Wonder Woman 1984: Discussion, Set Leaks & Spoilers #WW84

[SiegePerilous02]

I thought about these reactions a lot. I still feel that Jenkins is a solid director who made extremely questionable choices as a writer AND as a director in WW84. I refuse to join the bloodthirsty fanboy mob that went from "She saved the DCEU! In Jenkins we trust!" in 2017 to "She is not a great director and she needs to stay away from superheroes, Diana, Star Wars and movies in general!" in 2020. That is such BS.

Yeah, I prefer to go for a middle ground with Jenkins now. There was a lot to dislike in this movie, but also a lot to like.

I would feel better if she took a step back and didn't direct the third one, but I also don't think we can just forget the impact and success of the first one. I think her overall story for Diana is a good one, but maybe produce the third film and have input on the screenplay. I think the biggest thing she struggles to deliver is the spectacle, which is what we need to finish this trilogy off IMO.

[brettc1]

Still. She deserves far better.


And it was one electric wire. She wasn't hit by the whole electrical supply.

More than I could take and walk away.

[brettc1]

I was looking forward to hear what my co-workers thought about the film. These are people who are not comic book geeks or even fans of the Lynda Carter show; I just wanted to see what feedback (if any) I got from the average person who simply watches an action film enticed by the marketing. 3 o my co-workers watched the film. Nobody raved about it, but nobody said anything even close to "the biggest POS I have ever seen!" (like some hyperbolic fanboys are saying).
The complaints I got from my buddies at work: "boring"; "not enough superhero action" "cliched character" (yes, one character, Cheetah. They thought that the whole 'clumsy, insecure bespectacled nerd who finds her inner powerful person/villain' thing with Barbara Minerva was super corny and super unoriginal); also, someone felt that the film made Wonder Woman look "too weak."

I thought about these reactions a lot. I still feel that Jenkins is a solid director who made extremely questionable choices as a writer AND as a director in WW84. I refuse to join the bloodthirsty fanboy mob that went from "She saved the DCEU! In Jenkins we trust!" in 2017 to "She is not a great director and she needs to stay away from superheroes, Diana, Star Wars and movies in general!" in 2020. That is such BS.
I am truly hoping that she is taking lots of notes in regard to the overall audience reaction to WW84 and that she gets back with Allan Heinberg (for WW3) as collaborating writing partners. They need to sit down and find a compromise between so-called artistic vision and mainstream blockbuster sensibilities, because Wonder Woman 3 needs to be a fantastic superhero film that lets Diana be superheroic and powerful. And it needs to give audiences emotional moments BUT also lots of bone-crunching action.
The trilogy needs to go out with a bang.

Am wondering what age and gender of those feeding back was?

[WonderLight789]

More than I could take and walk away.

Cheetah is supposed to be far above peak human level. She is supposed to be incredibly fast, strong and tanky. But ww84 did not show any of that.

[FutureWonder]

Cheetah is supposed to be far above peak human level. She is supposed to be incredibly fast, strong and tanky. But ww84 did not show any of that.

Because the Cheetah in the film was nowhere near the Cheetah that we all know and love. I don't care how much people like the origin that Rucka gave her (isn't that what inspired movie Cheetah?), the Cheetah I love was the greedy, cunning, and manipulative British archaelogist that Perez envisioned (and yes, I know that this in itself was not the original Cheetah). I have to agree with my co-workers: nerdy, clumsy, insecure Barbara (with glasses of course) who turns into supervillain is a big cliche that we have seen countless times. I enjoyed the film for the most part, but Cheetah was the biggest disappointment for me.

[Geraldofrivia]

Cheetah was a straight-up embarrassment. Diana was not even breaking a sweat and was treating her like some child she doesn't want to hurt. Not to mention she gets taken out by electricity like some Spiderman villain.

[brettc1]

Cheetah was a straight-up embarrassment. Diana was not even breaking a sweat and was treating her like some child she doesn't want to hurt. Not to mention she gets taken out by electricity like some Spiderman villain.

First time they fight, she gets taken out by Julia shooting her with a rifle.

Cheetah’s strength level is indeterminate. She is more like the Flash with Wolverine’s claws, not Doomsday.

Considering we’ve seen Diana rip that tail right off, I would say her durability is superhuman but not equal to Diana’s levels.

I mean, an adversary that’s almost impossible to hit AND invulnerable? That’s getting a bit OP, IMO.

[Myskin]

Now that I think about it, the one person I am really sorry for this mess is Chris Pine.
Pedro Pascal is over-the-top, generally fine, and still has The Mandalorian. Kristen Wiig as Minerva, for the most part, is basically her character Penelope from SNL and no one will ever remember her Cheetah, which is probably a blessing for her. Gal Gadot will continue to have her fans even if she is probably the worst actress of the bunch and the entire movie would have been better with no Wonder Woman in it, as a campy homage to fantasy comedies of the 1990s like Bruce Almighty.
However, poor Chris Pine keeps running from scene to scene with his mouth constantly half-opened and the same facial expression of someone who can't understand why the hell he is in the movie.

