If Marvel did a storyline where a hero got "cancelled", which hero should it be?

[ShatteredReality]

Edit: Okay, I think people might misunderstand what I'm going for here.

In my mind, when people get cancelled, it's because they're genuinely a horrible person most of the time. So I am not asking about a storyline where it's faked by a supervillain. I'm asking one where it's real. I wonder how other heroes would react to someone they called a friend turning out to be a jerk. Are they damned by association?

If there are any storylines like this out there already, I'd love to hear about them!


Hi, new poster here!

I saw this post on the TV Tropes forums a while ago about Marvel doing a storyline where someone is cancelled, and I've kept thinking about it ever since. So I thought I'd post about it here.

It is revealed that a hero has some awful secrets in their past (or their present). Like, they are super transphobic, or they sold orphans to intergalactic slave traders, or they sexually assaulted someone.

I would rather not have a super villain frame them for it. They must have actually done the horrible things they're accused of. I think having a super villain frame them for it is mean-spirited to people in real life who accuse famous people of wrongdoing.

Anyway, I don't think it can be a popular hero like Spider-Man or Ironman. Cancelling them would just cause a ton of backlash that makes me sad. Another option would be creating a new superhero solely for the purpose of cancelling them, but then fans of series will feel upset and tricked when they're cancelled. So we need to choose a pre-existing hero who isn't that popular.

My vote is for Captain Mar-vell. Carol and other people are always talking about how great he was, but honestly, I haven't read any of his stories and the only thing I know is that he was sexist to Carol during his original run. I love Carol Danvers and I don't know why they have her praise a guy who was a jerk to her. Anyway I think Marvel could do a storyline where he gets cancelled. I know that he did a bunch of war crimes or whatever when he was with the Kree, but I think he needs to also have crimes when he became a "hero" too. Like maybe he used Kree technology to brainwash Carol into loving him or something. We could have Carol stumble upon secret recordings of him being super racist, homophobic, transphobic, ableist, and whatever other bigotry I haven't stated. I think a storyline where Carol loses her reason to be "Captain Marvel" would be interesting. She would have to find her own reason to be Captain Marvel, separate from the guy who cost her her job. Maybe she decides to claim the name for herself out of spite? Or maybe she decides that she's the one true Captain Marvel since she's done so much good for earth. I mean, she is Earth's Mightiest Hero after all.

This could also be an interesting storyline for Hulkling/Genis-Vell too. Their father, who they admired so much, turns out to be an awful person. And they have to forge their own paths outside of his legacy. Plus they have to deal with being the son of a bad person. Maybe Hulkling loses his status of Emperor and has to win it back?

I don't know much about Phyla-Vell except that she's dead and was replaced by an alternate universe version of herself. So maybe she could be upset that this universe's version of her father is so awful. But I don't think she would be that upset since it's not her real father and all.

I know Mar-vell still has some fans and actually doing a storyline where he gets cancelled would probably make them upset, but every story gets someone upset. You can't please everyone. But if you really want to not really cancel him, then I guess you could have a super villain fake it all. Like Yon-Rogg, because he hates him so much. Or Mystique could impersonate him and pretend he's come back from the dead. And then punch Hulking in the face or something.

So what do you think about this idea? What hero do you think cancelling would lead to an interesting storyline?

[jwatson]

This question is so confusing. So instead of creating a character to explore the story and what you want to say about it or what one feels we are asking to retcon a character for the simple purpose to explore them being cancelled. I'm sorry in advanced if i'm coming off any kind of way but i'm genuinely confused on the context of how to play.

[ed2962]

??? Marvel has done stories where heroes have been in universe "cancelled" for 60 years. As well as characters reclaiming a mantle from a bad person and using it for good.

If you mean you want a storyline where someone digs up an old email or voice recording of a B-list hero saying something "politically incorrect" and gets dragged in public for it...meh?

I mean, it's not hard to find actual older comics that display say casual sexism in them. It's probably more interesting to talk about how or why those attitudes were acceptable then but less so now than it is do the type of retro "cancel culture" you suggest.

[ShatteredReality]

Yeah. I don't think exploring them being cancelled would be simple. I mean you could create a new character, but I think that would have less impact than if they were a pre-existing character.

Although I wonder what kind of character "could" be created for this purpose. It would definitely have to be a white, straight, cisgender guy. Because imagine if Marvel had a minority hero be genuinely awful. But I think Marvel publishes enough titles about white cishet guys already.

[ShatteredReality]

When I say cancelled, I don't mean that people stop supporting them over some falsehood, I mean that they're revealed to be a genuinely awful person for real. No super villain framing them for it.

[Hypestyle]

if such a storyline were done, it would likely be reversed by a future writer to "set things right"--

at this point, Marvel has already done this, in a way, with Iron Man and the "Crossing" storyline where he was set up to have been manipulated "off screen" by Kang, and ended up killing Bova the she-cow, on-screen. Fast forward to Heroes Return, and there was a kind of formal trial/reckoning, basically to say "he was mind controlled, oh well, he's better now". And that's it.

Can't forget about Phoenix killing a whole planet, Jim Shooter insisting that she dies, then 6 years later, Jean Gray comes back.. oh, it's the real Jean this time.. everything's okay.. lol.

