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  1. #16
    CBB 4 LIFE Mr MajestiK's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Dying Detective View Post
    What did Priest do with the whole potential wives thing?



    Thank you for understanding and it's alright we all have moments when our love for something gets the better of us.
    No worries my friend.

    As regards what Priest did with the Dora Milaje concept he created in the first place?

    Surprisingly nothing other than to establish them as an incredibly accomplished and deadly component of his overall arsenal.

    Much has been made as to the relative ages of the two Dora's Priest had accompanying T'challa during his run but unfortunately most detractors have wilfully chosen to ignore the fact that T'challa was never shown taking advantage of the Dora's symbolic status as "wives in training" or the additional fact that age of consent even in some Western countries such as the UK, happens to be 16 so it's not as if Priest presented something that flew entirely in the face of logic.

    Reginald Hudlin's depiction of the Dora Milaje diverged a great deal away from Priest's wherein the Dora's were depicted as a very distinctive arm of the Wakandan armed forces and elite bodyguards to the King in particular and Royal Family in general.

    There was nothing unambiguous about their ages or status in relation to T'challa and this remained the same all the way through to Hickman's New Avengers were the Dora's uniformly turned away from supporting T'challa due to his secret dealings with Namor as a member of the Illuminati at a time when Wakanda was at war with Atlantic.

    Towards the ending of Time Runs Out, the Dora Milaje were shown standing side by side with Queen Shuri and T'challa facing off against Proxima Midnight and her forces.

    Coates decided to ignore all of that and create an artificial schism between T'challa and the Dora's so as to create a foundation for the artificial gender unbalance he introduced into the BP mythos to facilitate his own take on T'challa and the aforementioned BP Mythos.
    Enjoying the camraderie of friends and family is all that matters in the world.

    Mr MajestiK took a short hiatus and the Chaos Bringer was reborn.

  2. #17
    Ultimate Member MindofShadow's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Dying Detective View Post
    What did Priest do with the whole potential wives thing?
    - used it as a plot point for malice to an extent

    - used it for leverage against malice later


    That is pretty much it.

    the "wives in training" part was the least important aspect of the dora's.
    Black Panther Appreciation Blog: http://blackpanthermarvel.blogspot.com/

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  3. #18
    The Detective Man The Dying Detective's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mr MajestiK View Post
    No worries my friend.

    As regards what Priest did with the Dora Milaje concept he created in the first place?

    Surprisingly nothing other than to establish them as an incredibly accomplished and deadly component of his overall arsenal.

    Much has been made as to the relative ages of the two Dora's Priest had accompanying T'challa during his run but unfortunately most detractors have wilfully chosen to ignore the fact that T'challa was never shown taking advantage of the Dora's symbolic status as "wives in training" or the additional fact that age of consent even in some Western countries such as the UK, happens to be 16 so it's not as if Priest presented something that flew entirely in the face of logic.

    Reginald Hudlin's depiction of the Dora Milaje diverged a great deal away from Priest's wherein the Dora's were depicted as a very distinctive arm of the Wakandan armed forces and elite bodyguards to the King in particular and Royal Family in general.

    There was nothing unambiguous about their ages or status in relation to T'challa and this remained the same all the way through to Hickman's New Avengers were the Dora's uniformly turned away from supporting T'challa due to his secret dealings with Namor as a member of the Illuminati at a time when Wakanda was at war with Atlantic.

    Towards the ending of Time Runs Out, the Dora Milaje were shown standing side by side with Queen Shuri and T'challa facing off against Proxima Midnight and her forces.

