All-purpose news and politics thread: Two Steps Beyond!(Part II)

[SuperiorIronman]

The true irony of the SEAL team debacle is that the retired operative who still consults with the Department of Defense didn't want his name or face revealed, but to the guys in an active warzone and are being tracked by Russian and Syrian forces? Nah, fuck it their good. 20 dollars on that operative being a Trump supporter.

Also, there may not be a rule over it, but rule of thumb is that you never I.D your spies or secret agents. The Troops that posed with Trump should know better, Trump should know better, the military as a whole should know better. You don't do that to protect your agents in the event of capture, you do that to protect their families and potentially even the agent themselves. I know the military is full of a bunch of meatheads but I didn't expect them to fuck that up. To think that when Trump does do something right, he litterally endangers the families of these operatives, the fucking mongoloid.

It's like the Nuclear football all over again.

[Farealmer]

To think that when Trump does do something right, he litterally endangers the families of these operatives, the fucking mongoloid.

Why to people think this is an acceptable insult?

[Iron Maiden]

I'm just mystified that someone of high rank let the location of those Navy Seals be broadcast. One hopes that they've moved to another location by now.

On another note, I wonder if Trump plans to send more units down to the border. smh

[PaulBullion]

Why to people think this is an acceptable insult?

It really isn't.

[Mister Mets]

Children kept in cages by the US government have died, Mets. CHILDREN. Caged like animals, for the crime of being an 'illegal' human. Who else is to blame for their deaths?

Oh, I know. Their parents, for bringing them here, right? Those irresponsible parents, how dare they bring their child when they flee their country for the dream of a better life! THEY must be responsible for their childrens' deaths, right?

C
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So far, it's two. Is two dead kids in government custody not enough for you to finally recognize how monstrous this whole situation is? How many dead kids is it gonna take before you stop blindly supporting the party responsible for the policies that have led to two CHILDREN dying in cages? Five? Ten? A hundred?At what point are there enough dead kids on your government's hands that it matters to you?

Of course, it'll be said that I am too emotional and therefore, my opinion is invalid, because it's tainted by emotion. Well, I'm sorry that the death of children in US custody makes me emotional. What a terrible person I am...

Accuracy is important in these discussions. You have a clear preference about who you want to be at fault, but the facts aren't necessarily going to follow. At this point, how would we know that what happened wasn't the fault of the parents?

The moment I said "letting them die" - that is plural. Do you need a nap? Some sugar? A soul?

The accuracy of that statement still requires the US government to be responsible for the death of the Guatemalan boy, and for there to be sufficient evidence about this.

So I can still ask how you could be so sure that the government's actions led to the boy's death.

Let’s call a spade a spade. Right wingers don’t give a fuck because those kids have brown skin, plain and simple. If the kids who died were white, the howls of outrage from bleeding heart conservatives could be heard on the International Space Station. Otherwise it’s crickets, or worse, indifference.

I believe you are mistaken in your understanding of American politics.

[Mister Mets]

At New York Magazine, Jonathan Chait looks at Bernie VS Beto.

Indeed, I think the online warriors of the Bernie movement are getting too little credit, and their mainstream liberal antagonists would benefit from a better understanding of their motives and thinking.

The Sanders partisans who are attacking O’Rourke — like Zaid Jilani, David Sirota, Branko Marcetic, Elizabeth Bruenig — are not representative of Sanders voters as a whole. This distinction is the key to deciphering the whole episode. Sanders attracts the intense support of a small left-wing intellectual vanguard who see American politics in fundamentally different terms than most Democrats do. The primary struggle in American politics as they see it is not between liberalism and conservatism, but between socialism and capitalism.

Sanders labels himself as a socialist and frames his rhetoric in Marxian class terms, which sets him apart from other Democrats. (Even a progressive like Elizabeth Warren calls herself “a capitalist to my bones.”) Socialists — at least those who aren’t willing to settle for the incremental advances traditionally held out by liberal Democrats as their only option — see Sanders’s presidential candidacy as uniquely compelling. The struggle between Sanders and other Democrats strikes them as far more significant than the contest between the Democrats and the Republicans.

The voters who pulled the lever for Sanders, by contrast, are ideologically indistinguishable from the rest of the party. Among the minority of voters who identified as “very liberal,” the most left-wing choice, Sanders and Clinton performed about equally. In 2016, Sanders voters actually had more conservative views on economic inequality and changes to Social Security and Medicare than Clinton voters did.