Wolverine killed a bunch of people while possessed by The Hand; including Northstar-- Northstar was resurrected of course. Meanwhile, whenever Logan "got better" his way of making amends was going after Hydra/The Hand to kill a bunch of them. Unclear if he apologized to any innocent people's family who was killed during his own possession.

I'd rather not see this because I suspect that it would be done badly. The author would be the wrong choice. The hero and the "transgression" would be the wrong choice.

I can easily see somebody choosing to do a "Luke Cage date rape" (from his pre-Jessica years, even pre-powers years) story. Shades of Tupac Shakur, Bill Cosby, pro athletes, etc. We already saw Brian Bendis insert a retcon with Luke being an off-screen "cape chaser" for a while. I can see an author trying to do a "people need to see both sides" story but the execution just comes across really badly and puts Luke in an unforgivable light with the most "vocal" of folks who have feelings about sexual harassment/assault. (sample dialogue from Luke: "I never used pills, I just used my player skills.. when I was a teenager, or even in my hustling days, I knew there were dudes who were living foul.. but for all of us, hooking up with someone you liked meant something else entirely. we had rules, but... it wasn't about signing consent forms in triplicate and getting them notarized."}

This would do nothing except put a permanent, additional negative mark on a black superhero character.

It's going to be a super-dangerous proposition if Marvel goes in this kind of direction for a story.

[ShatteredReality]

if such a storyline were done, it would likely be reversed by a future writer to "set things right"--

at this point, Marvel has already done this, in a way, with Iron Man and the "Crossing" storyline where he was set up to have been manipulated "off screen" by Kang, and ended up killing Bova the she-cow, on-screen. Fast forward to Heroes Return, and there was a kind of formal trial/reckoning, basically to say "he was mind controlled, oh well, he's better now". And that's it.

Can't forget about Phoenix killing a whole planet, Jim Shooter insisting that she dies, then 6 years later, Jean Gray comes back.. oh, it's the real Jean this time.. everything's okay.. lol.

Wolverine killed a bunch of people while possessed by The Hand; including Northstar-- Northstar was resurrected of course. Meanwhile, whenever Logan "got better" his way of making amends was going after Hydra/The Hand to kill a bunch of them. Unclear if he apologized to any innocent people's family who was killed during his own possession.

I'd rather not see this because I suspect that it would be done badly. The author would be the wrong choice. The hero and the "transgression" would be the wrong choice.

I can easily see somebody choosing to do a "Luke Cage date rape" (from his pre-Jessica years, even pre-powers years) story. Shades of Tupac Shakur, Bill Cosby, pro athletes, etc. We already saw Brian Bendis insert a retcon with Luke being an off-screen "cape chaser" for a while. I can see an author trying to do a "people need to see both sides" story but the execution just comes across really badly and puts Luke in an unforgivable light with the most "vocal" of folks who have feelings about sexual harassment/assault. (sample dialogue from Luke: "I never used pills, I just used my player skills.. when I was a teenager, or even in my hustling days, I knew there were dudes who were living foul.. but for all of us, hooking up with someone you liked meant something else entirely. we had rules, but... it wasn't about signing consent forms in triplicate and getting them notarized."}

This would do nothing except put a permanent, additional negative mark on a black superhero character.

It's going to be a super-dangerous proposition if Marvel goes in this kind of direction for a story.

Yeah, I agree that it would be a bad idea to have a minority hero do something bad. But I'm okay with a white guy doing it.

Oh I know, Hank Pym! He's already got a reputation as a wife-beater, so why not go even further and add to his list of crimes!

[king of hybrids]

Can the dead be cancelled?

[jwatson]

Can the dead be cancelled?

They certainly cancelled aunt Jemima. I had some waffles for the first time in ages and was like "who tf is Pearl."

[scribbleMind]

I think the obvious answer is X-Statix.

The thing is, given the nature of the team, this could very well happen during The X-Cellent run right now. Hell, I wouldn't be surprised if that book gets cancelled and they use The X-Cellent getting cancelled as an excuse for the cancellation.

[Dreaded Porcupine]

Yeah, I agree that it would be a bad idea to have a minority hero do something bad. But I'm okay with a white guy doing it.

Oh I know, Hank Pym! He's already got a reputation as a wife-beater, so why not go even further and add to his list of crimes!

I knew where this thread was going from the very first paragraph. Right to Hank Pym. Nice try! You won’t fool to many people. I support the return of Hank Pym by a writer who will redeem him from all the writers that ruined him.

[John Venus]

Hank Pym has been getting 'cancelled' before 'cancelled' (in it's current usage) became a thing.

[MichaelC]

captainamericacanclled.jpg

Captain America. Some old war footage of him saying things like "yellow monkeys" should surface and destroy his reputation utterly.

[Digifiend]

It already exists. Adam: Legend of the Blue Marvel. Adam Brashear was a successful superhero, until it was revealed that he was black. He got "cancelled" (literally - the President forced him to quit) because of his ethnicity, and was only able to re-emerge recently after people became more tolerant (probably because of the emergence of new black heroes like Luke Cage).

[CaptCleghorn]

Ah, "canceled" meaning a victim of "cancel culture".

Give Tom King's Strange Adventures from DC a read. It is exactly what you're talking about. As for Captain Mar-Vell and Carol from the sixties and seventies, like many Silver and Golden Age stories we also need to deal with the times in which they were created.