    Coates decided to ignore all of that and create an artificial schism between T'challa and the Dora's so as to create a foundation for the artificial gender unbalance he introduced into the BP mythos to facilitate his own take on T'challa and the aforementioned BP Mythos.
    So Coates is ignoring the work of his predecessors just so he can tell some sort of feminist stroy involving the Dora Milaje? No wonder people really don't like Coates that much.
    "Excellent!" I cried. "Elementary," said he

  4. #19
    The Detective Man The Dying Detective's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MindofShadow View Post
    - used it as a plot point for malice to an extent

    - used it for leverage against malice later


    That is pretty much it.

    the "wives in training" part was the least important aspect of the dora's.
    I see and now that you mention Malice I wonder whether it would be a good idea to incorporate the creative liberties the Marvel Cinematic Universe took with her character?
    "Excellent!" I cried. "Elementary," said he

  5. #20
    CBB 4 LIFE Mr MajestiK's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Dying Detective View Post
    So Coates is ignoring the work of his predecessors just so he can tell some sort of feminist stroy involving the Dora Milaje? No wonder people really don't like Coates that much.
    I can't really speak to Coates full motivations but, going on the alterations he's already made it's safe to say that they're not particularly T'Challa/BP Mythos friendly.

    There are however, a number of readers who do like Coates take on BP enough for the book sell reasonably well despite its many flaws and departures from established continuity and Canon.
    Enjoying the camraderie of friends and family is all that matters in the world.

    Mr MajestiK took a short hiatus and the Chaos Bringer was reborn.

  6. #21
    CBB 4 LIFE Mr MajestiK's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Dying Detective View Post
    I see and now that you mention Malice I wonder whether it would be a good idea to incorporate the creative liberties the Marvel Cinematic Universe took with her character?
    I think it would be pretty hard to do that unless a totally new character called Nakia was introduced.

    That will never happen under Coates as he's more interested in having T'challa fawn over his ex-wife a d current ex-deux machin, Storm.
    Enjoying the camraderie of friends and family is all that matters in the world.

    Mr MajestiK took a short hiatus and the Chaos Bringer was reborn.

  7. #22
    Invincible Member XPac's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Dying Detective View Post
    What did Priest do with the whole potential wives thing?



    Thank you for understanding and it's alright we all have moments when our love for something gets the better of us.
    I think there were elements of Priests take which I don't think necessarily give Wakanda a very good look.

    Biggest issue might be that they originally were just teenage girls, with one of them eventually falling in love and becoming obsessed with T'CHalla.

    Originally they weren't allowed to speak with anyone but T'CHalla, and if they dated other people were told it could potentially incite a war. They were after all political pawns who essentially were being used to keep the peace between warring tribes.

    I think the the later books and movie sort of saw that the portrayal of the Doras in Priests run potentially could bother some people, so they seemed older later on and the more restrictive rules were ignored. This was largely all background stuff anyways, so it wasn't hard to ignore.

    But now under Coates book, they broke away from the system and are now their own separate tribe.

  8. #23
    Invincible Member XPac's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Dying Detective View Post
    I see and now that you mention Malice I wonder whether it would be a good idea to incorporate the creative liberties the Marvel Cinematic Universe took with her character?
    You frankly would have an easier time just creating a brand new character who is similar to the MCU version.

    Sort of like how they made a New Wasp and a Nick Fury Jr. for the comics. They are similar to the movie versions, without changing the original comic versions.

  9. #24
    The Detective Man The Dying Detective's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mr MajestiK View Post
    I can't really speak to Coates full motivations but, going on the alterations he's already made it's safe to say that they're not particularly T'Challa/BP Mythos friendly.

    There are however, a number of readers who do like Coates take on BP enough for the book sell reasonably well despite its many flaws and departures from established continuity and Canon.
    From what I have been hearing about Coates on Black Panther probably isn't faithful to the mythos. It is odd that Coates's run is selling well especially when I found his Black Panther and the Crew book dull though i think that's a different writer right?

    Quote Originally Posted by Mr MajestiK View Post
    I think it would be pretty hard to do that unless a totally new character called Nakia was introduced.

    That will never happen under Coates as he's more interested in having T'challa fawn over his ex-wife a d current ex-deux machin, Storm.
    I am unattached to the idea of Storm and T'Challa being together but given how the relationship itself was lacking in substance introducing the Marvel Cinematic Universe version of Malice would be an improvement. So Nakia isn't Malice's real name oh well Nakia herself looked like a totally different character from Malice anyway Marvel can just introduce her as a new character once Coates wraps up whenever that 's going to happen
    "Excellent!" I cried. "Elementary," said he

  10. #25
    CBB 4 LIFE Mr MajestiK's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by XPac View Post
    I think there were elements of Priests take which I don't think necessarily give Wakanda a very good look.

