Jean Grey: Marvel Girl, Phoenix Appreciation 2018

[Marvelboy1974]

w, Jean does look amazing in pink

[PsychoEFrost]

i also cant see Emma working with Jean. Emma simply hates Jean. She seduced Scott because she hated Jean. that is too much

Emma seduced Scott because Emma had a crush on Scott, full stop. The hate for Jean didn't pop up until after their affair was known, and Jean tore her apart for it.

Acting like Scott suddenly stopped loving Jean does a grave disservice to both characters. Emma is overwhelmingly most to blame in the affair considering Scott was suffering from PTSD at the time.

[Disciple of Redd]

I posted this in the Uncanny thread but I figured I put it here since its more relevant. What do people think of the idea of Jean and Quicksilver as a couple



Unexpected and not one I would immediately go to, but it could be fun. Son of an enemy she's opposed, brother of her best friend. (Im ignoring the retcon and I believe Marvel might undo it). He's definitely not boring and has a dynamic personality. He has alot that he could learn from her and he might be able to challenge her and support her pushing towards her potential bc he doesnt have that connection to Phoenix that's limited Jean when it came to Scott in the past. I think I like the idea of her with someone more morally grey and not a goody goody and he'd be completely new

Not sure where you get the "brother of her best friend" thing but I wouldn't be bothered by such a ship.

It'd be something new and different, which she desperately needs, whether that was Pietro or someone else.

I'm trying to think of X-dudes to connect her to that wouldn't be too gross in terms of how they relate to the other characters.

I love the idea of Jean/Logan, but besides him, I'm looking at Bishop.

Bishop doesn't really have meaningful connections anywhere so the pairing wouldn't be too trashy. There's not a ton of history so they would be building something super new. Also, the pairing would be...how should I say...progressive in a way that would tick off some people, which woild be fun.

I just looked and there are not a lot of prominent X-dudes that aren't kinda involved with someone.

[PowerPlay25]

So many of the X-Men have such preconceived notions of Jean. I feel like that would limit the pairing's ability to evolve. It's why I usually picture Jean looking outside of the X-World in terms of romance. Maybe, Sunspot, he has a sense of command and authority. But as has been said, X-Related Bachelors are limited. For some reason my instinct is "no" when I think of Pietro. I have nothing against the character, I just don't think I could see it, though I would certainly keep an open mind if Rosenberg or Taylor decided to give it a shot.

I still say Steve Rogers, Johnny Storm, Frank Castle, Stephen Strange or Clint Barton, would all be suitable love interest that would lend themselves to golden storyline opportunities.

[jollygoldfish]

I love that Jean is front and center, but I do believe the notion that she's beyond others in ability to lead is kinda corny.

A bunch of them could lead the X-Men just fine. That's part of what makes me roll my eyes at the HCT scenario.

At roughly 10 years in canonically, any of the major older veterans should be able to give their spin on leadership of the X-Men.

Yes there are other X-Men who could lead but Jean hasn't had the chance yet. Xavier wanted to leave the school to her but she was killed off before he could. I'm glad she's being given this chance. Also, Jean's the one with the vision at the moment. That's key to good leadership - clear direction. She's definitely a better leader than Kitty.

that might be an assumption bc she's a HUGE Emma fan. I dont think anyone has anything to really worry about though. Even if she doesnt like Jean, Marvel is pushing her. Kelly isnt lead writer and has 2 other co-writers to act as a checks and balance so she cant do anything awful with Jean.

So, yes, I can understand people being apprehensive of a flagship writer expressing her favor for Scemma and neutrality about Jean. It's a knee-jerk reaction that we need to work on, lol

Very happy that most probably Rosenberg is being handed the reigns to the franchise and not KT for the reasons stated above.

I posted this in the Uncanny thread but I figured I put it here since its more relevant. What do people think of the idea of Jean and Quicksilver as a couple

Is this picture from the issue where Jean makes a huge breakfast for all the X-Men and they have team breakfast? Miss those days.