Sanders built most of his support on personal contrasts rather than ideology. While Clinton was mired in scandals over fundraising, speaking fees, and the use of a personal email server, her opponent presented an earnest, scandal-free profile. Sanders dominated Clinton among young, white, and male voters.

The rise of Beto O’Rourke poses an obvious threat. The Texas congressman has replicated aspects of Sanders’s appeal — his positivity and refusal to accept PAC money — while exceeding it in some ways. Sanders is charismatic in an unconventional way, the slovenly and cranky but somewhat lovable old uncle, while O’Rourke projects a classic handsome, toothy, Kennedy-esque charm that reliably makes Democrats swoon. Hard-core loyalists find the contrast irksome. “Reading Karl Marx is cool,” said Nomiki Konst, a Sanders loyalist and candidate for New York City public advocate, to NBC. “Doing a livestream while you’re doing your laundry is a gimmick.” The comment sums up the left’s well-grounded fear that Sanders’s hard-core ideological appeal can be easily disarmed with personal charisma.

And while O’Rourke has yet to decide on a presidential campaign, and would have to overcome an enormous field if he does, the Sandernistas are hardly paranoid to discern the kind of groundswell that could quickly propel O’Rourke to the front of the pack. Former Obama strategist and current Pod Save America host Dan Pfeiffer wrote a piece urging O’Rourke to run (without endorsing him). O’Rourke reportedly met with Obama, who favored him with public praise. “What I liked most about his race was that it didn’t feel constantly poll-tested,” Obama said. “It felt as if he based his statements and his positions on what he believed.”

What Obama is describing here is O’Rourke’s ability to speak naturally and with apparent conviction — one never knows if a politician is expressing genuine conviction or just performing it well — without taking hard-left policy stances. O’Rourke’s short career has allowed him to avoid being pinned down on every item in the party platform. He generally occupies the center of the Democratic Party, and often expresses broad sympathy for left-wing policy goals while suggesting he favors a more pragmatic alternative. On health care, he advocates “achieving universal health care coverage — whether it be through a single-payer system, a dual system, or otherwise — so that we can ensure everyone is able to see a provider when it will do the most good and will deliver health care in the most affordable, effective way possible.”

One of the deeper strategic goals of the left is to equate progressive maximalism with authenticity, like Sanders did. They want candidates who take uncompromising left-wing positions to be seen as authentic, and candidates who adopt more moderate lines to be seen as calculating and phony. The socialist left will attack any non-Sanders candidate, but O’Rourke is especially dangerous to their project precisely because of his Obama-like personal appeal.

The frequently invoked comparisons between O’Rourke and the 44th president explain both O’Rourke’s wide appeal within the party ranks and the mistrust he has inspired on the far left. Socialists generally regard Obama as a failure; Sanders often critiqued Obama implicitly, sometimes explicitly.

O’Rourke’s burgeoning image as the next Obama is the very reason socialists reject him. “I think they are suspicious of Beto because he has taken oil and gas money, he’s becoming the darling of big donors, and Obama likes him,” says historian Michael Kazin. “Beto is a lot like Obama, true;” writes Breunig, “it’s perhaps time for left-leaning Democrats to realize that may not be a good thing.” Of course, given that 95 percent of Democrats approve of Obama, this message has fairly limited utility as a line of attack.

Nate Silver wonders if Sanders partisans going after Beto may be a misfire, elevating the reputation of someone whose qualifications are suspect.

I'm not totally sure I buy this. One of the big takeaways from the fact that these very minor skirmishes between some Sanders fans and Beto have gotten so much attention that both the media and mainstream Democrats are very thirsty for Beto-related content

In other words, it's tended to confirm O'Rourke's status as a top-tier contender, and may even (I wouldn't go overboard because this is all pretty minor IMO) have elevated him. So, if it was strategic, it wasn't a very good strategy!

Chait suggests Beto's already top-tier.

I think the thirst for Beto content you describe is an indication he was already a top-tier contender (able to break through a crowded market for attention.) They're not wrong in seeing a need to shoot him down early.

Nate Silver considers the best strategy against Beto, in the context of a primary.

I see where you're coming from. The risk IMO is that the primary is essentially a series of periods of heightened scrutiny for various candidates at various times, and *surviving* one of those periods of scrutiny tends to make you stronger (see e.g. Trump in 2015/16).

Also, my guess is that the biggest challenge Beto will face, in the context of contemporary Democratic politics, is that he's an (arguably) underqualified white guy in a field with lots of traditionally qualified minority and/or women candidates...

But that's a hard argument for the Bernie folks to make, since Bernie is also a white guy and one hasn't touted political experience to be an asset.

