View Poll Results: What is your favorite modern Superman film?

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  • Superman Returns

    14 20.90%
  • Man of Steel

    36 53.73%
  • Batman V Superman

    6 8.96%
  • Justice League

    11 16.42%
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  1. #31
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kuwagaton View Post
    Pretty much. I don't think heading straight to a sequel full of crossovers with all new characters was a wise move, but putting a movie in between would completely change the plot of BvS. At that point the criticism is basically just, "BvS should have been a better movie."
    I'm sure Snyder could have set up the pre-conditions for a Batman battle in a second Superman movie. And then they wouldn't have had to waste as much time with the convoluted logic that motivates the unmotivated battle between the Man of Tomorrow and the Darknight Detective in BVS.

    It seems like there was a lot of time between when MOS came out in 2013 and when BVS came out in 2017--they could have slipped another Superman movie in there quite nicely in 2015, if they had the will to find a way.

  2. #32
    Mighty Member stargazer01's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jim Kelly View Post
    I'm sure Snyder could have set up the pre-conditions for a Batman battle in a second Superman movie. And then they wouldn't have had to waste as much time with the convoluted logic that motivates the unmotivated battle between the Man of Tomorrow and the Darknight Detective in BVS.

    It seems like there was a lot of time between when MOS came out in 2013 and when BVS came out in 2017--they could have slipped another Superman movie in there quite nicely in 2015, if they had the will to find a way.
    I think it was the plan to continue with a Superman sequel (he alluded in another interview) but then WB got very greedy and wanted to hurry and expand the universe with more characters towards the JL movie. The problem is that it was at the expense of Superman's character development.

    I love Henry's ideas for a sequel. He's been sharing his ideas in recent interviews during the Mission Impossible tour. This is probably my favorite video so far. I'll be crushed if he doesn't get the chance to play this Superman,


  3. #33
    Astonishing Member David Walton's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jump View Post
    Man of Steel felt like it was a great starting point for a new franchise, with the more movies released the closer it got to the classic Supes people know & love but it just didn't seem to happen like that.
    I found it odd that the selling point was essentially, "Watch Superman act uncharacteristically for several films before gradually morphing into what you actually want to see."

    I really enjoyed Superman in Justice League, though! Just seems like a lot of time wasted getting him to that point.

  4. #34
    Phantom Zone Escapee manofsteel1979's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jim Kelly View Post
    I'm sure Snyder could have set up the pre-conditions for a Batman battle in a second Superman movie. And then they wouldn't have had to waste as much time with the convoluted logic that motivates the unmotivated battle between the Man of Tomorrow and the Darknight Detective in BVS.

    It seems like there was a lot of time between when MOS came out in 2013 and when BVS came out in 2017--they could have slipped another Superman movie in there quite nicely in 2015, if they had the will to find a way.
    I agree. I've said before that BvS feels like the third instalment of the story started in MOS and the culmination of the threads laid there. The problem is they never made that middle movie.

    A more somber and conflicted Superman would have worked much better if we got to see the Superman that did all of the heroic and inspiring things that we saw plastered all over the clipings in Wallace O keefe's house first. With that context we could have felt more empathy for Kal when Luthor began his frame job of Supes in BvS and the Capital bombing in that movie. Build our hero up before tearing him down...then finding his redemption in his sacrifice and resurrection.

    Also, getting to know Clark Kent more and his relationship with Lois and such. Perhaps even set up Luthor a bit more and have his paranoia and mania build through MOS 2 in the background and we see it unleashed in BvS.

    MOS 2 would have been an exploration of Clark/ Superman as a man and Superhero and an insight to how he saw the world. The POV Basically from the inside looking out.

    BvS would have been what it ultimately was anyway, which was about how the world saw Superman.The POV being the outside looking in
    Last edited by manofsteel1979; 07-18-2018 at 02:16 PM.
    When it comes to comics,one person's "fan-service" is another persons personal cannon. So by definition it's ALL fan service. Aren't we ALL fans?
    SUPERMAN is the greatest fictional character ever created.

  5. #35
    Astonishing Member Coal Tiger's Avatar
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    Justice League was the only one I felt had Superman in it, so I guess it wins by default.

  6. #36
    (formerly "Superman") JAK's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by David Walton View Post
    I found it odd that the selling point was essentially, "Watch Superman act uncharacteristically for several films before gradually morphing into what you actually want to see."

    I really enjoyed Superman in Justice League, though! Just seems like a lot of time wasted getting him to that point.
    That's also how I feel, though everyone's different.

    I kinda wish someone had said "don't see MoS and BvS. Total waste of your time. Skip them and see JL." I'd have been fine. JL doesn't really need the other two to exist, even if we're dropped into the story half-way. Although, half of what I enjoyed about JL was how refreshingly different Superman was. If I didn't have the other two in my brain at the time, I probably would have found Superman in JL to be a little "over the top". So there is that. But I'd rather be disappointed by "a bit over the top" than the absolute nauseating outrage I had after MoS and BvS.

