King Batman Run: Analysis and Enjoyment Thread

[millernumber1]

The New 52 version had mind control powers.

When did he show up in the n52?

[Armor of God]

When did he show up in the n52?

A crossover arc between Superman, Action and Superboy called Psi war. It was awful.

[millernumber1]

A crossover arc between Superman, Action and Superboy called Psi war. It was awful.

Oh, wow. That does sound pretty awful, looking at the creative team and summaries.

I've never read much of Psycho Pirate, because I generally don't enjoy Crisis level events, or really high-level powered comics normally. But I liked the way King used him. I'll be very curious to see if he's the dead person whose mask is shown on Hereos in Crisis, of if that's just the mask of a worker (though I thought the workers were holograms and robots?) Since Batman did say that he would destroy the mask, and Pyscho Pirate is maskless in Batman #50.

[Armor of God]

King is going to have to do a lot of extraordinary explaining to make sense of his last page.

[millernumber1]

King is going to have to do a lot of extraordinary explaining to make sense of his last page.

I disagree there - a lot of stuff is currently making sense in terms of what's already happened. My biggest question is: would Bane WANT Batman to stop being Batman?

[Armor of God]

I disagree there - a lot of stuff is currently making sense in terms of what's already happened. My biggest question is: would Bane WANT Batman to stop being Batman?

I disagree even more. We can try and maybe succeed in connecting events post I am Bane but having Bane pull the strings even before that completely undermines King's own first year and Bane's arc. So I'm supposed to believe Bane gave Gothams their powers and had Holly kill terrorists and then got his back broken and on and on as part of a masterplan? That's asinine.

[millernumber1]

I disagree even more. We can try and maybe succeed in connecting events post I am Bane but having Bane pull the strings even before that completely undermines King's own first year and Bane's arc. So I'm supposed to believe Bane gave Gothams their powers and had Holly kill terrorists and then got his back broken and on and on as part of a masterplan? That's asinine.

King said in his interview that losing to Batman with a headbutt was part of Bane's plan, so the plan at least precedes that. And I think it makes tons of sense and doesn't undermine it at all.

Also, Bane didn't get his back broken, anymore than Batman did, in I Am Suicide.

The only questionable thing is why Bane doesn't think that making Batman happy, complacent, and then striking when he's not ready, wouldn't be a better plan.

[Armor of God]

Bane's view was that he was not responsible for Gotham Girl's predicament, that he was trying to finally escape Venom, he even offered Psycho Pirate to Batman. Then he came to Gotham again demanding only Hayden. He never even killed Bat family when he had the chance. King framed that entire conflict as a battle of two wills, two sympathetic lives, 2 deserving plights. King revealing it all to be a charade undermines everything he did during that first year. But then again he invalidated his entire second year with that last page so he's quite the master of undoing his own work.
King already told his ultimate Batman vs Bane story only for the climax to be underwhelming and not worth the build up, same goes for Bat/Cat. Now this man is redoing the Bane conflict all over again and I guess after that he'll return to Bat/Cat. He's just recycling the same things over and over at this point.

[WonderScott]

Venom has become a really weird drug. Originally, it was just a super steroid, but it has been given more properties with the years and now it’s pretty hard to guess its limits once it has been altered through procedures. Strange created giant monster men from it, in the Talon series it granted different abilities to Bane’s henchmen, in a JSA story it was part of what would end up being the drug Hourman uses to gain strength for a certain time iirc, and in the infamous Dark Knight comic it granted Bane more physical power and intelligence. So it being part of what gave GG and Gotham their powers is a plausible possibility, though I can’t say I like the idea of Venom being such a changeable drug, I got used to it

Venom is becoming the DCU version of Aleve. lol

[millernumber1]

Venom is becoming the DCU version of Aleve. lol

Bane's real plan should be to launch Venom as a wonder drug.

[DragonPiece]

I’m pretty sure that Psycho Pirate doesn’t have mind control though. He can manipulate emotions but not control their minds.

Actually King even said in the word balloon interview that there is a reason psycho pirate is with bane and everyone. He said he could definitely be influencing some of the people in that room to do what Bane wants. We just don't know to what extent.

[WonderScott]

I’m pretty sure that Psycho Pirate doesn’t have mind control though. He can manipulate emotions but not control their minds.

I think that's correct and I guess it's a slippery slope of whether emotional manipulation is a form of mind control as inducing intense feelings may make a person act in a manner they might not otherwise. So, part of me says that it is mind control, considering how people may act out of character thanks to intense feelings of anxiety, fear, love, etc.

This kind of wades into similar territory as Identity Crisis and Zatanna's mind wipe of Selina and how that made her question her disposition of villain to anti-hero and her feelings toward Batman.

If Psycho Pirate is involved (and King is saying he is) this might bring up Bruce and Selina having to reexamine if their actual (versus manipulated) feelings for one another and if they truly love one another. It could get even more messy if only one of them (Batman or Catwoman) was manipulated by Psycho Pirate and the other was simply reacting with their true feelings.

A few different paths that this could take that would but both characters through the wringer of romance before this story is over. I live for the drama and emotional messiness and the "what ifs" of this story and this couple. (But, I'm rooting for them all the way.)

[WonderScott]

I disagree there - a lot of stuff is currently making sense in terms of what's already happened. My biggest question is: would Bane WANT Batman to stop being Batman?

And that he's always wanted to "break" the Bat. Which he has done so successfully, physically for a time once. Since we have a lot more story to go, I'm curious what Bane's definition of break is when it comes to Bruce and Batman.

[WonderScott]

Bane's real plan should be to launch Venom as a wonder drug.

At this point Booster Gold would probably be happy to be a spokesperson for it. Haha...

[WonderScott]

Bane's view was that he was not responsible for Gotham Girl's predicament, that he was trying to finally escape Venom, he even offered Psycho Pirate to Batman. Then he came to Gotham again demanding only Hayden. He never even killed Bat family when he had the chance. King framed that entire conflict as a battle of two wills, two sympathetic lives, 2 deserving plights. King revealing it all to be a charade undermines everything he did during that first year. But then again he invalidated his entire second year with that last page so he's quite the master of undoing his own work.
King already told his ultimate Batman vs Bane story only for the climax to be underwhelming and not worth the build up, same goes for Bat/Cat. Now this man is redoing the Bane conflict all over again and I guess after that he'll return to Bat/Cat. He's just recycling the same things over and over at this point.

My take is he's (King's) playing the long game (obviously) in the Batman versus Bane and Batman and Catwoman overarching storylines to his entire run. There's just a lot we don't know yet, in terms of what Bane defines as "breaking the Bat" and how he apparently considers him broken (again), more so emotionally this time over physically and emotionally in Bane's first-ever throw down with the Bat way back when.

I'm trying to consider all the misdirection that Bane could have been doing during his early part in the run and when exactly he decided to instigate this plan. And honestly, how he might have been manipulated...or manipulated himself. I know King said it's all about Bane, but I'm also considering that just because he's sitting on the throne at the end of #50 doesn't mean he put himself there. Could he be being manipulated as well? Just something that popped into my head - not sure if I'm going to take it as a serious option or take on the situation yet, besides being my own wild creativity.

Lots of layers to my way of thinking and that their first confrontation in this run was, yes psychological, but also directly confrontation and physical. After that it's been all emotional and psychological manipulation from a distance with many tools and participants. (Gives me a little bit of a Black Glove vibe.)

To me that sets up their next encounters very differently from their first encounters with a different aspect of how that damage he's caused will play out, based on where the characters are now and what may or may not have happened to them while being manipulated.