    Biggest issue might be that they originally were just teenage girls, with one of them eventually falling in love and becoming obsessed with T'CHalla.

    Originally they weren't allowed to speak with anyone but T'CHalla, and if they dated other people were told it could potentially incite a war. They were after all political pawns who essentially were being used to keep the peace between warring tribes.

    I think the the later books and movie sort of saw that the portrayal of the Doras in Priests run potentially could bother some people, so they seemed older later on and the more restrictive rules were ignored. This was largely all background stuff anyways, so it wasn't hard to ignore.

    But now under Coates book, they broke away from the system and are now their own separate tribe.
    So you have any scans to back up your assertions about Dora's potentially sparking off a war amongst tribes by dating other people?

    In fact, I'm really interested in how you'd write a Black Panther book as one of the CBR's most prolific posters in the BP Appreciation thread.

    That is after all, what this thread was ostensibly set up for.
    Last edited by Mr MajestiK; 07-11-2018 at 11:14 AM.
    Enjoying the camraderie of friends and family is all that matters in the world.

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  11. #26
    Ultimate Member MindofShadow's Avatar
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    MCU Malice could easily be a rogue dog of war that needs to be "put down"

    wouldn't be the firstime a DoW went sideways lol
    Black Panther Appreciation Blog: http://blackpanthermarvel.blogspot.com/

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  12. #27
    Ultimate Member MindofShadow's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mr MajestiK View Post
    So you have any scans to back up your assertions about Dora's potentially sparking off a war amongst tribes by dating other people?
    It was the vibraxas/QDJ relationship where something like this was stated I thnk
    Black Panther Appreciation Blog: http://blackpanthermarvel.blogspot.com/

    T'challa's Greatest Comic Book Feats: http://blackpanthermarvel.blogspot.c...her-feats.html

  13. #28
    Mario Di Giacomo Beware Of Geek's Avatar
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    As it happens, I wrote a brief outline some months back for a year-long run. I think it fits the thread:

    Well, I think the best place to start would be to keep it simple, and not lean TOO much on continuity. There's an old maxim (since forgotten by the Big Two) in comics that "every issue is someone's first", so I'd want the first arc to be somewhat "new reader friendly".

    Arc One: The Man

    It's been part of the mythos for some time that the Panther must periodically accept challenges for his mantle. This time around, one of the challengers is named Erik N'jadaka, the now-grown son of the late Killmonger. And, like his father before him, Erik wins the mantle of Panther, when T'Challa suddenly seems to lose his strength.

    T'Challa undergoes a vision quest to discover why the Panther God has seemingly abandoned him, and along the way re-connects with the spirits of his forefathers, who introduce him to the TRUE nature of the Panther God (I never really liked the Bast thing).

    Meanwhile, young N'Jadaka discovers that wanting to rule and actually being able to are two very different things. The tribal council may acknowledge him, but they do not respect him, as the representative of the Jabari (recently returned from apparent death at the hands of Morlun) leads a coalition against him. When TChalla returns, re-empowered and aware of the deception the youth played on him (a contact poison that blocked the Heart-Shaped Herb) , the young Killmonger is almost grateful, and swears fealty after his defeat.

    Arc Two: The Nation.

    T'Challa must broker peace with M'Baku and his coalition, before the country devolves to civil war. When M'Baku tries to get physical (his traditional fallback position), T'Challa slaps him down.

    But that's nothing, compared to the verbal smackdown delivered by a suddenly arrived Ce'Athauna Davin, former Dora Milaje (and rightful queen of the Jabari) who had been away at university in the States. Her appearance was not just to help T'Challa, however, as she's brought ill tidings:

    The Desturi are back. And they've brought an army, bearing black-market vibranium weaponry, derived from the work of one Ulysses Klaw.

