Children of Magneto, yes or no ?

[616MarvelYear is LeapYear]

May 4 1996 X-Men TAS S04E17 Family Ties starring Wanda, Pietro and Magneto.

[Zelena]

I read all…

Pietro is given less a hard time because he didn't say: "No more mutants" although he manipulated her sister to make HoM.
It will be impossible to agree on whether Wanda was responsible of her acts or not. There is no psychiatrist in MU and the successive writers do what they find interesting to narrate.
What I find ugly is the way Wanda is used as a scapegoat for whatever feelings the readers may have. It's a imaginary character, an easy target.

[Michael Watkins]

His predecessor did that and created a mutant clone of himself who later became the prime sinister who deseminated mutant DNA throughout his kingdom. Prime Sinisters aren't ubiquitous in their thoughts and personalities. A mutant Sinister very much is a mutant Sinister. And they did that to themselves with no input from Apocalypse.

read that aloud to yourself.

[Michael Watkins]

If these are legit questions, maybe you should reread the comics. It’s all there.

basically, you can't answer the questions. so you're going to punt.

[Beaubier]

basically, you can't answer the questions. so you're going to punt.

I can, I just don’t feel like summarizing multiple comics for you when you can easily look up summaries or read the actual material yourself.

[Michael Watkins]

From these latest batch of posts, I think we can all agree that there is a great deal of unresolved conflict between Max and the twins, which the fans see and respond to. It makes sense: they met him years after he’d not only given up on humanity and basic happiness, but had become very cruel towards his subordinates (Mastermind deserved it and more, but did Toad at that time deserve to wear a belt that let Magneto punished him whenever he felt like it?

yes, Toad deserved that and more. the Toad would have raped Wanda if he hadn't been afraid of Magneto; same with Mastermind. he's kind of a garbage person. if he had a chance to see more of the behind the scenes, i can almost guarantee that Pietro has struck Toad as well.

Astra claims he was abusive, but it sounds more like she tried to hit him up and got shut down, felt humiliated and left). And while it was clear he favored them and considered them essential to his plans, that didn’t stop him from being manipulative and callous to get them to stay at his side.

yes. that version of Magneto was a very one-dimensional villain. he was entirely evil with no depth. no background. no real end game. no face when you think about it. that all came much later.

Yes, sending hitmen to attack them in their sleep (but not telling the twins the attackers were under orders never to actually hurt them) is abusive even if Pietro doesn’t think so. As I recall, he was trying to justify doing much the same to the Avengers Academy kids, and Tigra had to point out that was not okay then and now.

Magneto didn't teach him that. that's who Pietro is at his core; as evidenced by his treatment of Luna. you know who never judged Luna for being human? Grampa Magneto. he loved that child from jump. he taught Wanda and Pietro to survive because the life they were living demanded that kind of preparedness. it was the action of a very old man whose mental health had deteriorated due to over exertion and recurring trauma. it's not like he was doing it to be cruel. he didn't want them to be victims like he had been. if the twins had remained after Anya's death, he probably would have been a harder/colder individual. he's been given several reasons to be paranoid over the decades. and this was the result.

The twins are supposed to be the same age as the 05, so I’m guessing they were around 12-14, even if in the original issues they all seem more like 17-19.

they are older than the 05. and that's if you don't factor in their time in suspended animation.

What then of his reaction to HoM? If it was outrage at being mind controlled, that’s pretty rich of him considering how he made an underage Wanda dance for his entertainment while mind controlling her. If it’s because he didn’t like that this was the one time where he didn’t like it being done in his name, that’s fair.

you keep saying underage as if it's what makes the action gross. but you're actually talking about a separate character. that version of Magneto, for all intents and purposes, died. he literally started over. you can judge him for everything that has happened during and post-Claremont. because he's a case of a character being remade w/ little respect to continuity. and it's one of the rare times that it worked out for the better. he's still a mutant terrorist. but he's not some wild eyed demented senior making women dance for him. there are dimensions to the character now. he's had a family. he's had familial bonds with the twins and Luna. he actually cares about the survival of mutant youth. he's quite easy to distinguish from the original series character. if Wanda can be given a pass for insanity, why not OG Magneto? he, arguably, suffered more than Wanda. and look at his eyes. that's mania...