Quicksilver's OTP is his mirror. And his new pet turtle. Maybe Mr. Dibbles will teach him about responsibility and caring for something. For now, I'm lowkey rooting for Jean/Johnny Storm or Jean/Cap.

[phoenixzero23]

So many of the X-Men have such preconceived notions of Jean. I feel like that would limit the pairing's ability to evolve. It's why I usually picture Jean looking outside of the X-World in terms of romance. Maybe, Sunspot, he has a sense of command and authority. But as has been said, X-Related Bachelors are limited. For some reason my instinct is "no" when I think of Pietro. I have nothing against the character, I just don't think I could see it, though I would certainly keep an open mind if Rosenberg or Taylor decided to give it a shot.

I still say Steve Rogers, Johnny Storm, Frank Castle, Stephen Strange or Clint Barton, would all be suitable love interest that would lend themselves to golden storyline opportunities.

I see the x-men as a family, brothers, sisters, cousins and uncles. Jean/Scott worked for a time because they were originaly conceived as a couple, while for example Beast always had a brotherly relationship with her that's why when marvel pushed the ship it didn't work (even though i like both characters).

I feel like Emma/Scott worked because she sometimes felt like an outsider in the family dynamic. I feel like pairing Jean with a member of the "X-men family" that isn't Scott or Wolverine probably wouldn't work, unless it's someone really unexpected without much other relationships but then it can happen like scott/emma were the relationship defines so many things of the characters it can be problematic.

[jollygoldfish]

I actually think the X-Men's time as the crown jewel of Marvel is over. Even with the new Disney deal and the re-emergence of Marvel's interest in the X-Books. It's why I've been so keen to see Jean forming rapports with other Marvel Heavyweights. Namor and Black Bolt are a wonderful start. Jean's pending involvement in the "Typhoid" crossover is something else I'm looking forward too.

I guess one should never say never but......are the comic book's real sellers anymore. I feel like the majority of the income comes from Movies, Cartoons and maybe Video Games. I feel like the books have been on a steady decline since the early 2000s. I don't know if I see the books selling that well again even IF the books had the perfect storm of writers, artist, team roster and etc.

The below quote from this article here gives me hope that the X-Men will overtake the Avengers in terms of the attention, talent and resource allocated by TPTB.

"The biggest thing here is that CB Cebulski think X-Men are the future of the publishing line and has been fighting to reposition Uncanny X-Men as the premier Marvel book. All of Marvel feel that way. It is just that now they are allowed to do something about it."

I haven't been keeping track of sales figures but how are the DC comics doing? The Avengers? Are numbers for all series going down? I know that other franchises have overtaken the X-men but the potential for the X-books if Marvel pushes them should be baselined against the numbers of the top selling series.

For me it started with Grant Morrison. When he said Jean was based on his Ex-Girlfriend and Emma was based on the woman he ended up with, I thought, "Here Go Hell Come." Then when describing the characters he said Emma is "The ultimate self-made woman." and Jean "tries so hard to be good, she forgets to be human." Something I've never associated with Jean. I just shook my head. Why so many Jean fans hold Morrison's work in such high regard is beyond me.

Emma is "the ultimate self-made woman"...the irony when she was granted leadership by Cyclops by sleeping with him instead of earning it. Jean "tries so hard to be good, she forgets to be human"...again the irony since as a telepath/empath, she's all too aware of her own humanity and that of others.

Grant Morrison intended Jean's ending to be permanent and Joe Queseda was willing to go along with it, a recent interview confirmed Phoenix:Endsong was supposed to be the published goodbye to the Jean Grey character and cementing her replacement by Emma. They burned some character relationships beyond repair (for some readers) and I think even Scott/Jean fans like Rosenberg realize it.

That's awful. What interview was this?

[Havok83]

Not sure where you get the "brother of her best friend" thing but I wouldn't be bothered by such a ship.

It'd be something new and different, which she desperately needs, whether that was Pietro or someone else.

