The Flash #49 Preview / Discussion (Spoilers)

[king81992]

The kids are going to come back as enemies to give Wally even more angst,aren't they?

[Rend20]

Wally has a history of being selfish and not listening to reason.

So does Barry. The fact that you willingly choose to dismiss it as bad writing doesn't make it any less true. It was literally Barry's selfishness that led to everything in this arc.

[king81992]

So does Barry. The fact that you willingly choose to dismiss it as bad writing doesn't make it any less true. It was literally Barry's selfishness that led to everything in this arc.

The only speedsters who weren't varying degrees of selfish were Jay, Max Mercury and Impulse.

Both Barry and Wally contributed to this whole fiasco.

[KC]

So does Barry. The fact that you willingly choose to dismiss it as bad writing doesn't make it any less true. It was literally Barry's selfishness that led to everything in this arc.

No, he doesn't. All of Barry's selfishness that comes from this arc came from Williamson. The only other thing (Flashpoint) wasn't really selfish because Barry was trying to fix something Eobard did.

I find it incredible that every criticism of Wally I make either turns into a debate about what Barry does or a Barry vs Wally debate. I'm not taking the bait anymore.

[Buried Alien]

The only speedsters who weren't varying degrees of selfish were Jay, Max Mercury and Impulse.

The cynic in me says, "only because they've been conveniently out of action."

Just wait until they're active again.

Buried Alien (The Fastest Post Alive!)

[Buried Alien]

The kids are going to come back as enemies to give Wally even more angst,aren't they?

Maybe one of them will...and it would be Jai. As long ago as 1997, THE LIFE STORY OF THE FLASH ominously prophesied the tragedy of Wally West's son.

Buried Alien (The Fastest Post Alive!)

[Buried Alien]

Wally has a history of trusting people who killed his unborn children?

Desperation will cause people to do things they would never usually do, and Wally has been pushed to the point of desperation. For better or worse, for me, what Wally is doing reminds me of Superman's initial response in BATMAN VS. SUPERMAN: DAWN OF JUSTICE when Clark realized that Luthor had his mother Martha's life in his hands, and would brutally murder her unless Superman confronted Batman.

"Nobody stays good" rings a bell.

Buried Alien (The Fastest Post Alive!)

[WhipWhirlwind]

No, he doesn't. All of Barry's selfishness that comes from this arc came from Williamson. The only other thing (Flashpoint) wasn't really selfish because Barry was trying to fix something Eobard did.

I find it incredible that every criticism of Wally I make either turns into a debate about what Barry does or a Barry vs Wally debate. I'm not taking the bait anymore.

Just because he was righting a wrong doesn't make it unselfish. The way he went about it he didn't' pay much (any?) mind to the potential negative consequences of his actions, which is selfish.

Emotionally distraught people can act selfishly, and the Flashes have always been more emotional and less "above it all" then your average hero. I don't consider it a real flaw to either character.

[Buried Alien]

Just because he was righting a wrong doesn't make it unselfish. The way he went about it he didn't' pay much (any?) mind to the potential negative consequences of his actions, which is selfish.

1. Let's say that Thawne's manipulation didn't involve any member of Barry's family at all, but pretty much screwed up the rest of the timeline. Barry would still have been obligated to try to fix it, if he could. As it so happened, the murder of Barry's mother was the catalyst for his actions, but even if it weren't, it was still the action he was obligated to take. He couldn't pass on that obligation.

2. According to Pre-FLASHPOINT time-travel rules, Barry's actions would NOT have caused any negative fallout. Other than Thawne, nobody knew that the fundamental rules of time-travel had been changed (due to Thawne's influence).

Back in the Silver and Bronze Ages, the Flashes were often way more cavalier about manipulating time because, during those years, they could afford to be.

Buried Alien (The Fastest Post Alive!)

[WhipWhirlwind]

1. Let's say that Thawne's manipulation didn't involve any member of Barry's family at all, but pretty much screwed up the rest of the timeline. Barry would still have been obligated to try to fix it, if he could. As it so happened, the murder of Barry's mother was the catalyst for his actions, but even if it weren't, it was still the action he was obligated to take. He couldn't pass on that obligation.

2. According to Pre-FLASHPOINT time travel rules, Barry's actions would NOT have caused any negative fallout. Other than Thawne, nobody knew that the fundamental rules of time-travel had been changed (due to Thawne's influence).

Back in the Silver and Bronze Ages, the Flashes were often way more cavalier about manipulating time because, during those years, they could afford to be.

Buried Alien (The Fastest Post Alive!)

All fair points, its true that he had know way to know the rules had changed, which is why I'm generally opposed to the story and hope that this is the last "flash timeline fuckery" story for a while.

Flash should be about how awesome science is and how it leads you to new discoveries, not weigh down the characters with "great responsibility"

[Ilan Preskovsky]

So, there are even more Speed Forces now? *groan*

Seriously, I thought the Speed Force worked great as a concept when first introduced by Waid but this is getting even dumber than the "emotional spectrum" over in Green Lantern.

[MajorHoy]

So, there are even more Speed Forces now? *groan*

Seriously, I thought the Speed Force worked great as a concept when first introduced by Waid but this is getting even dumber than the "emotional spectrum" over in Green Lantern.

Wait . . . multiple speed forces?
Are they based on season or houses of the zodiac or something else equally silly?
(Haven't read any of this, but it almost sounds like it's turning out dumber than I ever thought possible!)

[Buried Alien]

So, there are even more Speed Forces now? *groan*

Seriously, I thought the Speed Force worked great as a concept when first introduced by Waid but this is getting even dumber than the "emotional spectrum" over in Green Lantern.

Well, they aren't all "Speed" Forces. The Speed Force is the Speed Force and it deals with, unsurprisingly, speed. Apparently, however, the universe also has a "Sage Force" and "Strength Force" (wasn't all this previously encompassed in the Power of SHAZAM?).

Buried Alien (The Fastest Post Alive!)

[WhipWhirlwind]

Apparently, however, the universe also has a "Sage Force" and "Strength Force"

Buried Alien (The Fastest Post Alive!)

Oh....oh no.

[Ilan Preskovsky]

Yeah, I just couldn't bring myself to say "Strength Force", let alone "Sage Force". Even the names are moronic.