[Agent Z]

Now that I think about it, the one person I am really sorry for this mess is Chris Pine.
Pedro Pascal is over-the-top, generally fine, and still has The Mandalorian. Kristen Wiig as Minerva, for the most part, is basically her character Penelope from SNL and no one will ever remember her Cheetah, which is probably a blessing for her. Gal Gadot will continue to have her fans even if she is probably the worst actress of the bunch and the entire movie would have been better with no Wonder Woman in it, as a campy homage to fantasy comedies of the 1990s like Bruce Almighty.
However, poor Chris Pine keeps running from scene to scene with his mouth constantly half-opened and the same facial expression of someone who can't understand why the hell he is in the movie.

You sure do love to speak for everyone else.

I'm sure Pine doesn't need your pity especially as he enjoyed his role in the film quite well.

[Geraldofrivia]

First time they fight, she gets taken out by Julia shooting her with a rifle.

Cheetah’s strength level is indeterminate. She is more like the Flash with Wolverine’s claws, not Doomsday.

Considering we’ve seen Diana rip that tail right off, I would say her durability is superhuman but not equal to Diana’s levels.

I mean, an adversary that’s almost impossible to hit AND invulnerable? That’s getting a bit OP, IMO.

well, I did not see flash with wolverine claws in the movie

[brettc1]

well, I did not see flash with wolverine claws in the movie

I did.

Weird.

[FutureWonder]

Did anyone think of Eris during the scene where the whole world was in chaos due to all the wishing and wish-granting?
I know that Eris has nothing to do with wishes, but the scene made me think of how a WW film with Eris would have played out, with the villainess spreading the seeds of discord through the world and people everywhere fighting and arguing. Now I kinda wish that would have happened. I know that Ares was not exactly a beloved element of the first film, and I bet that even if he had been, the filmmakers would have probably avoided the goddess of strife, but I still feel that it would have been a natural progression to have the daughter of the war god wanting revenge against the amazon who killed her father.

[SiegePerilous02]

Because the Cheetah in the film was nowhere near the Cheetah that we all know and love. I don't care how much people like the origin that Rucka gave her (isn't that what inspired movie Cheetah?), the Cheetah I love was the greedy, cunning, and manipulative British archaelogist that Perez envisioned (and yes, I know that this in itself was not the original Cheetah). I have to agree with my co-workers: nerdy, clumsy, insecure Barbara (with glasses of course) who turns into supervillain is a big cliche that we have seen countless times. I enjoyed the film for the most part, but Cheetah was the biggest disappointment for me.

I wouldn't say this was based on Rucka's. it was more Priscilla Rich mixed with Pfeiffer's Catwoman, motivated by envy and a mcguffin needed to turn her into a mutant cat thing.

[WonderLight789]

I did.

Weird.

I didn't. Cheetah did not have even one super speed feat move that could be considered in Flash's lane.

[Adekis]

The more I think about the movie, the more I like it.

I think there are some legitimate criticisms to be made, but all the ones I really care about are fairly insubstantial, and don't drag the movie down much. On the contrary, I really value the elements I thought were very good, where the elements I think needed work were a real small part of the experience to me.

Among the best parts:
[*] My fiancee suspected that Max was going to be a generic "seemingly affable businessman revealed to be cartoonishly menacing" a la Obadiah Stane. What we got instead was so refreshing and great, a truly charming, very banally evil kind of villain, but still so easy to understand and so much fun to watch. Absolutely one of the best villains in a while in super-hero movies, very unique.
[*] Some people think the action sucked because it wasn't brutal enough?? On the contrary, I think the fact that Diana went out of her way not to badly hurt those she fought was a triumph of characterization-through-action, something the super-hero genre as a whole needs to get better at. It was phenomenal and one of my favorite aspects.
[*] Even when not doing that, the action was Real Good.
[*] So much beauty and joy and sadness in the scenes with Steve, holy moley. I wasn't sure that he was going to live up to the Steve from WW1, but he was excellent.
[*] I think Cheetah has a lot of potential? And I hope she comes back in a hypothetical Justice League vs Legion of Doom movie. I mean heck, Black Manta's still out there too, there's definitely starting to be enough stray villains to pull it off.

The trashing this movie is getting is ridiculous and totally unmerited; there are things I can see why folks would complain about them, but the extent of the hate is just stupid.

WW84 isn't gonna be in my Top 5 Super-Hero movies, but it might be in the Top 10. I think it's about as good as "Aquaman," maybe a bit better.