I'm trying to think of X-dudes to connect her to that wouldn't be too gross in terms of how they relate to the other characters.

I was referring to Polaris but I guess I should have said one of her closest/oldest friends. My #1 that isnt Scott would be Warren but that would be a safe choice. I do think it would be intersting to see her with someone no one expects

Quicksilver's OTP is his mirror. And his new pet turtle. Maybe Mr. Dibbles will teach him about responsibility and caring for something. For now, I'm lowkey rooting for Jean/Johnny Storm or Jean/Cap.

Yes, just after Onslaught. Her empathy and ability to comfort everyone is why she is considered the heart of the team and why the family dynamic was lost in her absense

And what you write about Quicksilver is why it would be interesting. He has alot he could learn from Jean and she could help him develop into a better person

[jollygoldfish]

Emma seduced Scott because Emma had a crush on Scott, full stop. The hate for Jean didn't pop up until after their affair was known, and Jean tore her apart for it.

That's not true. She seduced Scott because she thought it would be fun and she could win one over Jean. She welcomed the challenge. Beast even warned her "Jean will kill you" and she brushed it aside. Emma's competitive feelings turned into hate when Jean tore through her mind and then after a full blown complex.

And what you write about Quicksilver is why it would be interesting. He has alot he could learn from Jean and she could help him develop into a better person

Hmm...that sounds like a project more than a partnership. I could see her and like her with Warren but again, that's very safe. If only Grifter were a Marvel property...

[Harpsikord]

I was referring to Polaris but I guess I should have said one of her closest/oldest friends. My #1 that isnt Scott would be Warren but that would be a safe choice. I do think it would be intersting to see her with someone no one expects

First Class also defines Jean and Wanda as being close, and that is canon as well.

[Havok83]

First Class also defines Jean and Wanda as being close, and that is canon as well.

how is First Class canon?

[Harpsikord]

how is First Class canon?

It's considered to be canon in the same vein as Claremont's "Classic X-Men." It exists between the stories that were published in the 1960's (and 70's for Uncanny First Class), but have been "modernized" for the time that they came out. The stuff that happened in those books actually happened.

[JeisonWolf]

I posted this in the Uncanny thread but I figured I put it here since its more relevant. What do people think of the idea of Jean and Quicksilver as a couple



Unexpected and not one I would immediately go to, but it could be fun. Son of an enemy she's opposed, brother of her best friend. (Im ignoring the retcon and I believe Marvel might undo it). He's definitely not boring and has a dynamic personality. He has alot that he could learn from her and he might be able to challenge her and support her pushing towards her potential bc he doesnt have that connection to Phoenix that's limited Jean when it came to Scott in the past. I think I like the idea of her with someone more morally grey and not a goody goody and he'd be completely new

I think it would be interesting, also Scott has gone out with Wanda in some AUs, so Jean and Pietro would not be all bad.

As couples for Jean, I would like Warren a lot. I think Jean and Warren have much more in common than Jean and Logan. Anyway, if they want Jean's next relationship to work even after Scott's return, Jean must date some one X-men. Couples who are not in the same team or book last very little. for example, teen Bobby and the Inhuman boy with whom he dating, if I'm not mistaken in X-men Blue it was said that they broke or something.

[ExodusCloak]

It's considered to be canon in the same vein as Claremont's "Classic X-Men." It exists between the stories that were published in the 1960's (and 70's for Uncanny First Class), but have been "modernized" for the time that they came out. The stuff that happened in those books actually happened.

It's not canon. I think the only canon one is Wolverine first class because the writer stated it was canon. I know the first xmem first class was definitely stated not to be canon by the writer.

[Harpsikord]

It's not canon. I think the only canon one is Wolverine first class because the writer stated it was canon. I know the first xmem first class was definitely stated not to be canon by the writer.

Oh, that's my bad then! I thought I read something that was stated to be the opposite.

... I'm not going to lie, it probably should be. It added some much needed charm to the original five's time as the only X-Men that was sorely lacking. And did it better than Bendis did.