Ororo Munroe: Storm Appreciation 2018

[Crimz]

question? are mm and Franklin power physical or divine in application? no matter how powerful it is, if it simply physical in its application it wont affect adversary just as he explained to the xmen.

That has nothing to do with the point Stormphoenix is making. Take away that immunity (which we don't know the limits of) and Adversary isn't that impressive. We are talking about raw power, which both Franklin and Molecule Man eclipse Adversary in. Goddess Storm beating Adversary does not mean she could even touch The Griever, it's apples and oranges.

It's like Pokemon match-ups. A level 50 Ghost type Pokemon can't be affected by a level 100 fighting type, but that doesn't mean they are as strong as them.

Storm has shown nothing that puts her on the same playing field as Franklin, Molecule Man, and The Griever.

[butterflykyss]

What the hell is going on with the Adversary, Roma and Molecule Man talk?

hi there beloved. it stemmed from the upcoming fantastic four issue where storm will be appearing. long short the question was could goddess storm do anything against MM and Franklin Richards.

[butterflykyss]

That has nothing to do with the point Stormphoenix is making. Take away that immunity (which we don't know the limits of) and Adversary isn't that impressive. We are talking about raw power, which both Franklin and Molecule Man eclipse Adversary in. Goddess Storm beating Adversary does not mean she could even touch The Griever, it's apples and oranges.

It's like Pokemon match-ups. A level 50 Ghost type Pokemon can't be affected by a level 100 fighting type, but that doesn't mean they are as strong as them.

Storm has shown nothing that puts her on the same playing field as Franklin, Molecule Man, and The Griever.

but it has everything to do with it when you think about it. I'm not arguing that the feats are not impressive. they are. but if you have a character that has a feat that despite how powerful it is won't affect the other character it doesnt mean anything at the end of it all. and we do know the limits. Roma expressed that he cant be destroyed as the universe and life itself needs him. it's all in the scan I provided.

goddess storm was described as a bigger god than adversary. if the powers that griever has wouldnt affect adversary in any manner one could argue the same is true for goddess storm.

and I would disagree with you her being able to defeat a divine entity that is a universal threat described as not being able to be destroyed I think puts her on a greater playing field. and lets not forget storm herself has been a vessel of eternity and defeated trion, as well as heal their dimension. dont sleep on her.

therefore that is why I asked for a scan showing their powers can affect, hurt or harm divine creatures like oshtur, bast, living tribunal, etc.

[Devaishwarya]

What the hell is going on with the Adversary, Roma and Molecule Man talk?

SHHHHHH!!! This is the most action Storm and this thread has seen in weeks. The kids are making up for lost time and opportunity.

[stormphoenix]

I conceded roma because I actually researched what she is canonically speaking. she is the daughter of Merlin, so though she has the title of a goddess, she isnt one akin to how adversary is. this doesn't mean she isnt powerful but the way in which she can be hurt and killed is different from adversary.

and maybe this is where my understanding of energy is different. cosmic energy, though more powerful than let's say atmospheric energy such as lightning, is still physical in nature. ororo utilized cosmic energy when she manipulated the energy of the galatic core. so that is the point I'm making cosmic energy though super powerful is still phsyi al in nature.

are you saying divine energy is the same as cosmic or not as strong as cosmic forces?

Let me be clear: It seems that Marvel believes that Cosmic Energy has different levels. The people I mentioned their power is strong enough to Rival or Surpass Divine Energy. What Entities have Divine Power???? Sky-Fathers and Hell Lords. What is Adversary? A God of Chaos. That right there gives you the power Gap between Gods/Hell Lords and High Ranked Cosmic Abstract. If Goddess Storm beat Adversary a God of Chaos. You can actually make the argument Goddess Storm is possibly on the Level of a Sky Father status. I say that because the ONLY way to beat a Demon of Adversary or Mephistos category is either your a Sky-Father OR a High ranked powerful Cosmic Entity or Greater.

Now when you put Adversary vs Molecule Man or Franklin Richards Unfortunately their powers go Above that of Hell Lords and Sky-Fathers and most Cosmic Abstracts even above The Living Tribunal that's why those two are SO much a threat. I will wager that Adversary could beat Galactus, but people like The Tribunal and Eternity and MM? He would lose.

IF you can show me scans or feats of Adversary beating a Cosmic Abstract in the Cosmic Hierarchy I will concede. But all i'm saying is we have NO feats to even guage that Adversary is remotely a threat to HIGH power Cosmic Abstract. Is Adversary a powerful God of Chaos YES he was ripping Dimensions and Reality, but that doesn't me he stronger than MM who in his earlier days was destroying more than ONE dimension at a time and causing Multiversal destruction LOL.