So instead we get arguments like "Beto is the new Obama" which is pretty much an own-goal.

[jetengine]

I believe you are mistaken in your understanding of American politics.

The more you treat us like Idiots Mets the less likely we are to believe your bullshit.

[BeastieRunner]

Mueller obtained a nude selfie of somebody implicated in the Trump investigation. But no info yet who it is, or who it was sent to.

Judge ruled it a matter of "national security" so it has to be somebody high up. Hopefully not President Mushroom. It's probably a dick pic, too. Trump doesn't have any women in compromising national security positions. My money is on a Russian prostitute taking a nude selfie with Trump in the background at Moscow for kompromat.

EDIT: Oh shit, it appears to be the pee pee tape.

[BeastieRunner]

Beastie's Cartoons of the Week:

[PaulBullion]

Judge ruled it a matter of "national security" so it has to be somebody high up. Hopefully not President Mushroom. It's probably a dick pic, too. Trump doesn't have any women in compromising national security positions. My money is on a Russian prostitute taking a nude selfie with Trump in the background at Moscow for kompromat.

EDIT: Oh shit, it appears to be the pee pee tape.

Where do you get that?

And if I remember the Steele Dossier correctly, the pee tape is not about Trump peeing. It's about him watching 2 Russian hookers pee on the bed Obama had slept in. Because he is a fucking, degenerate teenager in the body of a bloated zombie.

[Tami]

A Russian bank gave Marine Le Pen’s party a loan. Then weird things began happening.

PARIS — When French politician Marine Le Pen needed cash for her far-right party, an obscure Russian bank agreed to help.

Four years later, the bank has gone bust. The owner is facing a warrant for his arrest. Former Russian military officers are demanding money. And the party’s treasurer is sending off some $165,000 every few months to a woman in Moscow, unsure of where the payments ultimately will go.

The money failed to deliver Le Pen the French presidency in last year’s election, denying the Kremlin a powerful ally in the heart of Europe. Instead, the 9.4 million-euro loan, then worth $12.2 million, dragged her party into the shadowy underworld of Russian cross-border finance, putting it in league with people accused of having ties to Russian organized crime, money laundering and military operations.

“It was in the interest of Russia to support Marine Le Pen,” said Aymeric Chauprade, a member of the European Parliament who advised Le Pen on foreign policy before leaving her party. “Every time you have a political leader who says we should change our policy regarding Russia . . . they are interested in supporting him.”

[Tazirai]

At New York Magazine, Jonathan Chait looks at Bernie VS Beto.



Nate Silver wonders if Sanders partisans going after Beto may be a misfire, elevating the reputation of someone whose qualifications are suspect.



Chait suggests Beto's already top-tier.



Nate Silver considers the best strategy against Beto, in the context of a primary.

The Bernie vs Beto thing is a made up "Scandal" by disengenous actors like Jonathan Martin and such.
Beto is a better candidate than Trump. But Beto being above scrutiny about his actual record is BS.

The Neera Tandens of the world love shitting on Bernie or his "Bros/Sistahs" anyway and a few months ago, the only place you saw Beto was on the Young Turks. But now that his record is out, the Establishment Love them some Beto. Whereas before November, nobody in the MSM knew his name.

[jetengine]

What is it with Russia ? They never seem to learn that the more they meddle to 'ensure their safety' the more they ensure everyone wants to destroy them.

[PaulBullion]

What is it with Russia ? They never seem to learn that the more they meddle to 'ensure their safety' the more they ensure everyone wants to destroy them.

Wait, what?

[BeastieRunner]

Where do you get that?

And if I remember the Steele Dossier correctly, the pee tape is not about Trump peeing. It's about him watching 2 Russian hookers pee on the bed Obama had slept in. Because he is a fucking, degenerate teenager in the body of a bloated zombie.

The Mueller investigation now involves a nude selfie.

A New Report Puts Michael Cohen’s Cell Phone Near Prague: If true, one of the most explosive parts of the Steele dossier might be confirmed.

Cell Phone Signal Confirms Parts of Disputed Trump-Russia Dossier.

It's beginning to be confirmed via Cohen's denials. Time will tell but it does appear to be kompromat. Maybe not the golden shower or watching hookers pee on a bed, but it's some form of blackmail.

What is it with Russia ? They never seem to learn that the more they meddle to 'ensure their safety' the more they ensure everyone wants to destroy them.

They lost a lot of land/resources after 2 hot world wars and 1.5 cold wars. Russia wants it all back. And they're eyeing stealing the DPRK under China's nose because of all the resources tied up in the mountains there.