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  1. #61
    Always Rakzo
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    Quote Originally Posted by Waterfall View Post
    I agree with all of this, except for Waid part. Chain Lightning disproves your statement.
    Chain Lightning is one of the worst Flash stories ever and it actually proves my statement (Wally beat the frikking Anti-Monitor for God's sake).

  2. #62

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    I'll even do one better. Straight from the man himself.

    RCO033.jpg

  3. #63
    Incredible Member Supermutant2099's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dr. Ellingham View Post
    I don't doubt it. Unfortunately there's a segment of comic fans that have entitlement and self-esteem issues that spill over when they feel their favorite characters don't get their due. But it's no excuse now, is it? Certainly not for the childish behavior seen the last 10 years - 10 years! - on this site by the bitterest segment of Wally fans.

    If they were teenagers, few would notice or care. But these are obviously adults, in most cases.
    Well your favorite character who long proven had every right to be spotlight is pushed aside for a character that no one asked to return. Promises of back stories that never happen. Then erased from existence and replaced by a character in name. Then brought back just to pushed aside still for that same character while being screwed with by writer in Titans. Also don't forget not being reunited with his family. There is a lot to bitter about it. A lot.

  4. #64
    Mighty Member Waterfall's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rakzo View Post
    Chain Lightning is one of the worst Flash stories ever and it actually proves my statement (Wally beat the frikking Anti-Monitor for God's sake).
    He couldn't. Only Barry was fated to destroy it.

  5. #65

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    Quote Originally Posted by Waterfall View Post
    He couldn't. Only Barry was fated to destroy it.
    Didn't it have something to do with Wally's vibrations working differently than Barry's and therefore not having the same chain reaction?

  6. #66
    Not a member BohemiaDrinker's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rakzo View Post
    Talking abut different points, I really don't think this is the same level of overglorification that Barry received from Johns during his Flash: Rebirth nor the kind that Wally received during Waid's run (if it was Wally would not only have been called "The Fastest Man Alive" but also "The Greatest Flash EVARZ!" and would have single-handedly saved the entire Multiverse).

    What happened here in fact was pretty on-point from a character and history level. Wally connected to the Speed Force in ways that Barry never could, that has always been part of his character and Williamson gave a decent explanation for it that is pretty appropriate for both. Besides, Hunter was the main antagonist of this story, it was just right for Wally to get the focus here, do you imagine if Barry would have been the one who stopped him? It not only would have been inadequate but would have also created an even greater fight between the fanbases.

    Finally, Barry doesn't really NEED to be "The Fastest Man Alive". Just like Jay Garrick, he works better as an inspiration, a role model that motivates others to be better (as demonstrated by his interaction with Wally in this same chapter). I always thought it would be cool if he was back and if he was given a more modern interpretation which is what Williamson is currently doing but he doesn't NEED to be the center of The Flash universe.
    I mostly agree with this, passing your need to do poke Waid. XD

    Seriously, though, yes. There would be no balancing things without some compromises from both characters, and Willianson made a point to highlight what os strongest and most important in each. I still wish Wally would come out of it with a better uniform, but I'm pretty ok with it.

    Quote Originally Posted by Dr. Ellingham View Post
    I don't doubt it. Unfortunately there's a segment of comic fans that have entitlement and self-esteem issues that spill over when they feel their favorite characters don't get their due. But it's no excuse now, is it? Certainly not for the childish behavior seen the last 10 years - 10 years! - on this site by the bitterest segment of Wally fans.

    If they were teenagers, few would notice or care. But these are obviously adults, in most cases.
    Yeah, that kind of been true here as well for both sides. It's just, IDK, balanced, and with better moderation, but just skim this thread and you'll see.

    And hell, I've been a bitter Wally fan for a looooooooong while. Never felt the need to shit on anyone because of it, though.
    Conner Kent flies. Connor Hawke has a bow. Get it right, people!

  7. #67
    Incredible Member Supermutant2099's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by BohemiaDrinker View Post
    And hell, I've been a bitter Wally fan for a looooooooong while. Never felt the need to shit on anyone because of it, though.
    Same here. Hurts the point you are trying to make and does nothing to prove why things shouldn't be the way they are.

  8. #68
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dr. Ellingham View Post
    I don't doubt it. Unfortunately there's a segment of comic fans that have entitlement and self-esteem issues that spill over when they feel their favorite characters don't get their due. But it's no excuse now, is it? Certainly not for the childish behavior seen the last 10 years - 10 years! - on this site by the bitterest segment of Wally fans.

    If they were teenagers, few would notice or care. But these are obviously adults, in most cases.
    The issue at hand was WIPING OUT Wally in favor of Barry did NOT need to happen.

    If you wanted Barry as Flash-FINE-give Wally a new name and send him and his family on their way. Not replace him with a a racist stereotype that has been a whipping boy for Barry, Damian and anyone else who wants to hurt his feelings.