Again, they could have made it so they were just simple people living simple lives, but no they had to be kings and queens of the world. Did it warrant Max murdering Pietro? At that point, the damage was mainly psychological as well as dragging the Avengers and X-Men into their family drama. Murder wasn’t called for.

again, the heroes came there to murder Magneto. he was fighting for his life because of something his sociopathic son had did. and Pietro had stolen his free will. can you really say what is and wasn't justified without having had that experience? consider that he's already experienced being buried alive with his family as a child, being forced to burn human bodies to survive, starvation, the death of his daughter, betrayal from his employers/the murder of his therapist, his wife abandoning him, being left in a vegetative state, multiple assassination attempts, and Moira MacTagger trying to tamper with his memories.

[Michael Watkins]

I can, I just don’t feel like summarizing multiple comics for you when you can easily look up summaries or read the actual material yourself.

so you want me to just read random comics until i come around to your way of thinking. yeah, i'm sure to spend a lot of time doing that.

[Beaubier]

so you want me to just read random comics until i come around to your way of thinking. yeah, i'm sure to spend a lot of time doing that.

Not come around to my way of thinking but actually comprehend the canon material. But if you don’t want to research your questions that’s your business. I don’t have time to post panels and detailed summaries to entertain you.

[Agent Z]

How anyone can seriously that Magneto wasn't abusive is completely beyond me.

[AbnormallyNormal]

Magneto cares for his family, noone can dispute this FACT. He was devastated when Wanda told him they weren't related even AFTER House of M/Decimation. Magneto the super pro mutant fanatic, was DEVASTATED that the character who did the MOST DAMAGE to mutantkind EVER, said she wasn't his daughter. But hey, he "just abused them" I guess... what do I know?

[hulkling]

Magneto cares for his family, noone can dispute this FACT. He was devastated when Wanda told him they weren't related even AFTER House of M/Decimation. Magneto the super pro mutant fanatic, was DEVASTATED that the character who did the MOST DAMAGE to mutantkind EVER, said she wasn't his daughter. But hey, he "just abused them" I guess... what do I know?

You are talking about the moment in the Axis event right ? Magneto was inverted. He was exactly the opposite of what he is really. If he was devastated then that means that he really doesn’t care at all.

[adamTPTK]

Would Max have treated them like that if he knew the twins were his children? Well, despite what Ultimates says, I don’t believe so. He might still have been harsh, but not to the point it got to. What then of his reaction to HoM? If it was outrage at being mind controlled, that’s pretty rich of him considering how he made an underage Wanda dance for his entertainment while mind controlling her. If it’s because he didn’t like that this was the one time where he didn’t like it being done in his name, that’s fair. Again, they could have made it so they were just simple people living simple lives, but no they had to be kings and queens of the world. Did it warrant Max murdering Pietro? At that point, the damage was mainly psychological as well as dragging the Avengers and X-Men into their family drama. Murder wasn’t called for. I can only speculate this was anger born of years of hurt and frustration at Pietro arguing and fighting him instead of accepting his offer of ruling the world as father and son. And then turns around and makes House of M. The straw that broke the camel’s back, perhaps.

I'm not sure how Ultimate Magneto is relevant tho. A completely different character that has no redeemable qualities.

Everything that happened during the SA days, I think I'm rolling with Claremont's explanation. It was unending traumas and discordant usage of powers that snapped him into that version. He was a completely different person before his experiences finally twisted him into that bug-eyed madman.

[Michael Watkins]

How anyone can seriously that Magneto wasn't abusive is completely beyond me.

How anyone can seriously believe that Pietro didn't deserve to have his head taken off is completely beyond me. even Peter Parker was ready to hurt him.

[hulkling]

How anyone can seriously believe that Pietro didn't deserve to have his head taken off is completely beyond me. even Peter Parker was ready to hurt him.

Probably what every abuser says to their victims.

[Michael Watkins]

Probably what every abuser says to their victims.

Pietro never said it to Luna. it's kind of what Wanda said to Rogue.