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  1. #1
    Ultimate Member Last Son of Krypton's Avatar
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    Lightbulb Your DC-Only controversial opinions (part II)...

    Do you think Batman Forever is better than The Dark Knight? For you, Grant Morrison is a mediocre writer? Martian Manhunter is the best character DC have?
    Post your controversial opinions about everything DC related... characters, authors, past and present run, movies and TV series...

  2. #2
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    None of DC's fictional American cities have any distinct identity. They're better off just using real cities.

  3. #3
    Astonishing Member kjn's Avatar
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    Batman is a boring character. The main star of the Batman line is the city of Gotham.

  4. #4
    Extraordinary Member SiegePerilous02's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Agent Z View Post
    None of DC's fictional American cities have any distinct identity. They're better off just using real cities.
    If the fictional city settings aren't detrimental to the story, why would they be better off in real cities? What would it change?

  5. #5
    Extraordinary Member SiegePerilous02's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Agent Z View Post
    None of DC's fictional American cities have any distinct identity. They're better off just using real cities.
    If the fictional city settings aren't detrimental to the story, why would they be better off in real cities? What would it change?

  6. #6
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    Quote Originally Posted by SiegePerilous02 View Post
    If the fictional city settings aren't detrimental to the story, why would they be better off in real cities? What would it change?
    It would remove a pointless aspect of the story and writers could actually show they can do research when it comes to writing about real life cities.

    I would also say them not being distinct in identity is a detriment to the story.

  7. #7
    Boisterously Confused
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    Quote Originally Posted by Agent Z View Post
    None of DC's fictional American cities have any distinct identity. They're better off just using real cities.
    On the other hand, Marvel's Hell's Kitchen has an identity, but is now a fictional city, since New York's crime rate is lower than Memphis'.

  8. #8
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    Two of my favourite Batman stories are "The Jungle-Cat Queen" and "Daughter of the Demon." Remarkably similar in plot, even though separated by two decades and in different art styles. But the first story doesn't take place in Gotham City at all, rather on a mysterious island, and the second only takes place for a short bit in the Batcave at the beginning (which is debatably in Gotham City) before trotting the globe to exotic locations in India.

    Those kinds of stories are just as much Batman to me as the stories set in Gotham. Some of the best early stories were not in Gotham either--the encounter with the Monk in 'TEC 31 and 32, where the Dark Knight trots the globe from Manhattan to Paris to Hungary; and the encounter with the Duc D’Orterre in ‘TEC 34, that unfolds in Paris.
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  9. #9
    Moderator Frontier's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Agent Z View Post
    None of DC's fictional American cities have any distinct identity. They're better off just using real cities.
    I dunno, I think Gotham and Metropolis have grown to have pretty distinct identities into and of themselves, and there've been writers who've been able to make Central, Star, Opal, and Keystone their own unique identities as well.

    Of course, they take inspiration from real life cities, but I think that's understandable.
    Quote Originally Posted by kjn View Post
    Batman is a boring character. The main star of the Batman line is the city of Gotham.
    I think if you're doing it right a hero's city should feel like as much of a character or star as the actual hero.

  10. #10
    Astonishing Member superduperman's Avatar
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    Grant Morrison IS just a mediocre writer. And Martian Manhunter may not be DC's best character but he certainly doesn't get enough credit.

    Some of these are repeats of stuff I said on the other thread but I feel like going over them again.

    Superman should have at least some powers from day one on Earth. It's just weird to think of him as an ordinary kid.

    Cyborg should be a Teen Titan first before joining the JL.

    The Nolan movies are overrated and everyone took the wrong lesson away from them.

    There are too many Green Lanterns.

    Damien is a bad fit for Robin. Batman shouldn't have to keep looking over his shoulder hoping his sidekick doesn't kill someone.

    DC should do a book about the multiverse where each story tells stories from a different Earth.

    Supergirl and Superman should be on the Arrowverse Earth.

    The Injustice universe is the most stable one DC has. And the "good" Injustice Earth is probably better than the mainstream Earth.
    Last edited by superduperman; 08-05-2018 at 08:54 AM.
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  11. #11
    Astonishing Member superduperman's Avatar
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    Can we please do something about this double post problem? It keeps happening.
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  12. #12
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    Silver Age revanchism may have helped Geoff Johns resurrect and reinvigorate the Green Lantern franchise, but it's behind the fall of the Superman books, and in general the whole thing where creators hold up the Silver Age as some kind of shining era for DC has caused more harm than good; they convinced themselves that old iconography and an old status quo was more valuable than good writing.

