone who doesn’t look like themselves or have sex like them, therfore we have to change a character that has existed for 50+ years.

Of course it’s possible to identify with someone who is not like yourself. I identify with women, men, straight people, lgbt people etc. That is not what representation is about.
There was a Norwegian show called Skam. It ran for 4 seasons, and was a huge success in Scandinavia (as well as countries outside Scandinavia). Every season had a different main character. Season 3’s main was gay. For the first time a tv show that was one of the biggest shows in Scandinavia had a character that was gay. It wasn’t an indie show. The gay character wasn’t the ”gay best friend”. He was the main character, in a very popular show. And he was fleshed out, and had so much depth. I had coffee coffee with a friend of mine. He is gay, in his fifties. He started crying when we talked about Skam. He said that he had needed a show like that his entire life. Especially when he was a teenager and felt ashamed of who he was.
That, to me, is why representation matters.

[Hi-Fi]

If it was shown on panel I’d be fine with it.

I may be mistaken, but aren't you the poster who makes up stories about Kitty and Nightcrawler being together?

[Materiel]

Shipping brings out the absolute worst in people.

[spirit2011]

Got it from an article about how big the gay population is in UK. The article said that taboo still persists to this day, and that people are afraid to admit they are gay even in an anonymous survey.



Of course it’s possible to identify with someone who is not like yourself. I identify with women, men, straight people, lgbt people etc. That is not what representation is about.
There was a Norwegian show called Skam. It ran for 4 seasons, and was a huge success in Scandinavia (as well as countries outside Scandinavia). Every season had a different main character. Season 3’s main was gay. For the first time a tv show that was one of the biggest shows in Scandinavia had a character that was gay. It wasn’t an indie show. The gay character wasn’t the ”gay best friend”. He was the main character, in a very popular show. And he was fleshed out, and had so much depth. I had coffee coffee with a friend of mine. He is gay, in his fifties. He started crying when we talked about Skam. He said that he had needed a show like that his entire life. Especially when he was a teenager and felt ashamed of who he was.
That, to me, is why representation matters.

Really crazy that we are on 2018 and have to justify diverse characters on X-men.

maybe we should stick to the straight white male vanilla®

[DDM]

Shipping brings out the absolute worst in people.

It’s not really shipping when it actually happened though.

[Maestroneto]

I may be mistaken, but aren't you the poster who makes up stories about Kitty and Nightcrawler being together?

He also thought Kitty giving Cyclops a friendly shoulder tap was proof that Scitty was happening. So clearly he doesn't feel THAT bad about extrapolating subtext from certain panels.

[Hi-Fi]

He also thought Kitty giving Cyclops a friendly shoulder tap was proof that Scitty was happening. So clearly he doesn't feel THAT bad about extrapolating subtext from certain panels.

Was that shoulder tap more suggestive than these?