Your DC-Only controversial opinions (part II)...

[LifeIsILL]

And the DCAU wasn’t perfect like a lot of the fanboys act like it is. A lot of characters were straight up butchered for simplicity (cough cough Sinestro)!

Justice League Animated really bothered me, I think most of it was simplified and it sucked. Yeah the comics may have been confusing but you actually felt like you knew the characters whether it's in Justice League International or JLA. And the villains were powerful as all hell, which is what it should have been like. Batman can't just waltz in and defeat them with his "plan".

And most of the DC Animated movies suck too.

[phonogram12]

Ivan Reiss. I don't get the appeal.

[PCN24454]

I think that Rino Romano was a great voice for Batman. Whenever I picture Batman talking, his voice is always the first that goes through my mind.

[superduperman]

Kevin Conroy and Mark Hamil have been past their primes as Bats and Joker for a few years now.

And related to that but the DCAU shouldn't be held up as the end all/be all of DC adaptations. It had just as many poor characterizations as the DCEU under Snyder did.

The DCAU was always a Batman universe first and foremost and everyone else were his sidekicks. Everyone else got nerfed for him. Kevin Conroy has a great Batman voice but he's not immortal. At some point they are going to have to replace him. Having him be THE voice of Batman creates problems down the line when they need to replace him because whoever comes after him will always be compared to him. Fairly or not.

[Timber Wolf-By-Night]

Okay, I'm not gonna lie that's cringe, but awesome.

No, it was just cringe with a side order of dumb.

[manwhohaseverything]

No, it was just cringe with a side order of dumb.

Heh! It's enough dumb to be fun. Better than what wb does with the character in general.Cough!cough!hasn't made a good quality Superman adaptation. Ever.

[lemonpeace]

considering how his bibliography is exclusively white or occasionally black led, I think Christopher Priest's idea of avoiding writing any book led by heroes of color because he doesn't want to be considered a "black writer" is flawed post-racial nonsense that would've been called out if a white writer said it. his reasoning is that he feels like they are inferior characters for his pay grade, but considering is track record of almost exclusively black or white characters it shows that what he really wants to be is a "white writer" because that's what he thinks a "writer" is. i mean, there are other races and ethnic groups to explore other than black and white if he wants to be a considered a writer who writers everyone, are there not? I'm not saying he can't write what he wants (he wanna write only white characters then, hey, follow your heart and get your money black man, I guess) nor that he won't change his mind one day but I find the logic of his decision is flawed and problematic.

[chief12d]

considering how his bibliography is exclusively white or occasionally black led, I think Christopher Priest's idea of avoiding writing any book led by heroes of color because he doesn't want to be considered a "black writer" is flawed post-racial nonsense that would've been called out if a white writer said it. his reasoning is that he feels like they are inferior characters for his pay grade, but considering is track record of almost exclusively black or white characters it shows that what he really wants to be is a "white writer" because that's what he thinks a "writer" is. i mean, there are other races and ethnic groups to explore other than black and white if he wants to be a considered a writer who writers everyone, are there not? I'm not saying he can't write what he wants (he wanna write only white characters then, hey, follow your heart and get your money black man, I guess) nor that he won't change his mind one day but I find the logic of his decision is flawed and problematic.

In fairness to Priest, I think it was a matter of constantly being pushed toward C-D list characters when he feels he should be writing A-B listers (almost all of which are white). For him it's about knowing his worth and feeling he gets pigeonholed with black characters lacking in any prestige. His initial opposition to writing Black Panther for example, came from the fact that prior to completely reinventing character, he was a nondescript and frankly irrelevant player on the Avengers that he was clearly only given because he was a black writer.

After enough times being offered the black characters that have no real profile or preexisting worth I understand (though disagree with) his opposition to writing a black-led book. If he feels he could write Superman, why would he take on Blue Marvel? If he feels he could deliver one of the best Wonder Woman runs of all time, why settle for Vixen? Sure, they're all cool characters. But we know which ones are going to get more attention and have more to work with. The notion that no matter how talented he is he could never write the top tier characters (again, almost all of whom are white) has got to be grating on his ego.

[skyvolt2000]

considering how his bibliography is exclusively white or occasionally black led, I think Christopher Priest's idea of avoiding writing any book led by heroes of color because he doesn't want to be considered a "black writer" is flawed post-racial nonsense that would've been called out if a white writer said it. his reasoning is that he feels like they are inferior characters for his pay grade, but considering is track record of almost exclusively black or white characters it shows that what he really wants to be is a "white writer" because that's what he thinks a "writer" is. i mean, there are other races and ethnic groups to explore other than black and white if he wants to be a considered a writer who writers everyone, are there not? I'm not saying he can't write what he wants (he wanna write only white characters then, hey, follow your heart and get your money black man, I guess) nor that he won't change his mind one day but I find the logic of his decision is flawed and problematic.

Priest's issue and same with McDuffie's is their resumes say they should be able to PICK whoever they want to write. Yet they were never asked.

Folks forget Priest did Hal Jordan in Action Comics, Triumph, The Ray, Conan and way more white lead books than black lead. Many of whom are NOT in trades. Deahstroke might be the only one whose complete run is in trade.

Meanwhile his runs on Luke Cage, Black Panther & Steel are noted. All three were the longest runs for each of them and he ended all three books.

Remember he does use POC in his books.

I think the issue is "don't tell me I have to have a immaculate resume to write a Batman or Icon type person. While I see OTHERS NOT doing that and getting those gigs."
Especially BAD WHITE writers.

You can't say you are looking for the best when you are not for whatever reason.