    Superman was still going strong through the 90's and early 00's, but once they started convincing themselves that the problem was the Post-Crisis continuity, they began slowly wrecking the franchise bit by bit. Some of it was totally understandable; a Kryptonian Supergirl is an easier sell. But each time they tried to revamp Superman and neglected the actual momentum of the previous stories, they damaged the brand. They then somehow convinced themselves that it wasn't their mistake for mucking around with the storylines, but instead that the character still wants Silver Age enough. So they went full bore back to the Silver Age, and even with Geoff Johns working his magic, it wasn't a long term solution. So they went further, and used a cosmic retcon to break up the marriage... And found that, nope, that didn't help either, and at the same time Grant Morrison was proving that his writing skills were good enough to rework even old Golden Age concepts into a successful story, the Superman office was sending writers running away from DC because they wouldn't get on board.

    And look at Flash; arguably the book was never stronger than when Geoff Johns was writing Wally West using Mark Waid's toys. Bringing Barry back did nothing for the brand but end up making it vulnerable to marketing declaring Barry the only viable Flash, causing the mess that fractured the fandom. And it's not like Aquaman really took off from Silver Age tropes; its standing was resurrected because, again, Johns as a writer is good, not because "Steve Rogers in a swimsuit" is an iconic look.
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  13. #13
    Extraordinary Member SiegePerilous02's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Agent Z View Post
    It would remove a pointless aspect of the story and writers could actually show they can do research when it comes to writing about real life cities.

    I would also say them not being distinct in identity is a detriment to the story.
    Gotham and Metropolis are generally agreed to have distinct personalities. We have a poster in this thread who said Gotham has more personality than the title character. (Which I don't agree with either)

    We have had superheroes set in real cities in DC and it hasn't lead to anything special. Why is building a fictional world pointless? You might as well call Kings Landing, Sunnydale, Twin Peaks and others pointless as well.
    Last edited by SiegePerilous02; 08-05-2018 at 09:20 AM.

  14. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by SiegePerilous02 View Post
    Gotham and Metropolis are generally agreed to have distinct personalities. We have a poster in this thread who said Gotham has more personality than the title character. (Which I don't agree with either)

    We have had superheroes set in real cities in DC and it hasn't lead to anything special. Why is building a fictional world pointless? You might as well call Kings Landing, Sunnydale, and others pointless as well.
    King's Landing I'll give you. With Sunnydale, nothing about it other than the Hellmouth seemed to be set it apart from any other small town in the U.S seen in t.v. shows and movies.

    None of DC's fictional cities have stood out for the most part. Can you tell me what was so special about say, Star City, that makes it more necessary than Seattle? Using real life places is just as valid in building a fictional world and having real life places fit into your world is a feat in and of itself.

  15. #15
    Extraordinary Member SiegePerilous02's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Agent Z View Post
    King's Landing I'll give you. With Sunnydale, nothing about it other than the Hellmouth seemed to be set it apart from any other small town in the U.S seen in t.v. shows and movies.

    None of DC's fictional cities have stood out for the most part. Can you tell me what was so special about say, Star City, that makes it more necessary than Seattle? Using real life places is just as valid in building a fictional world and having real life places fit into your world is a feat in and of itself.
    Yet Sunnydale being fictional did not prevent the show from getting a fan base and being big pop culture icon. There is also no way of knowing a real town would have made the writing better or given the show higher ratings, or allowed for better writing. The Hellmouth is pretty big deal, it's the thing that allowed for literally all the "teen issues wrapped in monstrous metaphors" story telling.

    Using real life cities can work just as well, bit I still don't see how they lead to anything better. Marvel works well with New York, Batman works well in Gotham, Superman works well in Metropolis, etc. Why would Seattle be a draw for Green Arrow comics any more than Star City?

    Meanwhile Wonder Woman hops around to many real cities and none of them have lead to anything special. Because the very fictional Themyscira is way more important, and her mortal cast can be moved anywhere and you get the same results.

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