“Heroes in Crisis” Limited Series by Tom King & Clay Mann to Start in September

[Talon1load]

@ Amour of God I feel you don't understand King's writing. This Batman is very human. We know that he is actively seeking happiness for the 1st time ever because Tom King told us. Seeing his father left him with the feels, GG helped him see that he wasn't really happy so in an attempt to fix it he is marrying Selina but not before telling her a story about how he is not all just some confident BatGod who never makes mistakes. When she saw how sensitive, fallible and HUMAN he was she said yes.



Bats might seem miserable but he is actively trying to be happy. We know this because King said and because he is getting married. See

Ahhhhhhh, I see now. You’re right. He is human and trying for happiness because King said so. He had to say it though because nowhere in his stories would you be able to surmise that on your own.
I’m still stuck on this being the first time Batman has ever sought happiness. There are stories all throughout his history where he’s done that. He’s found love before but for Batman, his mission always came first. His sense of duty was too stromg to allow him to leave and allow others to do the on when he knew he could do it better. This isn’t a more human Batman, it’s just one who is now too whiny to do the right thing. He’s always used his parents death to drive himself further and harder but now all he does is wallow in it and use it as an excuse to give up. King has taken an iconic strong and confident character and turned him into a pathetic, incompetent shell of his former self.

[Agent Z]

Its not apples and oranges. In order for murder suspects to exist there need to be murders. King is going to go on a "needless" murder spree very soon.

How the story plays out and how the murders are treated will determine whether or not the murders are needless.

The rape in Identity Crisis was considered needless because of how inconsequential it was to the plot and the lack of the victim's perspective on it.

[SiegePerilous02]

In order for murder suspects to exist there need to be murders.

Well...yeah.

King is going to go on a "needless" murder spree very soon.

If it's a murder mystery, I think a murder is kind of needed, don't you? You just said so yourself in the quote above. How the murder plays out, and who is killed, has yet to be determined. So until the issues are published, we cannot determine how well the story executes it. Identity Crisis, however, has been published and has been picked apart constantly ever since.

And as Agent Z says

The rape in Identity Crisis was considered needless because of how inconsequential it was to the plot and the lack of the victim's perspective on it.

Sue Dibny got raped, and it had f*** all to do with her character. It was more about the men around her than her own feelings. It's cliche and gross. Having a a sweet Silver Age era love interest like Sue get raped is questionable to begin with, but had the story tackled the subject matter in a more mature way and dealt with things from her perspective, it could have been a powerful examination of the heinous crime and the fallout it had on the victim, and how she came out the other side of it. It didn't though, she was just a prop. So the rape is needless and stupid, and was done more for sensational shock value than any thoughtful examination of the topic.

Maybe King will similarly screw up the topics he wants to explore, but we have no way of knowing until we get it in front of us. Identity Crisis has been in front of us for over a decade, and its near universally loathed.

[Talon1load]

The rape, while terrible, wasn’t pointless. It was literally the reason behind the heroes deciding to mindwipe villains. They could have perhaps gone a different way with it but the action served the purpose of the story. The irony of King fans complaining about a character being used as a prop is hilarious since that’s all he does.

[Agent Z]

The rape, while terrible, wasn’t pointless. It was literally the reason behind the heroes deciding to mindwipe villains. They could have perhaps gone a different way with it but the action served the purpose of the story. The irony of King fans complaining about a character being used as a prop is hilarious since that’s all he does.

The reasons for mindwiping villains was to protect the heroes'identities and keep their loved ones safe.. which had nothing to do with the rape. Light knew who Sue was because her husband's identity was a matter of public record. Hell, issue 3 of the series features a flashback of the Secret Society switching bodies with the League to discover their identities. That serves as a more solid reasoning for the mindwipes where Light's attack on Sue (who again, was married to a superhero without a secret identity) does not.

[SiegePerilous02]

The rape, while terrible, wasn’t pointless. It was literally the reason behind the heroes deciding to mindwipe villains. They could have perhaps gone a different way with it but the action served the purpose of the story. The irony of King fans complaining about a character being used as a prop is hilarious since that’s all he does.

There were other reasons in the story to justify the League being concerned with the villains knowing their secret identities (such as the Secret Society figuring it out), and Ralph didn't even have one to protect Sue to begin with.

King hasn't used a character as a prop in that way (and hopefully he won't). And "all he does"? What examples do you have to back that up? Maybe he's done it a handful of times, but all the time is complete hyperbole. Certainly none of his examples have reached anywhere near the infamy of what was done to Sue.

[Robotman]

a lot of people are pissed off at King for the way he wrote Booster Gold in the recent Batman arc. I’m a big fan of Booster and I was actually ok with the portrayal. I guess most people were angry because Booster had grown as a character before Flashpoint. We dont know what history has been restored in DC’s current strange continuity. Ted Kord is alive for one thing, so a lot of what happened to Booster after his death is probably erased. After Ted’s death, Booster got more mature and was recruited by Rip Hunter. That probably hasn’t happened. New 52 Booster had a slightly different origin and history (future?), but the version seen in Batman had the classic origin. They’ve insinuated that Ted and Booster have teamed up at this point. So I guess he would be the Booster right after or during the JLI years, where he was still a goof off. What he did in the Batman arc was a stereotypical Booster thing to do. He did something stupid and reckless but with the best of intentions.