Well i'm done you said your piece I said mine all we can do is wait for Storm's Solo to prove that Goddess Storm is on Sky-Father level

[butterflykyss]

Let me be clear: It seems that Marvel believes that Cosmic Energy has different levels. The people I mentioned their power is strong enough to Rival or Surpass Divine Energy. What Entities have Divine Power???? Sky-Fathers and Hell Lords. What is Adversary? A God of Chaos. That right there gives you the power Gap between Gods/Hell Lords and High Ranked Cosmic Abstract. If Goddess Storm beat Adversary a God of Chaos. You can actually make the argument Goddess Storm is possibly on the Level of a Sky Father status. I say that because the ONLY way to beat a Demon of Adversary or Mephistos category is either your a Sky-Father OR a High ranked powerful Cosmic Entity or Greater.

Now when you put Adversary vs Molecule Man or Franklin Richards Unfortunately their powers go Above that of Hell Lords and Sky-Fathers and most Cosmic Abstracts even above The Living Tribunal that's why those two are SO much a threat. I will wager that Adversary could beat Galactus, but people like The Tribunal and Eternity and MM? He would lose.

IF you can show me scans or feats of Adversary beating a Cosmic Abstract in the Cosmic Hierarchy I will concede. But if you say he can ok fine i;m not going to change your mind.

Well i'm done you said your piece I said mine all we can do is wait for Storm's Solo to prove that Goddess Storm is on Sky-Father level

you never answered my question though. is divine energy the same and cosmic energy and if not which is greater? has beings who utilize cosmic energy been able to destroy and/or defeat and divine creatures like bast, oshtur, etc.?

and you seem to know more about these tiers than I do so I will concede. not that I agree in any fashion. how it works to me, cosmic energy is a higher form of physical natural energy (as I mentioned storm utilized this when in the galatic core). so despite how powerful a cosmic being may be their powers should not affect divine creatures unless it has some power of spirit intertwined as described in uncanny 227.

[butterflykyss]

at any rate, goddess storm is not appearing in fantastic four so it's all irrelevant. I'm just so amazed at this conversation now. rewind this 5 years ago and we would have been called fanboys for ever calling storm a real goddess and look at where we are now. it's now canon that she is an ACTUAL goddess. its way too early to know all of what she can or cant do but I'm so excited to see what is in store for her.

[stormphoenix]

and you seem to know more about these tiers than I do so I will concede. not that I agree in any fashion. how it works to me, cosmic energy is a higher form of physical natural energy (as I mentioned storm utilized this when in the galatic core). so despite how powerful a cosmic being may be their powers should not affect divine creatures unless it has some power of spirit intertwined as described in uncanny 227.

I enjoy the Cosmic Aspect of Marvel I don't know EVERYTHING about it, but I know enough to hold my own. But I understand what you mean I get it and you may be right it should harm Divine beings, but apparently Marvel doesn't think so. It's really dependent on your place in the Cosmic Hierarchy.

I don't care if you concede or not I just want to help you understand there are power difference in these characters. Becuase I kid you not there is someone out there that if you made the same claim today they would probably tear you apart. LOL peoples are vicious when it comes to Cosmic Heroes *Cough* Thor *Cough* Silver Surfer *Cough* Thanos *Cough* LOL

I'm just trying to help you Kyss that's all.....

you never answered my question though. is divine energy the same and cosmic energy and if not which is greater? has beings who utilize cosmic energy been able to destroy and/or defeat and divine creatures like bast, oshtur, etc.?

Depends on the Character. Back to My Example: Galactus(Cosmic) fought Mephisto(Divine) in HIS realm and Mephisto was toying with him. Galactus(Cosmic) Fought Odin(Divine) and Odin was laying the smack down. Galactus isn't exactly high up on the food chain, but he is up there. It depends on the God and Entity in question. Now replace Galactus and put Eternity or the Tribunal and do you think the same outcome would happen???? No.

[butterflykyss]

I enjoy the Cosmic Aspect of Marvel I don't know EVERYTHING about it, but I know enough to hold my own. But I understand what you mean I get it and you may be right it should harm Divine beings, but apparently Marvel doesn't think so. It's really dependent on your place in the Cosmic Hierarchy.

you're saying I'm right that I may be right cosmic power shouldnt be able to harm divine beings? your point is cosmic beings can harm divine beings.

Depends on the Character. Back to My Example: Galactus(Cosmic) fought Mephisto(Divine) in HIS realm and Mephisto was toying with him. Galactus(Cosmic) Fought Odin(Divine) and Odin was laying the smack down. Galactus isn't exactly high up on the food chain, but he is up there. It depends on the God and Entity in question. Now replace Galactus and put Eternity or the Tribunal and do you think the same outcome would happen???? No.

eternity seems to be a cosmic being who encompasses divine attributes. again divine creatures can be affected by power both spiritual and physical based. and I'm not saying adversary csn beat eternity but I'm most certain franklin and mm cant and therefore I'm not certain they could beat adversary as well as they both are mortal beings.

[stormphoenix]

you're saying I'm right that I may be right cosmic power shouldnt be able to harm divine beings? your point is cosmic beings can harm divine beings.