    Arc Three: The World.

    Lines are drawn. Allies summoned on both sides. Battle is joined. And in the end, the Panther stands supreme.

    Thoughts?
    Mario Di Giacomo

  14. #29
    The Detective Man The Dying Detective's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by XPac View Post
    I think there were elements of Priests take which I don't think necessarily give Wakanda a very good look.

    Biggest issue might be that they originally were just teenage girls, with one of them eventually falling in love and becoming obsessed with T'CHalla.

    Originally they weren't allowed to speak with anyone but T'CHalla, and if they dated other people were told it could potentially incite a war. They were after all political pawns who essentially were being used to keep the peace between warring tribes.

    I think the the later books and movie sort of saw that the portrayal of the Doras in Priests run potentially could bother some people, so they seemed older later on and the more restrictive rules were ignored. This was largely all background stuff anyways, so it wasn't hard to ignore.

    But now under Coates book, they broke away from the system and are now their own separate tribe.
    Sound like the way the Dora Milaje were originally made some feel uncomfortable and that Coates might have done one thing right. And I am guessing that Malice was the girl you mentioned?

    Quote Originally Posted by XPac View Post
    You frankly would have an easier time just creating a brand new character who is similar to the MCU version.

    Sort of like how they made a New Wasp and a Nick Fury Jr. for the comics. They are similar to the movie versions, without changing the original comic versions.
    Yeah that's what I'm thinking about too.
    "Excellent!" I cried. "Elementary," said he

  15. #30
    The Detective Man The Dying Detective's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Beware Of Geek View Post
    As it happens, I wrote a brief outline some months back for a year-long run. I think it fits the thread:

    Well, I think the best place to start would be to keep it simple, and not lean TOO much on continuity. There's an old maxim (since forgotten by the Big Two) in comics that "every issue is someone's first", so I'd want the first arc to be somewhat "new reader friendly".

    Arc One: The Man

    It's been part of the mythos for some time that the Panther must periodically accept challenges for his mantle. This time around, one of the challengers is named Erik N'jadaka, the now-grown son of the late Killmonger. And, like his father before him, Erik wins the mantle of Panther, when T'Challa suddenly seems to lose his strength.

    T'Challa undergoes a vision quest to discover why the Panther God has seemingly abandoned him, and along the way re-connects with the spirits of his forefathers, who introduce him to the TRUE nature of the Panther God (I never really liked the Bast thing).

    Meanwhile, young N'Jadaka discovers that wanting to rule and actually being able to are two very different things. The tribal council may acknowledge him, but they do not respect him, as the representative of the Jabari (recently returned from apparent death at the hands of Morlun) leads a coalition against him. When TChalla returns, re-empowered and aware of the deception the youth played on him (a contact poison that blocked the Heart-Shaped Herb) , the young Killmonger is almost grateful, and swears fealty after his defeat.

    Arc Two: The Nation.

    T'Challa must broker peace with M'Baku and his coalition, before the country devolves to civil war. When M'Baku tries to get physical (his traditional fallback position), T'Challa slaps him down.

    But that's nothing, compared to the verbal smackdown delivered by a suddenly arrived Ce'Athauna Davin, former Dora Milaje (and rightful queen of the Jabari) who had been away at university in the States. Her appearance was not just to help T'Challa, however, as she's brought ill tidings:

    The Desturi are back. And they've brought an army, bearing black-market vibranium weaponry, derived from the work of one Ulysses Klaw.

    Arc Three: The World.

    Lines are drawn. Allies summoned on both sides. Battle is joined. And in the end, the Panther stands supreme.

    Thoughts?
    The first arc seems based on the Black panther movie it actually works better than the idea that T'Challa didn't consume the herb before fighting Killmonger as it makes a lot more sense though you'd think even without it T'Challa should be able to put up more of a fight. Arc two kind of reminds me of the events of Shuri's tenure as the Black Panther is it base don it. Arc three is a little too vague to judge.
    "Excellent!" I cried. "Elementary," said he

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