So instead of having Ted’s death as the catalyst for his maturation, maybe his screw up with Batman’s parents will be his turning point.

[SiegePerilous02]

a lot of people are pissed off at King for the way he wrote Booster Gold in the recent Batman arc. I’m a big fan of Booster and I was actually ok with the portrayal. I guess most people were angry because Booster had grown as a character before Flashpoint. We dont know what history has been restored in DC’s current strange continuity. Ted Kord is alive for one thing, so a lot of what happened to Booster after his death is probably erased. After Ted’s death, Booster got more mature and was recruited by Rip Hunter. That probably hasn’t happened. New 52 Booster had a slightly different origin and history (future?), but the version seen in Batman had the classic origin. They’ve insinuated that Ted and Booster have teamed up at this point. So I guess he would be the Booster right after or during the JLI years, where he was still a goof off. What he did in the Batman arc was a stereotypical Booster thing to do. He did something stupid and reckless but with the best of intentions.


So instead of having Ted’s death as the catalyst for his maturation, maybe his screw up with Batman’s parents will be his turning point.

Jurgens had him show up in Action Comics prior to this though; from those who read it, it sounds like he was way more mature there than he was in Batman. If this had been Booster's first appearance in the new continuity, I agree that it would have been more fair game, but it seems to contradict something in the Rebirth canon already published.

Which means King screwed up with a character. Which is not something any writer is immune from, and personally I'm not into Booster to begin with, so it doesn't bother me too much. I can understand why Booster fans would be concerned with his upcoming appearance in this. But whatever may or may not happen, he's not going to be guilty of murder. They wouldn't announce it in the freakin' solicitation if he was actually going to be guilty. And aside from the odd example like Booster, he doesn't screw up characters often enough to warrant a reputation that nobody is safe with him.

[BatmanJones]

Batman has not been suffering severe trauma his whole adult life. Nor has he suffered depression, not clinically anyway. He did try to kill himself, but we can ignore that awful King story.

And, no King is not doing anything special in regards to that.

Batman carries a burden, sure. But he still lives a rich and rewarding life.

I don't know which Batman comics you've been reading (maybe you're still reading 1960s Batman and haven't caught up yet) but Batman has been portrayed as deeply disturbed since Denny O'Neil/Neal Adams and even more so since them. He had trouble forming bonds and trusting people and he has all the marks of PTSD. No DC character would consider Batman to be emotionally healthy, nor would any real Batman fan.

Almost any Batman comic since the 70s featuring Alfred has had Alfred wishing his master weren't so tortured and had access to happiness though he knows he does not.

[Talon1load]

Booster was a prop, Wonder Woman was a prop, Talia was a prop, Holly has been nothing but a prop, and hell Batman himself has been nothing but a prop his whole run. He’s been made a prop for Catwoman to become what he used to be.

Batman has definitely had a ton of emotional baggage for decades now but he’s always dealt with it. Sometimes he’s been healthier than others but never has he been as whiny as he is being portrayed now. Like many have pointed out, he’s been around for almost 80 years, in all that time this bullshit hasn’t come up. It is completely out of character to have gone as far as it has now. He’s been happy in the past. He’s found love in the past. He’s dealt with the deaths of his parents in the past. Oh, and growing out the whole , “a real Batman fan” nonsense is ridiculous. I don’t question if you’re a Batman fan just because you LOVE King’s run. I just question if you’re actually King on here defending himself. LOL.

[Fairyprincess]

The fact that superheros, are "super" in so much that they not only have powers, but can put themselves into extreme and stressful situations without any real trauma is something that I'm willing suspend my disbelief over.....

The idea of super hero's get PTSD makes them feel "less" in my opinion.....

[Pohzee]

The fact that superheros, are "super" in so much that they not only have powers, but can put themselves into extreme and stressful situations without any real trauma is something that I'm willing suspend my disbelief over.....

The idea of super hero's get PTSD makes them feel "less" in my opinion.....

Would you say the same of a soldier?

[Talon1load]

I don’t think it makes them less but I do think it’s an unneeded level of realism. These are people who have powers or at the very least can do things that no normal human can do, I think adding in a level of trauma that they need help overcoming is going to tie the hands of future writers.

[Godlike13]

Actually I think it’ll give future writers further layers to potentially explore if they so choose.

[Nite-Wing]

People still complaining about King writing Booster like he's supposed to be but hey maybe if you complain enough to him on twitter he'll use Heroes in crisis as an apology to retcon every problem Booster ever had as a character
In any case get over it the story has been published

Either way this event seems interesting
If his work on the Booster Gold arc is any indication King is excellent at taking mad cap characters like Harley and injecting some real emotional weight to their zany actions which get taken for granted. Harley is desperately in need of something like that