I agree with you to a certain extent. I believe it all depends on how powerful you are in Cosmic Energy and Divine Energy and your place in the Grand Hierarchy of Power. If your above Galactus and close to Eternity than Yes hurting Divine people like Mephisto, Nightmare, Black Heart,Odin and Zeus should be no problem. But if your below Galactus like a Celestial or a Herald you have no business fighting a Divine Entity.

eternity seems to be a cosmic being who encompasses divine attributes. again divine creatures can be affected by power both spiritual and physical based. and I'm not saying adversary csn beat eternity but I'm most certain franklin and mm cant and therefore I'm not certain they could beat adversary as well as they both are mortal beings.

And that's your problem your stuck at looking at the MORTAL side of Molecule Man and Franklin Richards. They aren't even Mortals per say anymore. Owen Reece has consistently in all variations has proven he is above Eternity and The Living Tribunal.
Here is a scan that says Owen Reece(Molecule Man) is above these Cosmic Abstracts
O81Gwh1.jpg

Franklin is on a whole different level of power like Owen is. That's fine if you think a Divine Creature should not be harmed by mere mortals, but they can. Their power transcends BEYOND that of Eternity and Tribunal themselves. There isn't anything Adversary can do against MM and Franklin sadly to say.

Adversary is just a God of Chaos nothing, more nothing less and his power is no higher and no lower. If your trying to make this argument for Adversary than the same can be said for Odi for he is a Divine creature whom fought to a stand still with Galactus. Mephisto, Divine creature gets weak when he leaves his own realm.

[Crimz]

And that's your problem your stuck at looking at the MORTAL side of Molecule Man and Franklin Richards. They aren't even Mortals per say anymore. Owen Reece has consistently in all variations has proven he is above Eternity and The Living Tribunal.
Here is a scan that says Owen Reece(Molecule Man) is above these Cosmic Abstracts
O81Gwh1.jpg

Franklin is on a whole different level of power like Owen is. That's fine if you think a Divine Creature should not be harmed by mere mortals, but they can. Their power transcends BEYOND that of Eternity and Tribunal themselves. There isn't anything Adversary can do against MM and Franklin sadly to say.

Adversary is just a God of Chaos nothing, more nothing less and his power is no higher and no lower. If your trying to make this argument for Adversary than the same can be said for Odi for he is a Divine creature whom fought to a stand still with Galactus. Mephisto, Divine creature gets weak when he leaves his own realm.

Plus Franklin is practically the God of countless universes and he beat Mephisto in Mephisto's own realm.

[butterflykyss]

And that's your problem your stuck at looking at the MORTAL side of Molecule Man and Franklin Richards. They aren't even Mortals per say anymore. Owen Reece has consistently in all variations has proven he is above Eternity and The Living Tribunal.
Here is a scan that says Owen Reece(Molecule Man) is above these Cosmic Abstracts
O81Gwh1.jpg

Franklin is on a whole different level of power like Owen is. That's fine if you think a Divine Creature should not be harmed by mere mortals, but they can. Their power transcends BEYOND that of Eternity and Tribunal themselves. There isn't anything Adversary can do against MM and Franklin sadly to say.

Adversary is just a God of Chaos nothing, more nothing less and his power is no higher and no lower. If your trying to make this argument for Adversary than the same can be said for Odi for he is a Divine creature whom fought to a stand still with Galactus. Mephisto, Divine creature gets weak when he leaves his own realm.

and what can MM or Franklin do to Adversary? you are making good points but I'm not seeing any evidence that they can harm divine creatures, especially one who is said cannot be destroyed. And adversary power is not stronger in any different realm that I am aware. to compare him to memphisto whose power is dependent on the realm he is isnt comparable.

[butterflykyss]

thank you to everyone who has signed the petition I really appreciate your support. continue to share. I'm hoping we can get to 100 signatures by monday!!!


https://www.change.org/p/marvel-marv...dari-yao-4ever

[stormphoenix]

and what can MM or Franklin do to Adversary? you are making good points but I'm not seeing any evidence that they can harm divine creatures, especially one who is said cannot be destroyed. And adversary power is not stronger in any different realm that I am aware. to compare him to memphisto whose power is dependent on the realm he is isnt comparable.

For Starters they can Banish Adversary to whatever Dimension they feel like creating. Or wiping him out from Existence Or completely take away his Divine Powers. Again, Divine Energy and Cosmic Energy means nothing to MM or Franklin for their power goes BEYOND that. I compare Adversary to Mephisto because they are both seen as equals(Even though Adversary is not one of the Hell Lords) I find them Equal.

Plus Franklin is practically the God of countless universes and he beat Mephisto in Mephisto's own realm.

Really??? Hmm didn't know that.

Edit: I just looked that up. WOW he sure did he was a child and zap the crap out of Mephisto....

[stormphoenix]

A better fight would be Adversary vs Glactus