[phantom1592]

And the DCAU wasn’t perfect like a lot of the fanboys act like it is. A lot of characters were straight up butchered for simplicity (cough cough Sinestro)!

In what way with Sinestro?

[Agent Z]

. his reasoning is that he feels like they are inferior characters for his pay grade,

When did he ever say this?

but considering is track record of almost exclusively black or white characters it shows that what he really wants to be is a "white writer" because that's what he thinks a "writer" is. i mean, there are other races and ethnic groups to explore other than black and white if he wants to be a considered a writer who writers everyone, are there not?

I'm pretty sure he's said something to the effect of "Don't tell me I shouldn't be allowed to write a Chinese female character" or something like that. He wrote Deathstroke and one of the characters in his run was a half-Cambodian girl.

[OopsIdiditagain]

When did he ever say this?




I'm pretty sure he's said something to the effect of "Don't tell me I shouldn't be allowed to write a Chinese female character" or something like that. He wrote Deathstroke and one of the characters in his run was a half-Cambodian girl.

He went deep into Rose's Hmong heritage. He also gave her an Asian love interest who was a part of the main cast but fans kept complaining about it.

[9th.]

'Superman turns evil' is a very boring story that should stop being told.

[J. D. Guy]

considering how his bibliography is exclusively white or occasionally black led, I think Christopher Priest's idea of avoiding writing any book led by heroes of color because he doesn't want to be considered a "black writer" is flawed post-racial nonsense that would've been called out if a white writer said it. his reasoning is that he feels like they are inferior characters for his pay grade, but considering is track record of almost exclusively black or white characters it shows that what he really wants to be is a "white writer" because that's what he thinks a "writer" is. i mean, there are other races and ethnic groups to explore other than black and white if he wants to be a considered a writer who writers everyone, are there not? I'm not saying he can't write what he wants (he wanna write only white characters then, hey, follow your heart and get your money black man, I guess) nor that he won't change his mind one day but I find the logic of his decision is flawed and problematic.

Being absolutely honest, I have always had nagging feelings of discomfort in the back of my mind whenever I hear about Christopher Priest's desire not be "typecast as a Black writer". But it's hard to articulate why and express my frustrations over it and over the people who are far too quick to defend his words without examining the implications and connotations behind them.

I feel this post articulates most of my discomfort with the whole thing excellently.

While ideally and generally, wanting to write without being narrowed into only writing certain things seems to be completely natural. Why write what doesn't speak to you? But the thing is, it isn't as straightforward as that. After all, Priest is a Black man; like it or not, the world we live carries complexities for people of color that intersect in everything. Priest is also very famous within his role as comic writer. While it isn't universal adoration, it's never too hard to find praise for a work he's written or to see anticipation and hype for works he's slated to write or could potentially write. This confers a sense of brand clout.

Yet with his respectably (within whatever margins this falls in, of course) well-off position to his name-as-brand, Priest expresses outwardly that he "doesn't want to be typecast as a 'Black writer'". That already feels worrisome. Then you factor in lemonpeace's insight that his comic bibliography contains mostly White-led and some Black-led books. Sometimes it feels like his Black Panther tenure was his only Black-led book of note under his name (and I know he helped with the Catalyst Prime one-shot opener, but I don't think it went much further than that, and the Catalyst Prime Universe is more diverse than just Black, including said opener). And even then you realize that the viewpoint character of Priest's tenure was in fact the very White Everett Ross that Priest constructed for said tenure. As lemonpeace points out, if his worry is not wishing to be typecast as a "Black writer", there are many other racial and ethnic perspectives to educate oneself about and write from. Other than just White, which seems to be his actual preference. Again, the breeds worrisome feelings.

Taking the above into account, that many are so quick to want to defend his words, once more, sans looking deeper into the connotations of the intersecting context, can be equally frustrating to fathom. Priest wants to avoid being typecast and to write the variety he wishes, which translates into wanting to predominately write about White characters, with many readers and fans more than willing to sing his praises for such a choice.

That's one of the reasons I'm not as gung-ho about Christopher Priest as a writer like so many other people seem to be. (Another is that his writing style is rather cynical and pessimistic-minded. His preferred structure to storytelling also tends to towards being confusing and sometimes coming off as convoluted, which can easily make his works hard to follow serially. Priest is very fond of writing In Medias Res and having Four Lines, All Waiting.)

[skyvolt2000]

Yet with his respectably (within whatever margins this falls in, of course) well-off position to his name-as-brand, Priest expresses outwardly that he "doesn't want to be typecast as a 'Black writer'". That already feels worrisome.

I think there is a fear of being the DEFAULT black writer.

Where and we have seen this especially from the Gators-have zero issue with him being on a book while being OPENLY hostile towards others. In many cases for them just existing like we have seen towards Vita, Kwanza, Hudlin, Bryan Hill, Shawn Martinbough, Rodney Barnes, Brandon Eaton, Brandon Thomas and Jamal Igle. And that is not even mentioning how black woman have gotten the brush off (Far Sector the exception).

Where as Priest automatically gets offered the black character way more than anyone not named McDuffie. It's not by accident that very few POC who held solo titles at DC had a writer of the same race with the exception of Baby Doomsday, Silencer, Sideways, Jaime Reyes, Kyle, Simon and Jessica Cruz.

It's not by accident the number of black writers of Batman, Superman, WW, Hal & Barry can be counted on ONE hand.

If they keep coming to you-who else gets a shot?

We have no issue having white writers write about US-why can't it be the same in reverse?

Milestone for all that praise-only had 3 black writers. McDuffie, Robert Washington and another guy whose name I can begin to type without looking at it. Matt Wayne's name is on a LOT of stuff (except for Static).