“Heroes in Crisis” Limited Series by Tom King & Clay Mann to Start in September

[WonderScott]

I think this is my biggest problem with King. I think he has done some really good work, but unfortunately he does have a tendency to turn the characters into props that fit into the story he wants to tell, and in the process they end up being written out of character, making the story suffer for it. His best stuff is when the characters actually fit the story without him having to change them into something else. I've found that some of the stories I've hated the most I've actually quite liked if I don't read them as the characters they are supposed to be but "just" characters, but that's not the DC Universe I want to read about.

Interesting...not my experience with him.

Which characters in particular do you think he writes and characterizes out of character?

[WonderScott]

No, Batman has never been in better hands. And I've read every Batman writer's work going back to the beginning.

King is attempting something that's never been done with Batman and it's not the wedding to Catwoman though that's of a piece with it: King has Batman actively seeking happiness for the first time in 80 years of Batman stories. His work isn't for everyone but it's highly emotional and highly sophisticated in its approach to the emotional lives of DC characters.

That he's doing this, and doing it so well, makes him my favorite Batman writer ever.

I couldn't agree more in terms of Batman's pursuit of happiness and different aspects of his character that are coming out because of it. It's Batman challenging himself to eclipse what Batman has been, that I find most interesting and Batman- and Bruce-centric.

[SiegePerilous02]

Also, as I said on the Wally West thread, only in a Tom King book would Booster Gold and Wally West be prime suspects in a mass murder of heroes.

Debatable. I feel like no hero is immune from being a murder suspect, because framing superheroes for murder or other crimes has been happening since the dawn of time.

And if they are announced as the chief suspects in the solicitations for a book touted as a murder mystery, that pretty much guarantees they are not guilty.

This is complete bullshit, no offense. Where is Batman happy in King's run? Where does he smile or laugh? Other than the one bullshit WoJ&R "confession" where is he talking to anyone about anything? How is he being humanized? How is he seeking happiness? This is the worst Batman has been written in decades at least.

People tend to seek out happiness when they are not happy/not as happy as they could be in their present situations. Which is exactly what he's doing by marrying the woman he loves.

Interesting...not my experience with him.

Which characters in particular do you think he writes and characterizes out of character?

I'm not the person to ask because I don't really care for them much either way, but it seems like Booster and Holly Robinson are the characters people take the most issue with. Wonder Woman was also not great, but not terrible either.

Aside from those, I think he does fine by most characters. His tendency to butcher characterizations is grossly exaggerated. Batman and his villains having had so many incarnations over the decades, not even counting their varied forays into other media, makes that claim especially dubious.

[Robanker]

No, Batman has never been in better hands. And I've read every Batman writer's work going back to the beginning.

King is attempting something that's never been done with Batman and it's not the wedding to Catwoman though that's of a piece with it: King has Batman actively seeking happiness for the first time in 80 years of Batman stories. His work isn't for everyone but it's highly emotional and highly sophisticated in its approach to the emotional lives of DC characters.

That he's doing this, and doing it so well, makes him my favorite Batman writer ever.

I like the idea of that, bit it's the execution I find lacking. His characterization of many characters is off, as is their voice, and too many arcs flopped for my taste. When I just write out what is happening in his run, sure, it's very interesting. But it feels so very wrong when reading it. He does have his moments, though. The Superman/Batman issues were pretty great.

[Superlad93]

Firstly, anyone who puts on a supertight costume to fight crime definitely has issues...

I haven't read all of King's work, but from the things I've read so far, rather than "turn someone into a mess," he seems to mine psychological issues that could be a natural extension of what has already been established. If you're basing your opinion on what he's written before, that's one thing, but generally speaking, it seems people have a tendency to over-react to brief descriptions because they're reacting to what they imagine the story to be and there's a reason most people aren't writers - is that they can't imagine the story that King does, or they just equate it to something that sounds similar - and in this case, "Identity Crisis."

I have my trepidations about this story, but so far I haven't heard anything that's a deal-breaker...... yet

Just dropped by to marvel at how got damn reasonable and level headed this post is right here.

[Frontier]

Debatable. I feel like no hero is immune from being a murder suspect, because framing superheroes for murder or other crimes has been happening since the dawn of time.

And if they are announced as the chief suspects in the solicitations for a book touted as a murder mystery, that pretty much guarantees they are not guilty.

I would think any DCU-spanning murder mystery would be a step-up from Identity Crisis, but I'm ready to be proven wrong .