    I like a lot of SR.. but there's a lot of re-hash (aka line-stealing) from Donner's S:TM, and it just falls flat here. Brandon deserved another shot, imo - the director and the writers just let him down.
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  7. #37
    Father Son Kamehameha < Kuwagaton's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jim Kelly View Post
    I'm sure Snyder could have set up the pre-conditions for a Batman battle in a second Superman movie. And then they wouldn't have had to waste as much time with the convoluted logic that motivates the unmotivated battle between the Man of Tomorrow and the Darknight Detective in BVS.

    It seems like there was a lot of time between when MOS came out in 2013 and when BVS came out in 2017--they could have slipped another Superman movie in there quite nicely in 2015, if they had the will to find a way.
    Actually, BvS came out in the first quarter of 2016. For the time and money to be put into a sequel between June 2013 and March 2016, they probably would have needed a critical and commercial success in 2013 for justification. I don't think MoS was really close enough to that. If the people responsible for the creation of such a project were willing, they'd probably be met with the conceit that making one modest hit gave no reason to believe they could right the ship quickly and get back on track with the third project.

  8. #38
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    Yeah my grip on reality is slipping. I don't even know what year it is anymore.

  9. #39
    Smiles but not on command Powerboy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by David Walton View Post
    I found it odd that the selling point was essentially, "Watch Superman act uncharacteristically for several films before gradually morphing into what you actually want to see."

    I really enjoyed Superman in Justice League, though! Just seems like a lot of time wasted getting him to that point.
    This is exactly it. I can see it from a story point of view. But I can't see it from the point of view that they seriously thought this was going to be a huge selling point that we would endure at least two movies of an either unrecognizable Superman or at least the recognizable parts were barely hinted to be there while glorying in all the stuff that seemed antithetical to Superman. I'm not talking about Snyder himself who at least had a vision and saw it through. But it's hard to believe the suits really thought this would be a mega-hit challenging Marvel or being almost universally liked or anything but divisive and middle of the road in terms of popularity.

    Mind you, I liked and even loved a great deal of the movie. Yes it almost totally lost it and not just fell but headfirst jumped off the deep end in the last half hour or so with a few earlier problems. But I don't hate it. I like it in a lot of ways. But in JL, regardless of how bad the movie was overall, I had that absolutely fantastic visceral reaction to Superman, that he was finally, well, Superman. A few flaws, some questionable stuff but, overall, at least he's finally Superman.

    And the Silver Age Superman/ Flash race? Two thumbs up. About friggin' time.
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  10. #40
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    Quote Originally Posted by JAK View Post
    That's also how I feel, though everyone's different.

    I kinda wish someone had said "don't see MoS and BvS. Total waste of your time. Skip them and see JL." I'd have been fine. JL doesn't really need the other two to exist, even if we're dropped into the story half-way. Although, half of what I enjoyed about JL was how refreshingly different Superman was. If I didn't have the other two in my brain at the time, I probably would have found Superman in JL to be a little "over the top". So there is that. But I'd rather be disappointed by "a bit over the top" than the absolute nauseating outrage I had after MoS and BvS.

    I like a lot of SR.. but there's a lot of re-hash (aka line-stealing) from Donner's S:TM, and it just falls flat here. Brandon deserved another shot, imo - the director and the writers just let him down.
    Exactly. If it had not been for MoS and BvS, I too probably would have found the Superman of JL a bit too over the top, a bit too outright Silver Age. But specifically because of the previous movies, the Superman of JL was an absolute joy to see. Even if it didn't fit with the two previous movies, seeing him as he was in JL was like childhood nostalgia mixed with an aching need for something in the superhero genre with positive feelings joining together to cause an explosion of visceral joy [hmm that sounded less gross in my mind].
    "I'm not what you think I am". Higher, further, faster.

  11. #41
    Mighty Member stargazer01's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by manofsteel1979 View Post
    I agree. I've said before that BvS feels like the third instalment of the story started in MOS and the culmination of the threads laid there. The problem is they never made that middle movie.

    A more somber and conflicted Superman would have worked much better if we got to see the Superman that did all of the heroic and inspiring things that we saw plastered all over the clipings in Wallace O keefe's house first. With that context we could have felt more empathy for Kal when Luthor began his frame job of Supes in BvS and the Capital bombing in that movie. Build our hero up before tearing him down...then finding his redemption in his sacrifice and resurrection.

    Also, getting to know Clark Kent more and his relationship with Lois and such. Perhaps even set up Luthor a bit more and have his paranoia and mania build through MOS 2 in the background and we see it unleashed in BvS.

    MOS 2 would have been an exploration of Clark/ Superman as a man and Superhero and an insight to how he saw the world. The POV Basically from the inside looking out.

    BvS would have been what it ultimately was anyway, which was about how the world saw Superman.The POV being the outside looking in
    I think I would have done BvS different. I would start with MOS, then his sequel with a more confident Superman becoming a real beacon of hope.

    Then a Superman/Batman movie, introducing Wonder Woman in a small role as well as mention/show Flash, Aquaman and Cyborg similar to how BvS did it.