    Of ALL the fans who had a legit gripe-Wally fans had it. They were told their money was no longer welcomed at Dc unless it was to support BARRY. Along with fans of Jay, Johnny Quick & Bart Allen.

    As if all these folks could NOT co-exist. Meanwhile Peter Parker and his little brother-Miles are playing together to the tune of a movie and decent selling trades.

    A place Flash (Green Lantern, Firestorm & Blue Beetle) could be. Not this war started by NO FANS but management.

  9. #69
    Always Rakzo
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    Quote Originally Posted by Waterfall View Post
    He couldn't. Only Barry was fated to destroy it.
    Barry never destroys the Anti-Monitor. He just helps to stop him at best.

    Wally did beat him on the pages of Chain Lightning though.

  10. #70
    Amazing Member Deku's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Zero Hunter View Post
    Well to be fair it was Barry who destroyed Wally's life in the first place. That is just a cold hard fact. Barry messed up the timestream by being selfish witch not only trapped Wally in limbo it also wiped out his kids and made his wife forget everything about their life. If anything Wally should hate Barry more than Zoom and Hunter combined since he did more to hurt him than they ever did.
    That isn't a cold hard fact. Eobard messed with the timeline and Barry tried to fix it, which is what a hero is supposed to do. Eobard killed Barry's mother, but even if Eobard changed something else, Barry still would have gone back in time to fix it. Also, the rules of Time travel changed when Barry was dead and he had no way of knowing that Flashpoint would happen
    PLUS ULTRA!

  11. #71
    Amazing Member Deku's Avatar
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    Barry is a character that is more than just an inspiration and he has just as much claim to being the centre of the Flash universe as Wally.
    PLUS ULTRA!

  12. #72
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    Quote Originally Posted by BohemiaDrinker View Post
    Sure he did, but from where Wally stands, you can't measure Barry only for that mistake.
    Do you remember the Identity Crisis event and how that affect the Flash ?

  13. #73
    Not a member BohemiaDrinker's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cmbmool View Post
    Do you remember the Identity Crisis event and how that affect the Flash ?
    Yes, but I fail to see your point.
    Conner Kent flies. Connor Hawke has a bow. Get it right, people!

  14. #74
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    Quote Originally Posted by Supermutant2099 View Post
    Barry is least interesting flash and least popular with fans. They have to make him more like wally every medium to make him interesting. Johns is madly in love (well as character) with barry allen. They don't seem to care if fans or other creators feel the same way.

    You're one of THOSE fans... that is all that has to be said.

    Quote Originally Posted by Dr. Ellingham View Post
    I don't doubt it. Unfortunately there's a segment of comic fans that have entitlement and self-esteem issues that spill over when they feel their favorite characters don't get their due. But it's no excuse now, is it? Certainly not for the childish behavior seen the last 10 years - 10 years! - on this site by the bitterest segment of Wally fans.

    If they were teenagers, few would notice or care. But these are obviously adults, in most cases.
    It is what makes the fan service of this issue disappointing. However, if this is the direction Williamson wants to go then just make Wally the main Flash. I grew up with Wally as the Flash and with Waid's third run felt that maybe the character had reached the zenith of his story arc. I saw potential in Barry's return if he could have his own "Mark Waid" writing him. Williamson clearly is NOT that guy.

    Quote Originally Posted by Deku View Post
    Barry is a character that is more than just an inspiration and he has just as much claim to being the centre of the Flash universe as Wally.
    I agree but I fear there is no turning back at this point. If they reboot now might as well make Wally the Justice League Flash as well. They just haven't found the writer to do his book justice. It has been ten years... I thought Williamson might be the guy but that doesn't appear to be the case. Hell... the introduction of all these new "forces" just screams that a reboot of some kind is coming up. I just want good Flash stories. If none of the writers of today can do Barry justice then just commit to Wally and tell good stories... but don't bring back the kids.
    Last edited by FlashEarthOne; 07-11-2018 at 02:31 PM.

  15. #75
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    Quote Originally Posted by Buried Alien View Post
    The prisoner in the future might well be Zoom/Zolomon. Both Barry and Wally spent much of the final part of the story wondering "where's Zoom?" and vowing to "find Zoom." I'm guessing Zoom is that individual locked up in future Iron Heights.

    Superboy-Prime is a remote possibility, but I'm skeptical that it's him. Anti-Monitor is even less likely, as this individual has a personal beef with the Flashes for "what they did to" him. It's true that Barry's sacrifice in COIE # 8 put a serious damper on Anti-Monitor's plans to take down the positive matter Multiverse, but Anti-Monitor has no personal beef with Wally or any other Flash.

    Buried Alien (The Fastest Post Alive!)
    Hasn’t DC recon Barry’s COIE death due to the events of Convergence ?

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