[SiegePerilous02]

I would think any DCU-spanning murder mystery would be a step-up from Identity Crisis, but I'm ready to be proven wrong .

As long as this doesn't have a needless rape and mind wipes, I don't think you will be proven wrong. Fingers cross at least

[Talon1load]

People tend to seek out happiness when they are not happy/not as happy as they could be in their present situations. Which is exactly what he's doing by marrying the woman her.

So here’s my issue with that, I get that he’s marrying her and loves her but where does King actually show that he loves her? What are his thoughts on her, his relationship with her, her criminal proclivities, and the fact that as far as anyone knows she’s still wanted for MASS MURDER. We don’t know because King fails to actual show any inner dialogue for Batman. Hell, we hardly get outer dialogue from Batman.

[Jackalope89]

I like King's Batman run, for the most part.

But after King DESTROYED Booster's personality (before even getting to mindbreaking the guy at the end of it), he should never touch any other hero again. I think I'll hard pass on this, along with the new, so-called "Titans" run coming out.

[dietrich]

So here’s my issue with that, I get that he’s marrying her and loves her but where does King actually show that he loves her? What are his thoughts on her, his relationship with her, her criminal proclivities, and the fact that as far as anyone knows she’s still wanted for MASS MURDER. We don’t know because King fails to actual show any inner dialogue for Batman. Hell, we hardly get outer dialogue from Batman.

While I don't agree about the run being as bad as some claim [ It's hit and miss always entertaining for varied reasons]
I have to semi agree with your point The proposal was lacklustre. Framed like Bruce felt he had to marry her/nudged into

Batman has actively sort happiness before. I mean it's not like this is the 1st time he's tried to get married. Or his adoption of Dick [not taking him as his Ward] but when he decided to make him his son. That is actively seeking happiness. [that page was so sweet and very emotional]

Thankfully Seeley did some lifting for King with the Preludes.

I am looking forward to this series though. King is a good writer. His Batman is his only work that I've ever had issues with so I trust him to check this out.

[Armageddon]

Normally I'd like this concept, but if that cover is representative of who the main focuses of the book are going to be, it's going to be primarily about white A-listers and characters previously without trauma who King changed and/or butchered.

Hard pass.

I mean, i feel tou, but when has DC not been about that?

[tako]

As long as this doesn't have a needless rape and mind wipes, I don't think you will be proven wrong. Fingers cross at least

"needless"

how can you say what is and isn't needless in a story? it's not your story...

a supervillain raping someone (why is that hard to believe?) and heroes having an ethical disagreement on how to handle it...and the consequences of it all was the entire story.

it wouldn't be identity crisis without it. though, they should have called it "ethical crisis"

[j9ac9k]

a supervillain raping someone (why is that hard to believe?) and heroes having an ethical disagreement on how to handle it...and the consequences of it all was the entire story.

From my perspective, it's not that it's hard to believe that it would have happened, it's about the fact that once a writer decides to introduce that into what is meant to be a connected, serialized universe, it becomes impossible to not address it going forward unless you undermine the whole premise of this "super-hero universe" where the threats are fantastical. It's like the old black guy asking GL what he 's done for the brown skins -- he saved the world is what he's done! Either the DCU heroes are actively fighting against social injustices like rape or genocide or they're unfeeling jerks who are out of touch with real people. "Identity Crisis" was just wrong-headed from the get-go, imo.

[Armor of God]

As long as this doesn't have a needless rape and mind wipes, I don't think you will be proven wrong. Fingers cross at least

So mindwipes and rapes are needless but no superhero should be immune from being a murder suspect? You do realize that there is no consistency to these thoughts. You're defending creative freedom and then sanctioning it.

[Armor of God]

No, Batman has never been in better hands. And I've read every Batman writer's work going back to the beginning.

King is attempting something that's never been done with Batman and it's not the wedding to Catwoman though that's of a piece with it: King has Batman actively seeking happiness for the first time in 80 years of Batman stories. His work isn't for everyone but it's highly emotional and highly sophisticated in its approach to the emotional lives of DC characters.

That he's doing this, and doing it so well, makes him my favorite Batman writer ever.

Please tell me, just when exactly has Batman displayed any sign of elation or contentment in these 48 or so issues? You're just taking King's words at face value. He talked about happiness a year ago in some interview and that's that. There's nothing joyous and feel good about any arc King has written since the engagament. There's no happiness to speak of.