    Then the Wonder Woman movie. And then Justice League, and I would kill Superman here and resurrect him in JL 2. By this time, we would be a lot more emotionally invested in him and his death would be more powerful, IMO. I think The Flash and Aquaman could have their solo movie in between JL and JL2. Depends on the story points.

  12. #42
    Mighty Member stargazer01's Avatar
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    Interesting poll results so far. I was not expecting so much love for Superman Returns, but I like it because I think it's a good movie.

    I'm not surprised, however, to see little love for BvS. I think I liked this film more before, but lately I've been feeling like it was not what it should have been.

    So like I mentioned in the opening post, my favorite is Man of Steel. I actually saw it after BvS. I feel bad I didn't see it on the big screen. I was one of those bitter fans who wanted a Superman Returns sequel.. so I didn't want to give Henry Cavill a chance as Superman. But after watching BvS, I really liked him. The scene that sold me on him as Superman was The Day of the Death when he rescues the girl from fire. He seemed so gently and kind. I liked his facial expression. He felt like my Superman.

    any way, when I finally watched Man of Steel at home, I loved it. I was blown away by the action, story, plot and visuals. Superman looked so powerful and real. I also liked the VFX and the cast, especially Russell Crowe as Jor-El. Wow superb casting. Amy as Lois was also nice, and I so loved watching her as an action woman defending herself. He relationship with Superman was great and more mature than usual, IMO. I really liked the story, but I have a couple of issues with it. Pa Kent. I buy that he was very protective of his son in a more realistic world, I just didn't buy that Clark would let him die like that. Felt so out of character and forced drama. it still didn't ruin the movie for me. I just kind of ignore it lol. I didn't have a problem with Superman killing Zod, but I understand why some feel uncomfortable. I think it's very visceral and in your face. Batman kills in the movies too, but he doesn't do it in your face. At least not like Zod. MOS is a Superman movie with real consequences. It's not a fairytale. I appreciate that. I don't understand why people feel that Superman didn't save anyone, when it's clear to me that he was saving everybody since he was young. Sure he didn't smile a lot, but I felt he always did what he thought was right. I have only seen this movie 3 times. it's been a while. I should rewatch it again, but I remember loving it. When Superman flies for the first time, that is the best Superman scene on film to me so far. It's so poetic and beautiful to me. It justifies this movie existing.

    Now Superman Returns. It's a very flawed movie, but I really like some things about it. I love that it takes Superman seriously. It shows a majestic and nostalgic Superman. Some scenes are pretty epic and powerful. I love that it reminds me of Reeve. I really liked Brandon as Supes. I wished he had done a sequel, but it didn't happen. I'm not sure a sequel would have worked too well because of Richard. How do you get rid of him? Killing him? Not fair.

    BvS. I liked this more when it came out, but I feel that it didn't get Superman right. I mean, he's ok in it, but it feels off that he is so gloomy throughout. I can see why many people don't like him. I think I like Batman more in this, and that disappoints me. Even Wonder Woman shines more. Superman doesn't stand out like he should, IMO. The story and execution simply don't allow him to be him. Some great scenes, but overall, as a Supes fan first, I don't love it like I should.

    Justice League. I don't understand so much hate this movie get. I really enjoy it. Yes it's messy, but I really loved the characters interacting. These actors have so much chemistry and are very believable in their roles and as a team. This movie gives me goofy smiles from beginning to end. And Superman is finally happy. And he is a super badass and more confident. The movie is not perfect, but to me it works. It's solid. It's not amazing, but it's not terrible either. I enjoy it more than BvS. I think BvS is better made, but JL is more enjoyble for me. I was not disappointed in it. I wish it was better, but I really like despite its fault because the characters are great in it, and I think they have solid character development as well.
    Last edited by stargazer01; 07-18-2018 at 10:29 PM.

  13. #43
    Spectacular Member Charlus's Avatar
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    The best movie of the last 25 years is an animated one, and itís called Superman vs The Elite.

  14. #44
    Astonishing Member David Walton's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by JAK View Post
    That's also how I feel, though everyone's different.

    I kinda wish someone had said "don't see MoS and BvS. Total waste of your time. Skip them and see JL." I'd have been fine. JL doesn't really need the other two to exist, even if we're dropped into the story half-way. Although, half of what I enjoyed about JL was how refreshingly different Superman was. If I didn't have the other two in my brain at the time, I probably would have found Superman in JL to be a little "over the top". So there is that. But I'd rather be disappointed by "a bit over the top" than the absolute nauseating outrage I had after MoS and BvS.
    It's hard for me to give an objective opinion of JL, because my whole outlook is colored by my excitement at Superman acting more like Superman. If I'm being honest, I feel like the film itself is probably mediocre at best, buuuuut....Superman smiles! Like he really, actually means it!

  15. #45
    Astonishing Member David Walton's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Charlus View Post
    The best movie of the last 25 years is an animated one, and it’s called Superman vs The Elite.
    100% agreed. If DC wants a darker live action Superman movie, this is the perfect template for it. One where Superman stands out as a light in the darkness rather than being consumed by it.

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